Team for Tonga

[loudnconfident]

A fun day out at a full Twickenham. Not sure what it proved but England gave it a go.

(I didn't like the way Tonga were left standing for 5 minutes before England emerged from the tunnel, + crappy buildup from the announcer. It's the kind of thing we get fromWales and looks puerile and disrespectful.)

[twitchy]

[fivepointer]

Pretty satisfactory i'd say. Some fluency, some good tries, some good performances mixed in with the odd flat phase. We looked pretty sharp and moved the ball sweetly at times.
Slade had a good game, Curry got better as the game wore on, Radwan looked sharp, Genge delivered and Smith provided a fine cameo.
Tonga were limited and rarely posed much of a threat, so you've got to take that on board. Plus the red card helped England to wrack up some late soft points.

[Scrumhead]

I feel like Jngf is going to have some opinions about Curry repeatedly smashing it up.

Sorry Mikey but he’s been stopped dead with zero penetration over the gain line every time he’s attempted a carry into heavy traffic so I’m not sure what point you’re making here?

I think that’s what he was alluding to …

Curry isn’t an 8 and isn’t particularly good heavy carrier. He’s much better used further out as more of a link man as we saw later in the game.

Curry had a mixed bag. He was much better when he switched back to the flank and after a fairly anonymous game from Underhill, I wonder whether Eddie might consider Dombrandt at 8 vs. Australia. I doubt it, but I also never expected to see Furbank start at 10 for England.

Unrelated, but I thought Will Stuart looked good off the bench. Some signs that he’s getting back to offering the hard carrying that made him stand out.

[jngf]

To be positive I did like the distributive skills Curry and others were using in this match and it was nice to see attacking intent all round. I actually thought Johnny Hill had one of his better games to date including some industrious work at the break down and at least one lineout steel!

On that note France have got a helluva good new lock in Flament - him, Woki and Macalou are going to make France scarily pacy and athletic in the forwards.

[twitchy]

On that note France have got a helluva good new lock in Flament - him, Woki and Macalou are going to make France scarily pacy and athletic in the forwards.

He used to play 10 for loughborough 2nds or something silly like that.

[Puja]

Is it just me or has Tuillagi lost a fair bit of weight and power in the carry?

It's not just you, but I see it as excellent news. He's got the same kind of body shape he had when he broke through for Leicester, when he was fast enough and elusive enough to play wing. He's difficult enough to stop at that weight - he doesn't *need* the extra bulk to break tackles - and having him be fast again makes him more than just a crash ball option. Plus, I suspect this amount of weight is probably better for his poor joints.

Curry did not distinguish himself at 8, so full marks to you, although I wouldn't necessarily see it as terminal to his career there. Tonga clearly had a plan where they were setting up 2, or sometimes 3, tacklers to hit him every time and, for some reason, he kept running into their trap (probably because he wanted to prove that he could smash). Didn't go backwards, but certainly stopped dead every time. Needs to learn that being 8 doesn't mean he has to try and smash through people and he doesn't have to try and out-man the defence if they're waiting for him - much better to have someone running off his shoulder and pop the ball to them to go round the outside of the defensive pod.

Puja

[Danno]

To be positive I did like the distributive skills Curry and others were using in this match and it was nice to see attacking intent all round. I actually thought Johnny Hill had one of his better games to date including some industrious work at the break down and at least one lineout steel!

On that note France have got a helluva good new lock in Flament - him, Woki and Macalou are going to make France scarily pacy and athletic in the forwards.

Hill was fine at the lineout but he was a tacklebag at best for the rest of the match. About 12 minutes in he was meant to he the ruck guard and watched a Tongan wander past him inside our own 22. He hasn't had a cap without an absolute howler yet but the cupboard is sort of bare for locks, so I guess we're stuck with the Amish fool

[Raggs]

Is it just me or has Tuillagi lost a fair bit of weight and power in the carry?

It's not just you, but I see it as excellent news. He's got the same kind of body shape he had when he broke through for Leicester, when he was fast enough and elusive enough to play wing. He's difficult enough to stop at that weight - he doesn't *need* the extra bulk to break tackles - and having him be fast again makes him more than just a crash ball option. Plus, I suspect this amount of weight is probably better for his poor joints.

Curry did not distinguish himself at 8, so full marks to you, although I wouldn't necessarily see it as terminal to his career there. Tonga clearly had a plan where they were setting up 2, or sometimes 3, tacklers to hit him every time and, for some reason, he kept running into their trap (probably because he wanted to prove that he could smash). Didn't go backwards, but certainly stopped dead every time. Needs to learn that being 8 doesn't mean he has to try and smash through people and he doesn't have to try and out-man the defence if they're waiting for him - much better to have someone running off his shoulder and pop the ball to them to go round the outside of the defensive pod.

Puja

He needs to target them, especially as it was typically kick offs. If he starts running sideways he's running away from his organised pattern of support. It's actually dangerous if he makes a half break, since then his support is in real trouble. It's bad to go backwards for obvious reasons. A bit of forward momentum would be nice, but considering what they were hitting him with, making sure he doesn't lose ground, and both tackles have to go down with him, secures the ball for the next phase/exit.

[p/d]

Curry isn’t an 8. With the likes of BV, Dombrandt and Simmonds about it was the case before the game, during and that hasn’t changed after the game.

