Statistic of the Day

[Lizard]

Who do you regard as Tier 1? You're lucky I have some time to kill in the Koru lounge!

Southern Hemisphere plus 6 Nations minus Scotland and Italy.

(Scotland on a recent up-trend, yet to fully convince of their staying power.)

England, eh? Ever wonder what an All Blacks vs Romania test match would look like? Would that even BE a test match? Seems unlikely to happen. Maybe in a future RWC ...

I went to NZ v Romania at RWC2007. Score was 85-8. We also won 14-6 in Bucharest in 1981

[scuzzaman]

I went to NZ v Romania at RWC2007. Score was 85-8. We also won 14-6 in Bucharest in 1981

Huh - I have no memory of that game.

[Lizard]

NZ have held the Bledisloe Cup since 2003. Our record in dead-rubbers since then is 9 wins, 1 draw and 3 losses from 13 matches.

Losses: 2004*, 2010**, 2011*

Wins: 2005*, 2006, 2008**, 2x 2009**, 2010**, 2013, 2014, 2016

Draws: 2012

There were no dead matches in 2007 or 2015, when Aust won the first of a 2-test series. Every other year the All Blacks have had the Cup in the bag before hitting the turf for the last game - or even the second to last games in 2009 and 2010, thanks to the ridiculous 4-match format.

*2 match series
**4 match series

[Lizard]

Warren Gatland has, rightly, thrown his toys out of the Lion’s cot after some silly comments by certain players saying that different coaching could have resulted in a 3-0 series win. The Lions have never won even 2 in a row against New Zealand, whether in the same tour or across two.

Here’s a list of teams with 3 or more consecutive wins over the All Blacks. An asterisk indicates achieving this in a single season. Streaks are all of 3 wins unless indicated. The list includes all opposition with at least 3 wins total over New Zealand.

Wallabies (5 streaks in 160 matches): 2000-2001, 1998*, 1991-92, 1978-1980, 1929*
Springboks (3 in 95 matches): 2009*, 1970-76, 1937-1949 (6 in a row) – 95 matches total
France (1 in 57): 1994-95
Wales (0 in 33): never
England (0 in 40): never
Lions (0 in 41): never

If you include matches capped against non-capped NZ sides (including the NZ Cavaliers and NSW v NZ XV/NZ Maori games retrospectively capped by Australia) you can add/modify as follows:

Australia (6 in 200 matches): adding 1949 (including 1 v NZ Maori), modifying 1929-31 (4 matches, including 1 v NZ Maori), adding 1922-23 (5 matches, 2x NSW v NZ XV, 3x v NZ Maori)
SA (3 in 99): no change
France (1 in 58): no change
Tonga (1 in 17 matches): 1960-1973 (all v NZ Maori)
Fiji (0 in 39 matches): never
Wales (0 in 35): no change
England (0 in 41): no change

[Lizard]

I haven't forgotten about finishing the annual try tally series but not today.

Here are the midfield combinations used this year by the All Blacks (listed as 12/13/sub, italicized player came off)

Samoa: SBW/ALB/X
Lions 1: SBW/Crotty/ALB
Lions 2: SBW/ALB/Laumape*
Lions 3: Laumape/ALB/Fekitoa
Aust 1: SBW/Crotty/ALB
Aust 2: SBW/Crotty/ALB**
Arg 1: SBW/ALB/Laumape
SA 1: SBW/Crotty/ALB
Arg 2: SBW/ALB/Laumape
SA 2: Crotty/SBW/X

So most common starting pairs:
5: SBW/Crotty (including once as Crotty/SBW)
4: SBW/ALB
1: Laumape/ALB

SBW has started every game except when suspended, but has been subbed off in 5 of his 9 games. Crotty has always started whenever fit (IIRC). ALB is clearly the preferred back-up, followed by Laumape.



*SBW was red-carded in the 24th minute. Laumape technically came on for Kaino
**Crotty was temporarily replaced by ALB for 27th-39th minute. ALB permanently replaced SBW 62nd minute.

