Squad for Ireland

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Banquo
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Banquo »

Mikey Brown wrote:
Banquo wrote:
Mikey Brown wrote:Going back to somebody’s earlier point about the personnel changes around this time before the previous World Cup- though I think most of the changes came in the summer/autumn of 2018 rather than the 6 nations - are we just in a similar phase of Eddie faffing?

It looked pretty dire for a while, but largely came through by World Cup time, though we were maybe (understandably) too focussed on the New Zealand.

I wonder how seriously he is really taking this ‘trial semi and final’ in the next two weeks. Does it make sense to be talking that way at the same time as talking about being a side in transition? Will this make or break the futures of some players or strategies?

It’s a shame if Dombrandt is out as he was one who was really looking to show if he’s a serious option at this level right now, but equally it would be good to know if Simmonds can really cut it.

I can see more big changes in the rest of the year either way.

Do you mean in style or personnel? Earlier in the thread you seemed to be saying that the squad looked pretty settled goiing forward.
Both, potentially. I don't think this squad looks massively settled, but the vision of the rough RWC squad is there or thereabouts. I'd expect some more experienced guys either returning from injury/exclusion to make it look a little more familiar in the next year. I'm not sure how convinced he really is of the style we've adopted, but it's probably too early to tell. I imagine we'll see similar-ish in the summer, but hopefully a progression.

Can't recall what our Autumn fixtures look like, but it wouldn't surprise me if Jones wanted to be able to revert to previous players or tactics at that point after having a look at some alternatives in the last 6 months or so. I think that may have been his plan to some degree with George, Ford, Daly but injuries forced his hand. Maybe he's completely serious about this 'new England thing' but my sense was guys like Blamire, Dombrandt, Randall, Smith are being given a chance but not yet the true owners of their shirts. Steward for example though has looked the part right away, so it's good he's looking at other options.
Sorry, meant the 23 Which posted.

I'd hope some talent breaks through, else we look a bit underwhelming tbh, even if we get the very best out of what we have. Mind, I said that before the last world cup (and in fairness Undercurry wasn't a thing then and Tuilagi was injured).
Last edited by Banquo on Tue Mar 08, 2022 10:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
Mikey Brown
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Mikey Brown »

Exactly.
Banquo
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Banquo »

Mikey Brown wrote:Exactly.
sorry, totally fckd my post up :(. Have edited ;)
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Stom
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Stom »

I think we're settled on 20-25 of our WC squad. The question is, are the other 8-13 players going to be in the 23 or back ups?

Actually, we might have even more of the squad sorted, tbh. We might get a prop breaking through, a lock, but only as a backup, I imagine, JWillis, maybe even TWillis, Quirke or Mitchell, a centre, and that's about it, I think.

Marler, Genge, Mako/ANother
George, LCD, Blamire/ANother
Sinckler, Stuart/Heyes/ANother
Itoje, ANother
Hill, Launch
Lawes, Curry, Underhill, Dombrandt, Simmonds/Billy/Barbeary/TWillis, JWillis/Kenningham/ANother
Youngs, Randall, Quirke/Mitchell/ANother
Smith, Ford, Farrell
Tuilagi/ANother, Slade, Marchant/ANother
Daly, Malins, Watson, Nowell, Steward
Banquo
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Banquo »

Stom wrote:I think we're settled on 20-25 of our WC squad. The question is, are the other 8-13 players going to be in the 23 or back ups?

Actually, we might have even more of the squad sorted, tbh. We might get a prop breaking through, a lock, but only as a backup, I imagine, JWillis, maybe even TWillis, Quirke or Mitchell, a centre, and that's about it, I think.

Marler, Genge, Mako/ANother
George, LCD, Blamire/ANother
Sinckler, Stuart/Heyes/ANother
Itoje, ANother
Hill, Launch
Lawes, Curry, Underhill, Dombrandt, Simmonds/Billy/Barbeary/TWillis, JWillis/Kenningham/ANother
Youngs, Randall, Quirke/Mitchell/ANother
Smith, Ford, Farrell
Tuilagi/ANother, Slade, Marchant/ANother
Daly, Malins, Watson, Nowell, Steward
Doesn't feel great to be stuck with that lot tbh. Just lacking a bit I'd say, with a distinct lack o'carrying pzazz up front and ordinary looking backs. As noted though, not much else out there.
Dan. Dan. Dan.
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Dan. Dan. Dan. »

Does feel like we could really do with Jack Willis and Cokanisiga finally staying injury free and fulfilling their massive potential + Barbeary properly breaking through. Maybe Odogwu can step up?
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Puja
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Puja »

Dan. Dan. Dan. wrote:Does feel like we could really do with Jack Willis and Cokanisiga finally staying injury free and fulfilling their massive potential + Barbeary properly breaking through. Maybe Odogwu can step up?
I think Odogwu might be the new Marcel Garvey - looks good and is the darling of the highlights reel and the casual fan, but has too many weaknesses overall to be a serious international option.

