indeed...though I'm amazed that Barnes is remotely a Faz fan. He could hardly bear to be nice about Johnny, and faz is johnny-lite minus minus.Digby wrote:Given all of those I'd imagine Barnes had to stay seated a while after everyone else had left before he wouldn't have been embarrassed to stand upBanquo wrote:...but given his alleged USP's of defence, goal kicking, and general ice-mannery..........Digby wrote:
That's pretty much it, by dint of what he's selected and praised for and his own judgement on how to play he's lining up a hit not a tackle. He's hardly unique in that of course.
Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Moderator: Puja
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
To be fair he spent the first 10 minutes pleasing himself over Goode. Once Goode had made a few 'uncharacteristic' mistakes he turned his attentions onto Faz. After Faz failed to live up to the hype he was left with Itoje's hand or Taylor's tight perm.Banquo wrote:indeed...though I'm amazed that Barnes is remotely a Faz fan. He could hardly bear to be nice about Johnny, and faz is johnny-lite minus minus.Digby wrote:Given all of those I'd imagine Barnes had to stay seated a while after everyone else had left before he wouldn't have been embarrassed to stand upBanquo wrote: ...but given his alleged USP's of defence, goal kicking, and general ice-mannery..........
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Very disappointing as a Wasp. Kept battering away and getting nowhere, moved it into space and broke through, then immediately went back to ineffectual battering and going nowhere until Sarries cheat the ball back. What was most noticeable was that Ashton's defence was hilarious even by his standards, Fazlet is an arsewipe of the highest order and must be the most disliked player in the Prem (with good reason), Daly is the best 13 by a decent distance, and Wade is back baby!
Whilst I can appreciate their effectiveness, Sarries really are very unlikeable. From cheating the salary cap, to their dedication to cynical and dirty play, to giving a Farrell any kind of career, they can poke right off.
Whilst I can appreciate their effectiveness, Sarries really are very unlikeable. From cheating the salary cap, to their dedication to cynical and dirty play, to giving a Farrell any kind of career, they can poke right off.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Robson going off was a major blow, Simpson was very disappointing as a replacement. Didn't see the Farrell tackle as oddly there was no replay on the big screen, but it looked like he flew in head first - which potentially should have been a red.
But then McIntyre should have had a red too, probably. You just can't get kick someone, regardless of whether they're holding you or not.
Ashton is a proper dick though. I enjoyed his being bought cedar and giving away stupid penalties
But then McIntyre should have had a red too, probably. You just can't get kick someone, regardless of whether they're holding you or not.
Ashton is a proper dick though. I enjoyed his being bought cedar and giving away stupid penalties
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
I R Geech wrote:Very disappointing as a Wasp. Kept battering away and getting nowhere, moved it into space and broke through, then immediately went back to ineffectual battering and going nowhere until Sarries cheat the ball back. What was most noticeable was that Ashton's defence was hilarious even by his standards, Fazlet is an arsewipe of the highest order and must be the most disliked player in the Prem (with good reason), Daly is the best 13 by a decent distance, and Wade is back baby!
Whilst I can appreciate their effectiveness, Sarries really are very unlikeable. From cheating the salary cap, to their dedication to cynical and dirty play, to giving a Farrell any kind of career, they can poke right off.
Sarries put a lot of pressure on Gopperth, which limited things a bit, but I don't understand whey Wasps weren't targeting Ashton and Goode more. Ashton in particular just asks to be stood up and his flappy tackles are just begging to be exploited. The Piutau boys should have been putting the fear of God into Goode as well. When Wasps starting shifting it quickly into space instead of arseing around at every breakdown the go forward was pretty good(e).
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
they had eff all ball until they fell behind. Credit to sarries defence I think.morepork wrote:I R Geech wrote:Very disappointing as a Wasp. Kept battering away and getting nowhere, moved it into space and broke through, then immediately went back to ineffectual battering and going nowhere until Sarries cheat the ball back. What was most noticeable was that Ashton's defence was hilarious even by his standards, Fazlet is an arsewipe of the highest order and must be the most disliked player in the Prem (with good reason), Daly is the best 13 by a decent distance, and Wade is back baby!
Whilst I can appreciate their effectiveness, Sarries really are very unlikeable. From cheating the salary cap, to their dedication to cynical and dirty play, to giving a Farrell any kind of career, they can poke right off.
Sarries put a lot of pressure on Gopperth, which limited things a bit, but I don't understand whey Wasps weren't targeting Ashton and Goode more. Ashton in particular just asks to be stood up and his flappy tackles are just begging to be exploited. The Piutau boys should have been putting the fear of God into Goode as well. When Wasps starting shifting it quickly into space instead of arseing around at every breakdown the go forward was pretty good(e).
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Robson was playing well, but I dont think Simpson was that disappointing tbh.Peej wrote:Robson going off was a major blow, Simpson was very disappointing as a replacement. Didn't see the Farrell tackle as oddly there was no replay on the big screen, but it looked like he flew in head first - which potentially should have been a red.
