ABs versus Springboks

[J Dory]

ABs team announced:

15. Jordie Barrett
14. Ben Smith
13. Anton Lienert-Brown
12. Ryan Crotty
11. Rieko Ioane
10. Beauden Barrett
9. Aaron Smith
8. Kieran Read
7. Sam Cane
6. Liam Squire
5. Scott Barrett
4. Sam Whitelock
3. Owen Franks
2. Codie Taylor
1. Karl Tu'inukuafe

Reserves: Liam Coltman, Tim Perry, Ofa Tuungafasi, Patrick Tuipulotu, Ardie Savea, TJ Perenara, Sonny Bill Williams, Damian McKenzie.

[morepork]

Crotty shouldn't be playing. One more concussion and we're in brain damage territory.

[J Dory]

It's not like we're short of options in the mid-field right now either. Hopefully the ABs management/medical staff and Crotty himself are doing what's right for Crotty.

[paddy no 11]

Why not give him a break till November etc, it's not like they don't know what he's capable of at this stage!

[zer0]

Where the f*ck is Goodhue?!

[Spy]

Crotty shouldn't be playing. One more concussion and we're in brain damage territory.

Yep. He needs to knock the rugby on the head, badum tish. Seriously, though, he should stop playing.

Where the f*ck is Goodhue?!

On the bench now. SBW out.https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/a ... d=12124451 Not a bad idea to rest a young guy anyway.

Nathan Harris: injured or dropped?

[Lizard]

It’s alright. Ma’a is Back.

http://nzh.tw/12124617

[Mikey Brown]

Crotty shouldn't be playing. One more concussion and we're in brain damage territory.

Aye. Wasn’t not expecting to see him there.

[cashead]

My my my, looks like we have a game on our hands, lads.

[Spy]

That was a really good passage of play by South Africa.

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[Spy]

Jesus Barrett. When his kicking is off, it's well off.

[Spy]

Wow. Well done South Africa. Hell of an effort to hold on through the last half hour of that match.

Astonishing result, really. Especially from 12-0 down.

[I R Geech]

Any other team would have set for the drop goal, and from that position, most likely pinched it. Self belief can be both a blessing and a curse. Love that they went for it, but not sure there was much clear thinking going on.

[zer0]

FFS should've just kicked the doddle of a drop goal from the final scrum instead of needlessly gambling for a try. I'd say Read's lack of tactical smarts was shown up again when the pressure is on and 'just express yourself', or individual brilliance, doesn't work.

Ditto the selection policy of doubling down on all the enigmatic play makers at the expense of more boringly methodical field generals.

[Spy]

Any other team would have set for the drop goal, and from that position, most likely pinched it. Self belief can be both a blessing and a curse. Love that they went for it, but not sure there was much clear thinking going on.

The trouble with drop goals at that stage of the game is that it's all or nothing. Miss and it's all over. Barrett's never kicked a Test drop goal, and his place kicking was awful tonight. I think the better bet was probably to go for the try or a penalty. It's a skill we in NZ should pay more attention to, I agree.

[cashead]

Oh here we go again, I look forward to the endless series of posts where the All Blacks will win by 20+, but that doesn't matter because the points weren't all scored entirely by drop goals. We went through this same bullshit back in 2009.

[zer0]

Trailing by two with a minute to go and not taking the simple drop goal off a stable scrum, at point blank range, is the height of either hubris or incompetence. Take your pick.

[morepork]

You know, I have a few niggling doubts about Read's leadership at times like this.

[paddy no 11]

Great test, brilliant tackle from whitely

not a good night for the barretts

[Spiffy]

Why not do the bleedin obvious - give the goal kicking duties to someone else and just let Barrett get on with being a brilliant attacking 10, free of that responsibility.

[canta_brian]

Why not do the bleedin obvious - give the goal kicking duties to someone else and just let Barrett get on with being a brilliant attacking 10, free of that responsibility.

Yep, of all the "innovations" that coaches seem to come up with, it seems hard to believe that giving the kicking duties to the best kicker on the team regardless of position has always seemed so alien.