[rowan]

England has won 7 of 40 tests against the All Blacks
Lions have won 7 out of 41. Wow, almost identitical

[rowan]

Birth places by nation at 2015 World Cup:

NZ 68
England 45
South Africa 45
Australia 39
Argentina 36
Fiji 34
Georgia 31
Uruguay 30
Namibia 29
Romania 27
Ireland 26
Tonga 25
Canada 25
USA 23
Italy 22
France 21
Scotland 20
Japan 20
Wales 19
Samoa 18
Zimbabwe 4
Spain 2
Nigeria 1
PNG 1
Russia 1
Saudi Arabia 1
American Samoa 1
Israel 1
Belgium 1
Burkina Faso 1
Cote d’Ivoire 1
DR Congo 1
Algeria 1
Netherlands 1

[Lizard]

NZ v Barbarians
The All Blacks had toured Great Britain & Ireland (or parts thereof) 3 times before first playing the Barbarians. The fixture was part of the schedule for the next 6 tours from 1953-1978. It was dropped for the 3 tours from 1979-1983, and has been played sporadically since 1989.

1954: 19-5, Cardiff. Match 28 of 31 on tour (after tests v Home Nations, before French test)*
1964: 36-3, Cardiff. Match 34 of 36 (last match in Europe, after tests v Home Nations & France, followed by 2 matches in Vancouver)**
1967: 11-6, London. Match 17 of 17 (after tests v Eng, Wal, Fra, Sco)
1973: 11-23, Cardiff. Match 28 of 32 (after tests v Home Nations, before losing to France) ***
1974: 13-13, London. Match 8 of 8 (after test v Ireland)****
1978: 18-16, Cardiff. Match 18 of 18 (after Grand Slam v Home Nations)*****
1989: 21-10, London. Match 14 of 14 (after tests v Wales & Ireland)
1993: 25-12, Cardiff. Match 13 of 13 (after tests v Scotland & England)
2004: 47-19, London. Match 4 of 4 (after tests v Italy, Wales & France)
2009: 18-25, London. Match 6 of 6 (after tests v Scotland & England)******

Overall: Played 10, won 7, lost 2, drawn 1

NZ also played a French Barbarian side on at least their 1981, 1990, 1995 tours.

*This was the tour during which Wales most recently beat the All Blacks, denying them a Grand Slam
** The tour on which NZ lost to Newport and drew 0-0 with Scotland, and were thus denied a Grand Slam
*** The tour on which NZ drew with Ireland (still it’s 2nd best result v NZ), and were thus denied a Grand Slam. NZ also lost to Llanelli, NW Counties, Midland Counties (West) & France
****Weird tour this one. It was part of IRFU’s centenary so they played 6 matches in Ireland (4 provinces, Universities and a test), a full-strength but uncapped Wales XV, and the Baabaas. It was the first time NZ had played fewer than 4 tests or 15 matches on tours to GB&I. Given Wales’ proclivity for capping all sorts of Fake Tests, it’s odd they skipped this one; perhaps it was because it was played on a Wednesday? The Baabaas were virtually the 1974 Lions rebadged
***** The tour on which NZ lost to Munster
******The only time the Barbarians have been the only team to beat NZ on a tour

[rowan]

Not remotely as farcical as league's "World" Cup, but this is not a good sign:

The amount of foreign-born players increases yet again for Autumn internationals

The hot topic of debate regarding player eligibility is to be looked at again. In this piece, RUCK takes an in-depth look at the foreign-born players in each of the home nations Autumn Internationals squad for 2017.

All told, the squads will have a grand total of 14 nations represented, including Canada, Fiji, the Philippines and the USA.

The Celtic nations each have players born in England. In total 20 English players will play for other countries in the tournament. The next highest producers, by birth, are New Zealand and South Africa who have nine and five respectively.

This means there has been another gradual increase with 43 players swapping countries, up from 41 earlier this year for the Six nations.

https://www.ruck.co.uk/amount-foreign-b ... nationals/

[Lizard]

Despite a comfortable win, Australia shipped a record high of 30 points to Japan. Their defensive coach shouldn't be too ashamed though, even NZ teams have conceded 30+ in tests against the Brave Blossoms:

Number of times teams from each country have conceded 30+ to Japan in tests:*
Korea: 23
HK: 18
Canada: 9 (Canada 7, BC Bears 2)
Kazakhstan: 5
Russia: 4
Samoa: 4
Taipei: 4
USA: 4
Arabian Gulf: 3
NZ: 3 (NZ Universities 2, Junior All Blacks 1)
Romania: 3
Spain: 3
Sri Lanka: 3
UAE: 3
Argentina: 2
Fiji: 2
Philippines: 2
Tonga: 2
Uruguay: 2
Wales: 2
Australia: 1
Georgia: 1
Singapore: 1
South Africa: 1
Thailand: 1
Zimbabwe: 1

From Japan’s POV, regardless of whether oppo were capped.