But then McIntyre should have had a red too, probably. You just can't get kick someone, regardless of whether they're holding you or not.
Ashton is a proper dick though. I enjoyed his being bought cedar and giving away stupid penalties
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Barnes' theme of Sarries not getting the rub of the green really grated throughout that match. What happened was that we had a ref who actually reffed even-handedly generally with the occasional questionable decision. Welcome to what other teams have to put up with against Sarries when they always get the rub of the green.
Pathetic display generally from Sky: coverage starting 5 mins before kickoff? Talk about treating the fans with contempt.
Pathetic display generally from Sky: coverage starting 5 mins before kickoff? Talk about treating the fans with contempt.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Not sure Daly was anything more than efficient....its a tight run thing with him and JJ (and imo JJ is a better defender).I R Geech wrote:Very disappointing as a Wasp. Kept battering away and getting nowhere, moved it into space and broke through, then immediately went back to ineffectual battering and going nowhere until Sarries cheat the ball back. What was most noticeable was that Ashton's defence was hilarious even by his standards, Fazlet is an arsewipe of the highest order and must be the most disliked player in the Prem (with good reason), Daly is the best 13 by a decent distance, and Wade is back baby!
Whilst I can appreciate their effectiveness, Sarries really are very unlikeable. From cheating the salary cap, to their dedication to cynical and dirty play, to giving a Farrell any kind of career, they can poke right off.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
I'm not a sarries fan, but lol; that's what happens when a team is dominant.Beasties wrote:Barnes' theme of Sarries not getting the rub of the green really grated throughout that match. What happened was that we had a ref who actually reffed even-handedly generally with the occasional questionable decision. Welcome to what other teams have to put up with against Sarries when they always get the rub of the green.
Pathetic display generally from Sky: coverage starting 5 mins before kickoff? Talk about treating the fans with contempt.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Eh, it's an opinion thing but from my seat he looked a little slow and indecisive from the breakdown, at one point in particular when we were in the Sarries 22. And he dropped the ball at the end having slowly pirouetted his way into contact rather than just shift it off the floor.Banquo wrote:Robson was playing well, but I dont think Simpson was that disappointing tbh.Peej wrote:Robson going off was a major blow, Simpson was very disappointing as a replacement. Didn't see the Farrell tackle as oddly there was no replay on the big screen, but it looked like he flew in head first - which potentially should have been a red.
But then McIntyre should have had a red too, probably. You just can't get kick someone, regardless of whether they're holding you or not.
Ashton is a proper dick though. I enjoyed his being bought cedar and giving away stupid penalties
- WiganShark
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
I can taste the very sour grapes up here Wade great going forward with a mean step on him, shoite tackler and defence way worse than Ashton and he's utter garbage in the air.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
At least Itoje's hand was having a big positive influence on the game for his team.p/d wrote: To be fair he spent the first 10 minutes pleasing himself over Goode. Once Goode had made a few 'uncharacteristic' mistakes he turned his attentions onto Faz. After Faz failed to live up to the hype he was left with Itoje's hand or Taylor's tight perm.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Do think a few are being a tad dismissive of how Sarries are able to nullify opponents. This is a skill in itself and only effective when a side play as a team. Sarries are masters of that.WiganShark wrote:I can taste the very sour grapes up here Wade great going forward with a mean step on him, shoite tackler and defence way worse than Ashton and he's utter garbage in the air.
As for Wade and Ashton, both are pants in defence. In attack both can be devastating, one with genuine pace and disco feet the other with the art of reading an attack very well indeed.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
..he sparked the counter attack which shifted the momentum in the game. He played like he always plays imo, ergo not 'very disappointing'....which was your phrase.Peej wrote:Eh, it's an opinion thing but from my seat he looked a little slow and indecisive from the breakdown, at one point in particular when we were in the Sarries 22. And he dropped the ball at the end having slowly pirouetted his way into contact rather than just shift it off the floor.Banquo wrote:Robson was playing well, but I dont think Simpson was that disappointing tbh.Peej wrote:Robson going off was a major blow, Simpson was very disappointing as a replacement. Didn't see the Farrell tackle as oddly there was no replay on the big screen, but it looked like he flew in head first - which potentially should have been a red.
But then McIntyre should have had a red too, probably. You just can't get kick someone, regardless of whether they're holding you or not.
Ashton is a proper dick though. I enjoyed his being bought cedar and giving away stupid penalties
btw...it wasn't 'odd' that the faz tackle wasn't on screen-- they don't replay stuff that might show a serious injury.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Quite. But seems to me that WiganShark is a little over protective of wiganites- they shouldn't need 'defending' if they were doing the job, surely?p/d wrote:Do think a few are being a tad dismissive of how Sarries are able to nullify opponents. This is a skill in itself and only effective when a side play as a team. Sarries are masters of that.WiganShark wrote:I can taste the very sour grapes up here Wade great going forward with a mean step on him, shoite tackler and defence way worse than Ashton and he's utter garbage in the air.
As for Wade and Ashton, both are pants in defence. In attack both can be devastating, one with genuine pace and disco feet the other with the art of reading an attack very well indeed.
