Scotland v Ireland (Men's)

[Cameo]

Not trying to stifle Finn chat but thought it'd be good to get a separate thread going on our first game as still plenty to talk about.

Fragments of teams have gone up on the other thread but here goes:

Sutherland
Brown
Fagerson
Gray
Cummings
Ritchie
Watson
Bradbury
Horne (personal preference but happy with Price and some logic with inexperience elsewhere)
Hastings
Kinghorn
Scott (think it will be Johnson)
Jones
Maitland
Hogg

16. Dell
17. McInally
18. Berghan/Nel (not seen enough to say)
19. Gilchrist (not seen much of Craig -.this would be Skinner's spot if fit)
20. Crosbie
21. Price
22. Hutchinson (covering 10, 12 and 13 and aiming to get him on with plenty of time to shine)
23. Harris (don't really know who to put here but Harris covers wing and with Hutchinson also covering ten, no harm in having an extra centre)

I think that is not a bad team on paper and a lot of them have experience playing together BUT it feels a few people are being given a bit of a tough gig/reintroduction - Scott between Hastings and Jones, Sutherland on limited game time, and Hutchinson being expected to make an impact in one of three positions.

[Mikey Brown]

Very well put.

Scott’s form has merited inclusion but the lack of settled options around him make that a difficult change where Johnson has been pretty reliable so far.

I do see some worth in Harris still. I think all the others have a higher potential but his defensive work may be hard to dismiss.

[Cameo]

Yeah, I'm not clear on why I prefer Scott (even without having seen hat much of him this season) but I have a slight feeling that Johnson's style is a little unconventional and that makes him a little harder to play consistently with. That could be very harsh and maybe he is the 12 we have been looking for, it just seems he can hit good lines (and has pace) but sometimes ends up running sideways or not being an option. I think it is mainly that I have dreamt of Scott being our hard running but with good hands and kicking game 12 since Scott Johnson said he could be as good as Maa Nonu.

Harris as cover on the wing I'm okay with. Starting at 13 I just see as a negative selection. I just don't think his good games have been that good

[Big D]

If Hutchinson is on the bench covering 10-13 in your scenario I could see him sticking Steyn on the bench as he is a wing who has covered 13.

[ARM]

Yeah, I'm not clear on why I prefer Scott (even without having seen hat much of him this season) but I have a slight feeling that Johnson's style is a little unconventional and that makes him a little harder to play consistently with. That could be very harsh and maybe he is the 12 we have been looking for, it just seems he can hit good lines (and has pace) but sometimes ends up running sideways or not being an option. I think it is mainly that I have dreamt of Scott being our hard running but with good hands and kicking game 12 since Scott Johnson said he could be as good as Maa Nonu.

Harris as cover on the wing I'm okay with. Starting at 13 I just see as a negative selection. I just don't think his good games have been that good

Slight flaw in that is: Matt Scott has no kicking game and poor hands.

Admittedly Johnson’s kicking game isn’t up to much either but given we are throwing Hastings in to the mix at 10, better to surround him inside and out with his club teammates I think.

[Mikey Brown]

Ha. Yes. Scott’s direct running game is great but he’s a much less rounded player than Johnson, who is still just about a reasonable kicker but has much better hands/vision.

Heart says Scott but my head says Johnson.

I still find it hard to leave out Jones. Hutchinson has been in good form for 18 months now, with a little bit of a dip recently. Whereas Jones has been fairly rubbish for 18 months but with a very well times uptick in the last few weeks. I’m not sure that should be enough though.

[switchskier]

Agree that Johnson needs to be nailed on for the familiarity with Hastings and the direct carrying option that he provides. For me Hutchinson is still just about the form option so would like to see what he can do at 13 with a bit of space.

That means a choice between Scott and Jones for the bench slot with the former winning out for me as he can cover both 12 and 13. I still maintain that Jones could play wing though so maybe have them both as Graham is out and Kinghorn covers fullback.

[Mikey Brown]

Actually I quite like that. Johnson/Hutchinson is definitely the best combo in terms of vision and distribution. Scott can come on in either position and offer a more direct running threat.

Is my mind playing tricks on me or did Harris look alright when he ended up on the wing before? I remember him boshing some Japanese guy (I think) but that’s might have been his entire contribution.

[paddy no 11]

Not the most formidable Irish side but forwards are decent and ye seem to be in trouble. Bar a perfect team selection where all combinations get the most out of each other yer fecked

[ARM]

Not the most formidable Irish side but forwards are decent and ye seem to be in trouble. Bar a perfect team selection where all combinations get the most out of each other yer fecked

MOCKERS - OVER HERE! DO YOU FUCKING SEE THIS?









I agree btw..

[Mikey Brown]

If we could at least do our team announcement in a less disgusting format I’d consider that a victory of sorts.

[Cameo]

Yeah, I'm not clear on why I prefer Scott (even without having seen hat much of him this season) but I have a slight feeling that Johnson's style is a little unconventional and that makes him a little harder to play consistently with. That could be very harsh and maybe he is the 12 we have been looking for, it just seems he can hit good lines (and has pace) but sometimes ends up running sideways or not being an option. I think it is mainly that I have dreamt of Scott being our hard running but with good hands and kicking game 12 since Scott Johnson said he could be as good as Maa Nonu.

