Team for Samoa?

[Banquo]

If Eddie is done with experimenting, has anyone forced their way past Ford/Farrell/Joseph to make him change anything at 10/12/13? T'eo hasn't played. Tuilagi is always injured. Slade and Lozowski have offered a mixed bag without convincing.

Eddie now has to pick a team to win with no base of continuity to work from.

In the forwards, a simple form check might pick front and second rows from strength. Similarly, three from four - Brown, Watson, Daly and May - gives a convincing back unit.

Back-row? Robshaw and Billy to start but who gets the 3rd shirt? If I was picking a team to win at all costs tomorrow I'd not be sure of Underhill or Simmonds.

Dors- I wouldn't get too fixated on knowing exactly the starting 23 for the nearly two years away world cup. You may not like it, but the majority of the squad are pretty much established and settled in EJ's mind, with some strong contenders around the edges; in any case, knowing your 23 now means nothing for the RWC- injuries and imo age will force change- plus talent could easily emerge. Nobody is picking a win at all costs game tomorrow- that's the point of why he is looking at options.

I accept that. However, the 6N is a must-win, IMO. The next time Eddie has the players together it IS to pick his best available 23. Yes, the RWC is not tomorrow but we have to start building a team. At present we have a reasonable group of players with hardly any cohesion. We are butchering chances, not so much because of individual skill-flaws (except for Brown), but because we lack unit-based practice. Nothing looks slick and co-ordinated in attack.

Of course it is; but thats a couple of months away. Who will be fit then?

Quality of ball is the biggest issue we have.

[Oakboy]

I accept that. However, the 6N is a must-win, IMO.

More than normal is that? And either way why?

Because, for good or ill, the 6N is the only competitive tournament that we play in apart from the RWC. Good teams thrive on competitive pressure. I think it is great that Scotland are competitive again. We need to win when it matters, especially in the two 6Ns before the RWC.

[Digby]

I'm not sure any fringe/new player made an unanswerable case for selection over the 3 games.

There's a good few starters who depending on balance haven't made that case over the last 30 games.

Obvious picks right now are Itoje, Billy V, Youngs, Joseph, Daly and Watson, and even some of those might operate in different roles.

[Digby]

I accept that. However, the 6N is a must-win, IMO.

More than normal is that? And either way why?

Because, for good or ill, the 6N is the only competitive tournament that we play in apart from the RWC. Good teams thrive on competitive pressure. I think it is great that Scotland are competitive again. We need to win when it matters, especially in the two 6Ns before the RWC.

Not one side has won the corresponding 6N and gone on to lift the WC. So I don't know it's any more a must win than any next fixture

[Banquo]

I'm not sure any fringe/new player made an unanswerable case for selection over the 3 games.

There's a good few starters who depending on balance haven't made that case over the last 30 games.

Obvious picks right now are Itoje, Billy V, Youngs, Joseph, Daly and Watson, and even some of those might operate in different roles.

Much as i am a big fan of JJ, and he always puts in an excellent shift in, in defence especially, I'm not sure he is an obvious pick to Eddie, especially with the likely players around him.

[Digby]

I'm not sure any fringe/new player made an unanswerable case for selection over the 3 games.

There's a good few starters who depending on balance haven't made that case over the last 30 games.

Obvious picks right now are Itoje, Billy V, Youngs, Joseph, Daly and Watson, and even some of those might operate in different roles.

Much as i am a big fan of JJ, and he always puts in an excellent shift in, in defence especially, I'm not sure he is an obvious pick to Eddie, especially with the likely players around him.

Other than being our best back for a while now JJ will be a 50 cap player come the WC if he keeps playing. So I'd list him as obvious, whilst conceding with Ford and Farrell both being picked he's at risk on the not unreasonable grounds of balance. I'd just have a very different solution on how to bring more power into the backline.

So if I was listing players I think Eddie thought obvious I'd add in Hartley, Cole, Robshaw, Ford, Farrell and remove JJ from the list.

[Banquo]

There's a good few starters who depending on balance haven't made that case over the last 30 games.

Obvious picks right now are Itoje, Billy V, Youngs, Joseph, Daly and Watson, and even some of those might operate in different roles.

Much as i am a big fan of JJ, and he always puts in an excellent shift in, in defence especially, I'm not sure he is an obvious pick to Eddie, especially with the likely players around him.

Other than being our best back for a while now JJ will be a 50 cap player come the WC if he keeps playing. So I'd list him as obvious, whilst conceding with Ford and Farrell both being picked he's at risk on the not unreasonable grounds of balance. I'd just have a very different solution on how to bring more power into the backline.