However, I also don't get the anti-sarries 'style' at all. sure there are a couple of dicks in their team, but there are in most teams.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
They also should not need defending as they are grown men with a pair of balls. I dont know what all the fuss is about as everyone loves the Chav twins.Banquo wrote:Quite. But seems to me that WiganShark is a little over protective of wiganites- they shouldn't need 'defending' if they were doing the job, surely?p/d wrote:Do think a few are being a tad dismissive of how Sarries are able to nullify opponents. This is a skill in itself and only effective when a side play as a team. Sarries are masters of that.WiganShark wrote:I can taste the very sour grapes up here Wade great going forward with a mean step on him, shoite tackler and defence way worse than Ashton and he's utter garbage in the air.
As for Wade and Ashton, both are pants in defence. In attack both can be devastating, one with genuine pace and disco feet the other with the art of reading an attack very well indeed.
However, I also don't get the anti-sarries 'style' at all. sure there are a couple of dicks in their team, but there are in most teams.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Someone snuck 14/15 and previous Fazlet onto the pitch today in place of his modern day counterpart - iffy goal kicking, poor decision making, dangerous and borderline incompetent in defence. I'd hoped we'd seen the last of that.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Yes. He reverted to type. He has been playing well this season and I thought he'd matured. He is a hard bloke to like (like Ashton). Sarries seem to be terribly unpopular, but I would not judge the team by a couple of individuals. Most of the players seem OK. The Vunipola brothers, Kruis, Itoje and Brits form the basis of a pack that is hard to get the better of and always put in a good stint with 100% effort.Puja wrote:Someone snuck 14/15 and previous Fazlet onto the pitch today in place of his modern day counterpart - iffy goal kicking, poor decision making, dangerous and borderline incompetent in defence. I'd hoped we'd seen the last of that.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Reversion to the mean.Puja wrote:Someone snuck 14/15 and previous Fazlet onto the pitch today in place of his modern day counterpart - iffy goal kicking, poor decision making, dangerous and borderline incompetent in defence. I'd hoped we'd seen the last of that.
Puja
Odd game. Sarries strangled the opposition as they always do. They are a hard team to like and I certainly don't enjoy watching them, much as there are some very competent bits of rugby and some excellent players.
In what universe is a deliberate kick to the head not a red card? I found myself agreeing with Quinnell - yellow for Itoje, red for the kicker - and Andy Goode who said referees just are tough on the sort of holding and scatter rucking that goes on. It's been going on for years now and has to stop. I remember a game at LI years ago when Steffon was being held down preventing him from covering in the defensive line. The touch judge came onto the pitch to politely ask if the opposing player wouldn't mind letting go. When he didn't and they scored in the area there was not a peep. As an aside Alex Goode taking wade out on his supporting line for Robson's try should also have seen yellow.
I refuse to have a battle of wits with an unarmed person.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Itoje was held in the ruck by Wasps players on three occasions in the first half alone, no yellows. Do you only get a yellow if it is concomitant with being kicked in the head?
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
It's the pies mate, they fecking get to youskidger wrote:They also should not need defending as they are grown men with a pair of balls. I dont know what all the fuss is about as everyone loves the Chav twins.Banquo wrote:Quite. But seems to me that WiganShark is a little over protective of wiganites- they shouldn't need 'defending' if they were doing the job, surely?p/d wrote: Do think a few are being a tad dismissive of how Sarries are able to nullify opponents. This is a skill in itself and only effective when a side play as a team. Sarries are masters of that.
As for Wade and Ashton, both are pants in defence. In attack both can be devastating, one with genuine pace and disco feet the other with the art of reading an attack very well indeed.
However, I also don't get the anti-sarries 'style' at all. sure there are a couple of dicks in their team, but there are in most teams.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Maybe the coaching set-up at Saracens needs more credit for the exceptional effectiveness achieved by the team unit. If I was picking an 'on-paper' XV from the two starting line-ups, I'd have 13 Wasps players with Itoje and Kruis (though I'd play Itoje at 6).
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Saracens are a damn good side. Sure they've got a couple of players that are hard to like but they have plenty who are.
Their style might not be easy on the eye but you cant argue with the results they get.
Not only are they supremely well coached - their workrate is phenomenal. The way their forwards in particular work off the ball is hugely impressive.
Credit where its due. They are quite a side.
Their style might not be easy on the eye but you cant argue with the results they get.
Not only are they supremely well coached - their workrate is phenomenal. The way their forwards in particular work off the ball is hugely impressive.
Credit where its due. They are quite a side.
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Re: Saracens V Wasps Sat 3pm
Had he prevented a try being scored maybe, but taking out a player off the ball is normally only a penalty. Yes it was a shoulder charge rather than a tackle but it wasn't dangerous which is the only reason I'd reasonably want a card. I do think it should have been registered by the officials and been added to a list, along the lines of you've not gotten a card there but be carefulEugene Wrayburn wrote:Goode taking wade out on his supporting line for Robson's try should also have seen yellow.