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fivepointer
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by fivepointer »

Banquo wrote:
Stom wrote:I think we're settled on 20-25 of our WC squad. The question is, are the other 8-13 players going to be in the 23 or back ups?

Actually, we might have even more of the squad sorted, tbh. We might get a prop breaking through, a lock, but only as a backup, I imagine, JWillis, maybe even TWillis, Quirke or Mitchell, a centre, and that's about it, I think.

Marler, Genge, Mako/ANother
George, LCD, Blamire/ANother
Sinckler, Stuart/Heyes/ANother
Itoje, ANother
Hill, Launch
Lawes, Curry, Underhill, Dombrandt, Simmonds/Billy/Barbeary/TWillis, JWillis/Kenningham/ANother
Youngs, Randall, Quirke/Mitchell/ANother
Smith, Ford, Farrell
Tuilagi/ANother, Slade, Marchant/ANother
Daly, Malins, Watson, Nowell, Steward
Doesn't feel great to be stuck with that lot tbh. Just lacking a bit I'd say, with a distinct lack o'carrying pzazz up front and ordinary looking backs. As noted though, not much else out there.
Lots of good players - plus several others who fall into that category who wont get picked - yet lacking just a bit at the very top level.
Its where we are. Thats why the job now is to get the very best out of what we have and hope some of the newer players come through strongly.
Dan. Dan. Dan.
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Dan. Dan. Dan. »

Puja wrote:
Dan. Dan. Dan. wrote:Does feel like we could really do with Jack Willis and Cokanisiga finally staying injury free and fulfilling their massive potential + Barbeary properly breaking through. Maybe Odogwu can step up?
I think Odogwu might be the new Marcel Garvey - looks good and is the darling of the highlights reel and the casual fan, but has too many weaknesses overall to be a serious international option.

Puja
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fivepointer
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by fivepointer »

BREAKING: Nic Dolly, Nick Isiekwe, Bevan Rodd, Sam Underhill, Orlando Bailey, George Furbank, Ollie Hassell-Collins, Alex Mitchell and Luke Northmore have been released back to their clubs.

Alfie Barbeary and Joe Launchbury are retained in the 26 man squad.
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Stom
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Stom »

Ooh, that’s good. I guess Barbeary is there in case dombrandt doesn’t make it, though.
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jngf
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by jngf »

Stom wrote:Ooh, that’s good. I guess Barbeary is there in case dombrandt doesn’t make it, though.
In the context of playing no.8 at test level would Barbeary actually offer anything different to Billy Vunipola other than being slightly quicker and slightly more mobile but (I suspect) marginally less powerful in terms tight carrying?
An issue with both is not being line out jumpers and increasing the likelihood of having to play locks at 6.
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Oakboy
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Oakboy »

Stom wrote:Ooh, that’s good. I guess Barbeary is there in case dombrandt doesn’t make it, though.
The fact that Dombrandt has not been released at least gives him a chance but it must be iffy. He needs to be 100% against Ireland.
Raggs
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Raggs »

We could also be looking at a 6/2 split against Ireland, perhaps not the worst team to do it against.
Banquo
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Banquo »

fivepointer wrote:
Banquo wrote:
Stom wrote:I think we're settled on 20-25 of our WC squad. The question is, are the other 8-13 players going to be in the 23 or back ups?

Actually, we might have even more of the squad sorted, tbh. We might get a prop breaking through, a lock, but only as a backup, I imagine, JWillis, maybe even TWillis, Quirke or Mitchell, a centre, and that's about it, I think.