So if I was listing players I think Eddie thought obvious I'd add in Hartley, Cole, Robshaw, Ford, Farrell and remove JJ from the list.

well who you or I pick is pretty irrelevent tbh. Hence my comment being related to what Eddie will do, and hence saying I was a big fan of JJ.

My solution would be either Teo or Manu into 12, and likely play Roko on the proviso I'd get him off his wing and working in midfield, but as it won't happen I don't know why I've bothered, in the context of this discussion.

[badback]

Anyone got a link for the Samoa game? Normally the full match comes up on Youtube but it doesn't seem to be there this time.

[Danno]

Anyone got a link for the Samoa game? Normally the full match comes up on Youtube but it doesn't seem to be there this time.

Give it another day or two, it usually appears.

[Digby]

Fair enough - I know the intention wasn't to deliberately imply anything, but it's generally a bit of a touchy subject. Making a crack about a gay guy using the Spacey defence can easily be taken as referencing a link between homosexuality and paedophilia which everyone had hoped had gone the fuck away by now. Gay rights groups have worked for decades to get rid of the irrational prejudice that gay == danger to kids and then that prick decides to respond to an accusation that he's groomed 14 year olds with, "Oh by the way I'm gay". Gee thanks Kevin, we'd enjoyed that brief period without Section 28.

So, George Ford - great leader of English Rugby or great leader of World Rugby? Discuss.

Puja

It wasn't remotely an attempt to cite a link between homosexuality and paedophilia, partly I don't think there is one, and I don't see the humour in making the link in this context - though if I thought the context was funny I'd have no issue making the joke.

The comment was directed more at a gay guy (there has to be a tongue twister in this) having been charged as a homophobe in humour, perhaps bad humour, noting in reply they're bi. That's why I'd equate it to the Spacey defence, in that it doesn't apologise or seek context for the comments but simply notes 'I'm bi' as though that's a defence.

Edit - And George Ford is a moderate leader, maybe an Ed Milliband of World Rugby

[Mellsblue]

The comment was directed more at a gay guy (there has to be a tongue twister in this)

I’ve heard many a disparaging euphemism for gay blokes but ‘tongue twister’ is a new one for me.

[Digby]

The comment was directed more at a gay guy (there has to be a tongue twister in this)

I’ve heard many a disparaging euphemism for gay blokes but ‘tongue twister’ is a new one for me.

Not sure I can see why it's only gay blokes who'd enjoy a twisting tongue. Whereas speaking with forked tongue is left for Tom Wood, though if asked he's still ready to accept the captaincy

[Puja]

Edit - And George Ford is a moderate leader, maybe an Ed Milliband of World Rugby

First you say he's only a moderate leader then you compare him to Ed Milliband. Make up your mind!

Whereas speaking with forked tongue is left for Tom Wood, though if asked he's still ready to accept the captaincy

I think he's still ready to accept the captaincy even if no-one asks. Semper paratus!

Puja

[Mellsblue]

Edit - And George Ford is a moderate leader, maybe an Ed Milliband of World Rugby

First you say he's only a moderate leader then you compare him to Ed Milliband. Make up your mind!

Puja

Ford will be livid when he loses the selection hearing and the newest flyhalf steals some of his playbook.

[Which Tyler]

I'd heard that, in the absence of any stand-out performances in the England vs Samoa match, Tom Wood did volunteer himself to begrudgingly accept the MotM award.

[Mellsblue]

I'd heard that, in the absence of any stand-out performances in the England vs Samoa match, Tom Wood did volunteer himself to begrudgingly accept the MotM award.

Damn you. This made me spit tea across my desk.

[Puja]

Edit - And George Ford is a moderate leader, maybe an Ed Milliband of World Rugby

First you say he's only a moderate leader then you compare him to Ed Milliband. Make up your mind!

Puja

Ford will be livid when he loses the selection hearing and the newest flyhalf steals some of his playbook.

I think we can expect a Ryan Lamb recall then - an old stager that most people had given up on, in a similar vein to Ford but with alarming vulnerabilities, yet is still doing well against all expectation.

Mind, for that analogy to hold up, the ABs would have to select Stuart Barnes as their fly-half.

Puja

[Puja]

I'd heard that, in the absence of any stand-out performances in the England vs Samoa match, Tom Wood did volunteer himself to begrudgingly accept the MotM award.

James Haskell would have liked this post, but he was beaten to it by Wood. #leadership

Puja

[kk67]

In the background the rugby cognoscenti are thinking.....

No one gives a toss what those old farts think. Modern Rugby started in 2013 when SA played NZ and Nigel reffed them.