50 odd minutes of test rugby wasted

[Danno]

Chick or Tom Willis would have been better.

And I'm not convinced Chick should be there

[p/d]

Curry had proved himself world class time and time again, so even the suggestion Chick could have done better suggests the number 8 isn’t enhancing Curry’s reputation

[Mikey Brown]

If that was really the plan playing out perfectly, whether he made metres beyond the gain-line or not, I'm really not hopeful about managing to use either Dombrandt or Simmonds in any useful sort of way either.

Dombrandt looked a bit jittery early on but really hope he can find his feet in the next couple of games. Lovely thought of him to pass to Genge for a try but he was over if he put his head down.

[Puja]

Is it just me or has Tuillagi lost a fair bit of weight and power in the carry?

It's not just you, but I see it as excellent news. He's got the same kind of body shape he had when he broke through for Leicester, when he was fast enough and elusive enough to play wing. He's difficult enough to stop at that weight - he doesn't *need* the extra bulk to break tackles - and having him be fast again makes him more than just a crash ball option. Plus, I suspect this amount of weight is probably better for his poor joints.

Curry did not distinguish himself at 8, so full marks to you, although I wouldn't necessarily see it as terminal to his career there. Tonga clearly had a plan where they were setting up 2, or sometimes 3, tacklers to hit him every time and, for some reason, he kept running into their trap (probably because he wanted to prove that he could smash). Didn't go backwards, but certainly stopped dead every time. Needs to learn that being 8 doesn't mean he has to try and smash through people and he doesn't have to try and out-man the defence if they're waiting for him - much better to have someone running off his shoulder and pop the ball to them to go round the outside of the defensive pod.

Puja

He needs to target them, especially as it was typically kick offs. If he starts running sideways he's running away from his organised pattern of support. It's actually dangerous if he makes a half break, since then his support is in real trouble. It's bad to go backwards for obvious reasons. A bit of forward momentum would be nice, but considering what they were hitting him with, making sure he doesn't lose ground, and both tackles have to go down with him, secures the ball for the next phase/exit.

It wasn't just kickoffs though - it was midfield where he was clearly being lined up and he decided to try and overpower three men rather than draw their attention and feed someone else.

Puja

[Danno]

That's a coaching thing to my mind. Every 8 under Jones has been asked to play like Billy, whoever they are - see Hughes. The only one that can get through those walls is (was) Billy though

[twitchy]

Yeah I don't see that 17.5 stone curry wasn't bowling ball 23 stone tongans with his carries as a huge failing of his. That said if he has x amount of energy to expend on the game I think where he is world class is doing more flanker stuff with the odd carry peppered in than being the primary carrier.

[p/d]

Do I understand that there are ongoing discussions to allow Farrell to play next week as, to name one, May insists it was a false positive?

[Scrumhead]

Chick or Tom Willis would have been better.

And I'm not convinced Chick should be there

I’m not sure Chick would have been better TBH, but I’m surprised Eddie hasn’t had a good look at Tom Willis. I’d have thought he’d be exactly the type of 8 he wants - good heavy carrier but still mobile and athletic, very good defensively, massive work rate and doesn’t seem to be error-prone. He can also jump in the lineout. In short, what’s not to like?

I’m a massive fan of Dombrandt’s but I think Willis is the better all round number 8.

[Scrumhead]

Do I understand that there are ongoing discussions to allow Farrell to play next week as, to name one, May insists it was a false positive?

May also thought he was possessed by a chicken at one point so I wouldn’t put too much emphasis on what he thinks.

[p/d]

Do I understand that there are ongoing discussions to allow Farrell to play next week as, to name one, May insists it was a false positive?

May also thought he was possessed by a chicken at one point so I wouldn’t put too much emphasis on what he thinks.

[Which Tyler]

Either way there's no room in the Covid rules to allow a false positive to be treated as a negative.

Now if Farrell is a Tory party donor, then there might be a loophole that no-ones been told about but otherwise, he's self-isolating for 10 days.

[Puja]

We haven't had a sniff of COVID in my house since the start of the pandemic, and now my wife turns up a positive test. Bloody Farrell!

Puja

[fivepointer]

Owen Farrell will re-join the England squad at Pennyhill Park later today.
Farrell returned a positive test result from a COVID PCR test (taken on Thursday morning) and immediately went into self-isolation.
The sample was reviewed by the lab and determined as a false positive test on Saturday morning and subsequently accepted by NHS Test and Trace today. This process is fully in line with advice given by UK Health Security Agency.
His subsequent PCRs have also been negative and therefore he has been released from self-isolation.

The England squad are preparing for their next Test match against Australia [Saturday 13 November, 5.30pm

[Danno]

Thought the ref was decent. Seemed to know what was going on at the scrum, which is unusual

[morepork]

Owen Farrell will re-join the England squad at Pennyhill Park later today.
Farrell returned a positive test result from a COVID PCR test (taken on Thursday morning) and immediately went into self-isolation.
The sample was reviewed by the lab and determined as a false positive test on Saturday morning and subsequently accepted by NHS Test and Trace today. This process is fully in line with advice given by UK Health Security Agency.
His subsequent PCRs have also been negative and therefore he has been released from self-isolation.

The England squad are preparing for their next Test match against Australia [Saturday 13 November, 5.30pm

What about the rest of the squad?