Marler, Genge, Mako/ANother
George, LCD, Blamire/ANother
Sinckler, Stuart/Heyes/ANother
Itoje, ANother
Hill, Launch
Lawes, Curry, Underhill, Dombrandt, Simmonds/Billy/Barbeary/TWillis, JWillis/Kenningham/ANother
Youngs, Randall, Quirke/Mitchell/ANother
Smith, Ford, Farrell
Tuilagi/ANother, Slade, Marchant/ANother
Daly, Malins, Watson, Nowell, Steward
Doesn't feel great to be stuck with that lot tbh. Just lacking a bit I'd say, with a distinct lack o'carrying pzazz up front and ordinary looking backs. As noted though, not much else out there.
Lots of good players - plus several others who fall into that category who wont get picked - yet lacking just a bit at the very top level.
Its where we are. Thats why the job now is to get the very best out of what we have and hope some of the newer players come through strongly.
yes.
Banquo
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Banquo »

Raggs wrote:We could also be looking at a 6/2 split against Ireland, perhaps not the worst team to do it against.
almost always a bad idea from a backs pov
Danno
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Danno »

Banquo wrote:
Raggs wrote:We could also be looking at a 6/2 split against Ireland, perhaps not the worst team to do it against.
almost always a bad idea from a backs pov
These backs ? (Messing about)
FKAS
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by FKAS »

Raggs wrote:We could also be looking at a 6/2 split against Ireland, perhaps not the worst team to do it against.
Bit difficult without Farrell in the squad. I can't see Eddie risking not having a specialist flyhalf available, particularly when the attack play looks so meh. Ford and Smith don't cover any additional positions. If Farrell were available I suspect he'd be at 12 and Eddie would then opt for 6:2 and put someone like Chessum or Barbeary on there though if Dombrandt isn't ready Barbeary might get a chance anyway.
Mikey Brown
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Mikey Brown »

So Dombrandt has had Covid all week and Curry hasn't trained due to concussion, but we've sent Underhill back. I assume that means they're fairly confident Curry is okay, or he-who-must-not-be-named may get his wish in the back row. Shame for Dombrandt if he doesn't make it but would of course be exciting to see what Barbeary can do.

Wouldn't surprise me to see 6:2 either, even though I don't particularly like it.
FKAS
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by FKAS »

No Dombrandt and no Curry would leave backrow options of?

6. Lawes
7. Simmonds
8. Barbeary

20. Chessum

Well we wouldn't lack physicality would we.

Obviously one or both of Dombrandt and Curry will be fine to play.
p/d
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by p/d »

Gutted Underhill has gone back. However it keeps the door open for Barbeary. That said it would suggest Dombrandt and Curry will be back and Lawes can continue to clog up the 6 berth
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Oakboy
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Oakboy »

FKAS wrote:No Dombrandt and no Curry would leave backrow options of?

6. Lawes
7. Simmonds
8. Barbeary

20. Chessum

Well we wouldn't lack physicality would we.

Obviously one or both of Dombrandt and Curry will be fine to play.
Quite. Releasing Underhill after 57 minutes for Bath post-injury makes sense. Maybe Jones learnt the lesson from rushing Tuilagi back stupidly.

Much as I rate Simmonds, all he has done so far, IMO, is prove that he is a viable option at 8. He has looked uncomfortable alongside Dombrandt when brought on as a flanker replacement.
Portcullis Irish
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Portcullis Irish »

So Yoda has kept 4 locks + Chessum?

Makes me think a 6/2 bench incoming with Ewels Chessum & Barbeary/Simmonds Randall & Daly :oops: Given the paucity of a cutting edge a fresh pack to stifle Ireland may be the best available option to win the game but frankly........its meh
Does Yoda have faith in Slade/Malins to cover 10 for 70+ mins if Smith gets steamrolled by Aki first up??

What an indictment of Yoda's player development skills since 2019 it all is.

If we lose these last 2 games will the RFU have the gonads to ditch tinkerman ?
fivepointer
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by fivepointer »

Portcullis Irish wrote:So Yoda has kept 4 locks + Chessum?

Makes me think a 6/2 bench incoming with Ewels Chessum & Barbeary/Simmonds Randall & Daly :oops: Given the paucity of a cutting edge a fresh pack to stifle Ireland may be the best available option to win the game but frankly........its meh
Does Yoda have faith in Slade/Malins to cover 10 for 70+ mins if Smith gets steamrolled by Aki first up??

What an indictment of Yoda's player development skills since 2019 it all is.

If we lose these last 2 games will the RFU have the gonads to ditch tinkerman ?
Feisty opening post. Yoda and tinkerman.......Welcome!
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Mellsblue
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Re: Squad for Ireland

Post by Mellsblue »

Portcullis Irish wrote: If we lose these last 2 games will the RFU have the gonads to ditch tinkerman ?
I’ll plump for no.
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