[cashead]

Japan also boast a better winning rate against the Springboks than anyone else as well.

[scuzzaman]

Japan also boast a better winning rate against the Springboks than anyone else as well.

Good point.

Given the bok's woes, it may be some time before that win rate drops.

[rowan]

I'm still amazed the SARFU hasn't set up a test match with the Blossoms since then. It's like the Lions never playing Fiji again after losing to them in 77. Are they running scared or what?

[scuzzaman]

Maybe they should be.

Dire performance yesterday from the Boks.

[Lizard]

This weekend, England will be looking for their record-equalling 5th consecutive win against Australia.

5+ wins in a row v Australia
10 matches: New Zealand (2008-10)
9: NZ (1936-47)
7: SA (1953-61), SA (1969-71), NZ (1967-74), NZ (1995-97), NZ (2015-17)
6: Lions (1899-1904), Lions (1950-1966)
5: England (2000-03), NZ (2005-06)

Longest winning streaks by opposition v Aust
NZ: 10 (2008-10)
SA: 7 (1953-61, 1969-71)
Lions: 6 (1899-1904, 1950-1966)
Eng: 5 (2000-03)
France: 4 (1948-67)
Ireland: 4 (1958-1968)
Scotland: 3 (1958-1968 1975-82)
Wales: 3 (1969-1975)
Argentina: 1 (1979, 1983, 1987, 1997, 2014)
Fiji: 1 (1952, 1954)
Tonga: 1 (1973)
Samoa: 1 (2011)

[scuzzaman]

Was kind of funny seeing Jones saying England will be better next week, after grinding out a most unimpressive display against Argentina.

(Of course, one could make much the same observation re NZ v. France.)

But it prompts the question: what exactly does he think Australia will be, if not better than Argentina?

(Sorry, not exactly a stats comment, but stimulated by the above stats.)

[rowan]

England v Australia should be the match of the round this weekend. France v South Africa will also be intriguing, if only because the two are in such poor form it'll be interesting to see who manages not to lose. Italy at home to Argentina could be a good match too, while Spain & Germany will fancy their chances of taking a tier 2 scalp when they host battling Canada and the US, respectively.

[Lizard]

NZ’s longest winning streaks for every country against whom they have played:
Wales: 29* (1963- )
Argentina: 23*^ (1987- )
Ireland: 22 (1974-2013)
Scotland: 18*^ (1987- )
Italy: 13*^^ (1987- )
France: 11* (2009- )
Aust: 10 (2008-10)
England: 9 (2004-2010)
SA: 8 (2001-04)
Samoa: 7*^^ (1993- )
Lions: 7 (1977-1993)
Fiji: 5*^^ (1987- )
Canada: 5*^^ (1991- )
Tonga: 5*^^ (1999- )
USA: 3*^^ (1913- )
Japan: 3*^^ (1995- )
Romania: 2*^^ (1981- )
World XV: 2* (1992- )
Pacific Islanders: : 1*^^ (2004- )
Portugal: 1*^^ (2007- )
Georgia: 1*^^ (2015- )
Namibia: 1*^^ (2015- )

*Streak ongoing
^Undefeated but at least 1 draw
^^Undefeated, no draws

[Lizard]

All Blacks November tour miscellany

As I’ve previously noted, the current All Blacks November tour is a weird one.

• >First 3 test tour since 2004*
  >First time ever we’ve played the Barbarians first (usually last or near to it)
  >First tour with 2 non-test matches since 2001 (Ireland A and Scotland A)
  >First time since 2000-2001 we’ve avoided England two tours in a row**
  >Second time since 2000 that we have not played either the 6N champion or runner up (only previous time was 2016)

The modern NH tour really took shape in 2005. In the 10 tours from 2005, we have played:

England 8 times (1 loss)
Wales 8
Ireland 6* (1 loss*)
France 6
Scotland 6
Italy 3
USA 1
Japan 1


*Counting Ire in the USA, 2016 as a tour test
**The only other teams we have avoided twice or more in a row since 2004 are Italy 2004-08 (3 tours - no tour in ’07) and 2013-14 and France 2010-12 (2 tours – no tour in ’11). We played England every year from 2005 to 2014 inclusive.

