Fiji

[Mikey Brown]

“Did enough good work to feel good about it” is only a questionable stance because actually holding on to the win was completely out of your hands. I guess it’s good to get that kick up the arse re: taking your foot off the gas, without actually losing a game.

My point there was that had the game been refereed well there would have been a different different set of events taking place (as various sanctions would have been made, or not, differently), leading to completely different tries being scored etc. I'm saying that during the course of the match we did enough good things to make me feel that we might well have won under that hypothetical perfect referee, so I'm justified in feeling good about the result.

And, yes, I really hope this does give them a kick up the arse re losing control at the end of a match. However they've had that same kick up the arse a number of times before and they haven't got this problem fixed. I'm not sure they even understand why it's happening.

Fair enough. These hypotheticals are always a bit dumb, as you say. I guess this was just such a stark example because of the way it finished.

Not much in the way of leaders on the bench perhaps? I had thought AWJ might be worth a spot in the squad for this alone. In the situation you need a calm voice in the last 20 and guys like Biggar may be off the field.

Favourites tags are weird. Fiji have looked good but it's hard to bank on a team like that in crunch games. I wouldn't expect joe public to know much about recent form or rankings, not like us infallible rugby geniuses on here.

[Sourdust]

That works both ways… watched it back last night. Wales should have had a pen prior to both late Fiji tries at end. Check out the no arm late charge on Tompkins just after he puts North in…. Persistant sealing off and off feet at ruck time… i could go on

Regardless of opinion on Gareth Davies' dramatic reaction to the high tackle, it WAS a high tackle, with significant head contact, and probably should have been a yellow. The Fijian player then picking Davies up off the floor to "show" that he was faking, should have been an automatic yellow AT LEAST.

Fiji could have spent 10 min with 13 men, and no-one could have complained.

This doesn't disprove that Wales got away with stuff - we absolutely did - but it's the most succinct of several possible counterpoints.

[Sourdust]

Favourites tags are weird. Fiji have looked good but it's hard to bank on a team like that in crunch games. I wouldn't expect joe public to know much about recent form or rankings, not like us infallible rugby geniuses on here.

A fair point, but we're probably not talking about "Joe Public" casuals here. There was PLENTY of teasing (some friendly, some gleefully spiteful) about Wales being ranked below (and WELL below) Fiji, that the order was changing etc. Journalists and fans widely expected Fiji to win. Planet Rugby picked them by 3points!

It so very nearly happened, of course. A butterfly flapped its wings in China, etc. Except this time, it fell Wales' way for a change. Sorry about that!

[Sandydragon]

We only won the championship a couple of years ago because of red cards. Whatever. Other teams struggled with discipline whereas we didn’t for four games.

The media was far happy when we were plucky losers than when we actually win things.

[Son of Mathonwy]

“Did enough good work to feel good about it” is only a questionable stance because actually holding on to the win was completely out of your hands. I guess it’s good to get that kick up the arse re: taking your foot off the gas, without actually losing a game.

My point there was that had the game been refereed well there would have been a different different set of events taking place (as various sanctions would have been made, or not, differently), leading to completely different tries being scored etc. I'm saying that during the course of the match we did enough good things to make me feel that we might well have won under that hypothetical perfect referee, so I'm justified in feeling good about the result.

And, yes, I really hope this does give them a kick up the arse re losing control at the end of a match. However they've had that same kick up the arse a number of times before and they haven't got this problem fixed. I'm not sure they even understand why it's happening.

Fair enough. These hypotheticals are always a bit dumb, as you say. I guess this was just such a stark example because of the way it finished.

Not much in the way of leaders on the bench perhaps? I had thought AWJ might be worth a spot in the squad for this alone. In the situation you need a calm voice in the last 20 and guys like Biggar may be off the field.

Favourites tags are weird. Fiji have looked good but it's hard to bank on a team like that in crunch games. I wouldn't expect joe public to know much about recent form or rankings, not like us infallible rugby geniuses on here.

The thing is the collapse happened after Biggar went off. Not saying there's a causal relationship there though.

When we blew it against Australia it was kicked off by Tipuric getting carded. And the last minute loss to France a couple of years back happened when Faletau was carded. Clearly being a man (or two) down is a factor but it might be worth checking who was or wasn't still on the pitch when these events occurred. Could be luck, could be character/experience/temperament . . . ?

[Numbers]

That works both ways… watched it back last night. Wales should have had a pen prior to both late Fiji tries at end. Check out the no arm late charge on Tompkins just after he puts North in…. Persistant sealing off and off feet at ruck time… i could go on

Regardless of opinion on Gareth Davies' dramatic reaction to the high tackle, it WAS a high tackle, with significant head contact, and probably should have been a yellow. The Fijian player then picking Davies up off the floor to "show" that he was faking, should have been an automatic yellow AT LEAST.

Fiji could have spent 10 min with 13 men, and no-one could have complained.

This doesn't disprove that Wales got away with stuff - we absolutely did - but it's the most succinct of several possible counterpoints.

That is innacurate, the contact was with his neck, no yellow was required just a penalty, Davies should be castigated for his feigning of injury imo and I am a Scarlets supporter. This is not the way we want rugby to go or at least those who don't want it to become like football.

This and idiotic things like the slow walk back after Fiji scored should be stamped out, we were lucky he didn't give them a free-kick on the halfway.

[Son of Mathonwy]

“Did enough good work to feel good about it” is only a questionable stance because actually holding on to the win was completely out of your hands. I guess it’s good to get that kick up the arse re: taking your foot off the gas, without actually losing a game.

My point there was that had the game been refereed well there would have been a different different set of events taking place (as various sanctions would have been made, or not, differently), leading to completely different tries being scored etc. I'm saying that during the course of the match we did enough good things to make me feel that we might well have won under that hypothetical perfect referee, so I'm justified in feeling good about the result.

And, yes, I really hope this does give them a kick up the arse re losing control at the end of a match. However they've had that same kick up the arse a number of times before and they haven't got this problem fixed. I'm not sure they even understand why it's happening.

That works both ways… watched it back last night. Wales should have had a pen prior to both late Fiji tries at end. Check out the no arm late charge on Tompkins just after he puts North in…. Persistant sealing off and off feet at ruck time… i could go on

Exactly, the bad refereeing went both ways.

Unfortunately the visibility of the bad refereeing varied. The problems Fiji got from questionable calls were a bit more obvious to the viewer (minutes spent watching the TMO disallow tries or Wales getting a lot of penalties but a delayed yellow) whereas the penalties Fiji should have had were simply missed by the ref and commentary team.