[cashead]

Why not do the bleedin obvious - give the goal kicking duties to someone else and just let Barrett get on with being a brilliant attacking 10, free of that responsibility.

Yep, of all the "innovations" that coaches seem to come up with, it seems hard to believe that giving the kicking duties to the best kicker on the team regardless of position has always seemed so alien.

If I had to guess, it's because out of the recognised kickers, Beauden Barrett is the only nailed on, definite starter. McKenzie is a super-sub, Mo'unga is still the 3rd choice 10 and Jordie is starting often, but the back three quarters roles are still in a state of flux outside of Ben Smith being either at 15 or 14.

Midfield is the area where you could potentially put Jordie as the goalkicker, since he prefers 12 anyway, but I'm still not sure about him as a defender (need to see more, tbh), and all four of Laumape, Crotty, ALB and Goodhue have earned their keep.

[Guest]

[quote="cashead"][quote="canta_brian"][quote="Spiffy"]Why not do the bleedin obvious - give the goal kicking duties to someone else and just let Barrett get on with being a brilliant attacking 10, free of that responsibility.[/quote]Yep, of all the "innovations" that coaches seem to come up with, it seems hard to believe that giving the kicking duties to the best kicker on the team regardless of position has always seemed so alien.[/quote]
If I had to guess, it's because out of the recognised kickers, Beauden Barrett is the only nailed on, definite starter. McKenzie is a super-sub, Mo'unga is still the 3rd choice 10 and Jordie is starting often, but the back three quarters roles are still in a state of flux outside of Ben Smith being either at 15 or 14.[/quote]More a general comment Cas. Have we consistently selected a kicker outside 10 since Allan hewson?

[canta_brian]

Why not do the bleedin obvious - give the goal kicking duties to someone else and just let Barrett get on with being a brilliant attacking 10, free of that responsibility.

Yep, of all the "innovations" that coaches seem to come up with, it seems hard to believe that giving the kicking duties to the best kicker on the team regardless of position has always seemed so alien.

If I had to guess, it's because out of the recognised kickers, Beauden Barrett is the only nailed on, definite starter. McKenzie is a super-sub, Mo'unga is still the 3rd choice 10 and Jordie is starting often, but the back three quarters roles are still in a state of flux outside of Ben Smith being either at 15 or 14.

More a general comment Cas. Have we consistently selected a kicker outside 10 since Allan hewson?

[cashead]

Yep, of all the "innovations" that coaches seem to come up with, it seems hard to believe that giving the kicking duties to the best kicker on the team regardless of position has always seemed so alien.

If I had to guess, it's because out of the recognised kickers, Beauden Barrett is the only nailed on, definite starter. McKenzie is a super-sub, Mo'unga is still the 3rd choice 10 and Jordie is starting often, but the back three quarters roles are still in a state of flux outside of Ben Smith being either at 15 or 14.

More a general comment Cas. Have we consistently selected a kicker outside 10 since Allan hewson?

Weepu was the first-choice kicker during the knock-out stages of the 2011 RWC, but only after Carter and Slade were both ruled out of that tournament. He sort of stood out as a goal-kicking halfback, which may be common in France, but very rare here. The only other one I can think of is another Hurricanes halfback, Jon Preston.

Prior to that, Dan Carter back in 2004, when he was the starting 12, with Spencer at 10. Ironic, considering that he'd end up becoming the 10 for the All Blacks, and play more tests there than just about any other All Black first-five.

Other than that, there have been 3 occasions since 2014 in which a non-10 took a kick at goal during the game, probably because the starting 10 needed a break, or wasn't available to kick it at that specific moment.

Aaron Smith has a test conversion to his name in the 2014 Blediesloe test at Eden Park where the ABs put 51 points on the Wallabies.

In November of the same year, Colin Slade scored a conversion and penalty goal against Scotland at Murrayfield where he started at 14 (although presumably after Carter left the field for Julian Savea, who was coming off the bench, so I'm not 100% sure this one really counts).

Israel Dagg scored a penalty goal against Argentina in the Tron in the 2016 Rugby Championship, in a test where he started at 14.