Harris as cover on the wing I'm okay with. Starting at 13 I just see as a negative selection. I just don't think his good games have been that good

Slight flaw in that is: Matt Scott has no kicking game and poor hands.

Admittedly Johnson’s kicking game isn’t up to much either but given we are throwing Hastings in to the mix at 10, better to surround him inside and out with his club teammates I think.

Yes, there is that. I base my dream more on him starting off as a 10 than on how he plays.

[hugh_woatmeigh]

Toony won't put randomers outside Hastings.

It'll be Johnson at 12 and most likely Jones at 13 but that one is contestable.

[Cameo]

I think you are right and it is probably the right call. Johnson has generally been good since he came in too (the WC disappointment and wierd centre selections make judging all this tricky!).

[Cameo]

Not the most formidable Irish side but forwards are decent and ye seem to be in trouble. Bar a perfect team selection where all combinations get the most out of each other yer fecked

A bit of a shakeup is probably good for them. The thing with Ireland over the last few years is that the names on paper don't always look good then you realise that everyone coming in has 50 odd caps for a very successful Leinster team or in a Munster team always there or thereabouts

[paddy no 11]

Not the most formidable Irish side but forwards are decent and ye seem to be in trouble. Bar a perfect team selection where all combinations get the most out of each other yer fecked

A bit of a shakeup is probably good for them. The thing with Ireland over the last few years is that the names on paper don't always look good then you realise that everyone coming in has 50 odd caps for a very successful Leinster team or in a Munster team always there or thereabouts

They also had a very rigid gameplan which was effective and could be executed by a junior side and tbh I don't see Farrell changing much so it's up to ye to get selection right. Backrow half backs and centre

Not knowing anything I'd give kinghorn a run strikes me as a fella who'll just keep getting trys

[General Zod]

Not knowing anything I'd give kinghorn a run strikes me as a fella who'll just keep getting trys

Yeah - me too. I would say that his defence looks like it has improved this season as well.

You sound Irish - do you reckon the pubs in Dublin be showing the under 20s game on Friday night, or will they have show football instead?

[paddy no 11]

Not knowing anything I'd give kinghorn a run strikes me as a fella who'll just keep getting trys

Yeah - me too. I would say that his defence looks like it has improved this season as well.

You sound Irish - do you reckon the pubs in Dublin be showing the under 20s game on Friday night, or will they have show football instead?

Depends on the socioeconomic class of pib you go into but most will be showing the u 20 south of the river

[General Zod]

Not knowing anything I'd give kinghorn a run strikes me as a fella who'll just keep getting trys

Yeah - me too. I would say that his defence looks like it has improved this season as well.

You sound Irish - do you reckon the pubs in Dublin be showing the under 20s game on Friday night, or will they have show football instead?

Depends on the socioeconomic class of pib you go into but most will be showing the u 20 south of the river

Yeah, figured. I will be staying in the salubrious environs of Croker...

[paddy no 11]

Ooh best head into city centre then. Have a good one

[whatisthejava]

Im heading to Dublin for this and i fully expect to see Scotland losing 28-9

Cant see anything except an utter pumping

Gray will tackle but have the aggression of a dead slug
Gilchrist will knock the ball on a couple of times
Fagerson will concede stupid penas in the scrum
Back row will do well but the front 5 will let them down

Backs will try hard but just not get the platform to do enough

[General Zod]

I am also going - wayyyy down at the front in Row C.

I hope Cummings starts and can see the positives in Hastings starting.

Have heard Sutherland starting as well (Thistle pod).

I would like to be in it with 20 to go. I think we’d have a decent chance from there. Hopefully not 14-0 or so down after 20 minutes.

[Adder]

15. Stuart Hogg CAPTAIN (Exeter Chiefs) – 72 caps

14. Sean Maitland (Saracens) – 44 caps
13. Huw Jones (Glasgow Warriors) – 23 caps
12. Sam Johnson (Glasgow Warriors) – 9 caps
11. Blair Kinghorn (Edinburgh) – 17 caps

10. Adam Hastings (Glasgow Warriors) – 16 caps
9. Ali Price (Glasgow Warriors) – 28 caps

1. Rory Sutherland (Edinburgh) – 3 caps
2. Fraser Brown VICE CAPTAIN (Glasgow Warriors) – 46 caps
3. Zander Fagerson (Glasgow Warriors) – 25 caps
4. Scott Cummings (Glasgow Warriors) – 8 caps
5. Jonny Gray (Glasgow Warriors) – 55 caps
6. Jamie Ritchie (Edinburgh) – 14 caps
7. Hamish Watson (Edinburgh) – 28 caps
8. Nick Haining (Edinburgh) – uncapped

Substitutes:
16. Stuart McInally (Edinburgh) – 33 caps
17. Allan Dell (London Irish) – 28 caps
18. Simon Berghan (Edinburgh) – 24 caps
19. Ben Toolis (Edinburgh) – 22 caps
20. Cornell du Preez (Worcester Warriors) – 6 caps
21. George Horne (Glasgow Warriors) – 10 caps
22. Rory Hutchinson (Northampton Saints) – 3 caps
23. Chris Harris (Gloucester) – 14 caps

[Mikey Brown]

Err...

[Mikey Brown]

I mean I'm fairly happy with 21 of those selections.