[Puja]

Why do you say the modern NH tour only started in 2005? There were Autumn Internationals from 2000, weren't there?

Puja

[Lizard]

My view is that 2005 was when the modern pattern began – 4 tests against 4 different European sides (appreciating that in 2006 we played France twice and in 2016 Ireland twice)

I accept that you could argue that regular “Autumn International” tours began in 2000 with our 3-test tour to France (2 tests) and Italy but the pattern wasn’t set immediately.

1997: really the last of the “proper” tours – 4 tests and 5 mid-week games.
1998: no tour
1999: no tour
2000: Fra, Fra, Ita.
2001: a bit of hybrid – 1 tests each v Ireland and Scotland, with mid-weekers v their respective “A” sides, with a diversion on the way home to Buenos Aires for a one-off v Argentina.
2002: modern-style but only 3 tests (Eng, Fra, Wal)
2003: no tour
2004: modern-style but only 3 tests, plus Barbarians.

Australia is about the same:
1997: 5-match, 2-test tour of Argentina, followed by tests v Eng & Sco.
1998: A mind-week v France A then 2 tests (Fra, Eng)
1999: No tour
2000: Japan President’s XV in Tokyo, then modern-style Fra/Sco/Eng tour.
2001: More traditional 7-match tour with tests v Spain (!), Eng, Fra, Wales followed by Baabaas. (Surely the last time Oxford University was on the itinerary of Tier 1 touring side)
2002: Hybrid tour of Arg, ire, Eng & Italy. Tests only.
2003: No tour
2004: 5 match tour, including French Baabaas and tests v Sco x2, Fra, Eng
From 2005: generally 4 tests against 4 6N teams, plus Baabaas but more midweekers than NZ.

[rowan]

Back in the amateur days it was the Boks who would invariably win all their matches in Europe and the All Blacks who could be relied upon to drop one or two.

[Lizard]

Back in the amateur days it was the Boks who would invariably win all their matches in Europe and the All Blacks who could be relied upon to drop one or two.

That would be accurate if you replaced “Back in the amateur days” with “Up until about the 1960s”.

With 4 consecutive Grand Slam tours (1912/13, 1932/32, 1951/52 & 1960/61), SA boasted a success rate of 87% in the NH as of 1961 - 23 tests, 20 wins, 2 draws and just 1 loss, which came in their first NH tour match of all v Scotland in 1906. However, from the next tour it all went to shit for the rest of the amateur era: played 18, won 10, drew 2 and lost 6 (success rate of 56%).

[rowan]

True. Their 4th and final grandslam of the series was actually at the turn of the decade, and then they were rubbish on the next two tours - their last of the pre-World Cup era. They did squeeze in a few more tours right at the end of the amateur era, however - going unbeaten in their last two.

[rowan]

Difficult to say what happened to South Africa in the 1960s after that magnificent tour of Europe at the start of the decade and series win over NZ at home. They had been unbeaten in a series (home or away) throughout the entire first half of the 20th century, in fact, had a whitewash and away series win over the All Blacks to their credit, and had put together that remarkable grandslam of grandslam tours (4 tours, 16 tests). & they were back with a vengeance in the 70s and early 80s as arguably the dominant team in world rugby during most of that period as well. They had some truly great players in the 60s, such as Jan Ellis, Frik du Preez and John Gainsford, to name just a few. But this was also the first decade in which they had faced real anti-Apartheid hostility on tour, no doubt due to the Sharpesville Massacre of 1960, an inexcusable atrocity which made headlines all around the world. Interestingly, given today's mess, this was also a decade of unwelcome government interference in the game in South Africa, together with infighting among the rugby officials themselves, with Dr Danie Craven in the thick of it. Boks' selection began to resemble a turnstile, while a number of top players came to be regarded as 'prima donnas' - Gainsford among them, though he was widely regarded as the best South African center ever (before Danie Gerber came along). Chris Greyvenstein refers to the period 1961 to 1969 as the 'turbulent years' in his book (Springbok Saga). They did, nonetheless, win two series against the Lions, and also ended the decade with a 4-0 whitewash of the Wallabies (following which the ARU broke off ties with them until the post-Apartheid era).