RFU close 3 academies

[Banquo]

Is there any good news in English rugby? It is beginning to feel like we are following Australia into oblivion.

We've got a phenomenal group of young players coming through, the sabotage of the Dean Ryan years appears to be subsiding, and the last couple of games of the 6N is suggesting that the coaching group might know what they're doing. There's been a new TV deal signed for Prem rugby so there's no chance of them being homeless, and crowd numbers have stabilised after COVID.

If we can see some international success, interest will start going up again - English casual fans don't follow a minority sport where England are losing. We can get back into a growth spiral again if Sleek Backcombing can bring the results.

Let's not dwell on where the game might be if he can't though. Posssibly the most crucial 4 years in English rugby ever coming up.

Puja

And woman’s rugby top to bottom.

Yep, lots of money being thrown at the top end of the women’s game, more than 3 x than allocated to the Champ.

[Epaminondas Pules]

Just read the letter itself - that is appalling. "We haven't yet decided where the boundaries will be drawn and will get back to you at some point with that. Once we've done that, you need to phone your nearest club and ask for a space, cause we're certainly not helping anyone with anything, least of all making sure you're got somewhere to land. Byeeeeeeeeee."

Puja

It is the RFU, did you expect anything other than appalling?

Rarely, but this is a new and exciting low. It's not a great decision in the first place, but they've made it so much worse by doing it ineptly.

Puja

Totally agree mate. Utter fuck up!

[Banquo]

It is the RFU, did you expect anything other than appalling?

Rarely, but this is a new and exciting low. It's not a great decision in the first place, but they've made it so much worse by doing it ineptly.

Puja

Totally agree mate. Utter fuck up!

PRL forced it.

[fivepointer]

Just read the letter itself - that is appalling. "We haven't yet decided where the boundaries will be drawn and will get back to you at some point with that. Once we've done that, you need to phone your nearest club and ask for a space, cause we're certainly not helping anyone with anything, least of all making sure you're got somewhere to land. Byeeeeeeeeee."

Puja

Yep, its utterly appalling.

The RFU should surely be able to do better than that?

Was any serious consideration given to a Championship club taking over? I'm sure Ealing, Coventry and Hartpury would have been interested.

[Banquo]

Just read the letter itself - that is appalling. "We haven't yet decided where the boundaries will be drawn and will get back to you at some point with that. Once we've done that, you need to phone your nearest club and ask for a space, cause we're certainly not helping anyone with anything, least of all making sure you're got somewhere to land. Byeeeeeeeeee."

Puja

Yep, its utterly appalling.

The RFU should surely be able to do better than that?

Was any serious consideration given to a Championship club taking over? I'm sure Ealing, Coventry and Hartpury would have been interested.

as above, PRL forced it as part of the PGP.

Coventry are furious. Hartpury wouldnt be that interested. Also, this was mooted at least 3 months ago, so why it wasnt planned or communicated better is odd.

[Mellsblue]

Only the RFU could get into a situation in which they give £millions to another party and let that party dictate to them.

[Banquo]

Only the RFU could get into a situation in which they give £millions to another party and let that party dictate to them.

....the other party holds a lot of cards, are extremely venal- though desperate.....you wouldn't start from here.

[Epaminondas Pules]

Rarely, but this is a new and exciting low. It's not a great decision in the first place, but they've made it so much worse by doing it ineptly.

Puja

Totally agree mate. Utter fuck up!

PRL forced it.

I've heard it was very much mutual, that RFU were looking for an excuse to offload the costs, though this wasn't universally agreed with in the RFU.

[Banquo]

Totally agree mate. Utter fuck up!

PRL forced it.

I've heard it was very much mutual, that RFU were looking for an excuse to offload the costs, though this wasn't universally agreed with in the RFU.

Not what I hear, but a condition of RfU controlling u20's dev pathway But a real show stopper for PRL, also insisting on no Champ academies.

[Epaminondas Pules]

PRL forced it.

I've heard it was very much mutual, that RFU were looking for an excuse to offload the costs, though this wasn't universally agreed with in the RFU.

Not what I hear, but a condition of RfU controlling u20's dev pathway But a real show stopper for PRL, also insisting on no Champ academies.

The no Champ acads has gone down like a shit sandwich

[Mellsblue]

I've heard it was very much mutual, that RFU were looking for an excuse to offload the costs, though this wasn't universally agreed with in the RFU.

Not what I hear, but a condition of RfU controlling u20's dev pathway But a real show stopper for PRL, also insisting on no Champ academies.

The no Champ acads has gone down like a shit sandwich

A sandwich where the filling is shit but the bread is also actually shit.

[Which Tyler]

The no Champ acads has gone down like a shit sandwich

Quite rightly too. It's absolutely the sort of bullshit that the new agreement is supposed to be putting a stop to

[Epaminondas Pules]

The no Champ acads has gone down like a shit sandwich

Quite rightly too. It's absolutely the sort of bullshit that the new agreement is supposed to be putting a stop to

The whole thing is a monumental fuck up and I think serves to highlight that PRL, the RFU and PRL + RFU are an utter shit show in every combination.

That is harsh cause there is some good things in there, but they are more interested in themselves than the game.

[Margin_Walker]

For me, even before you get to the Champ issue, if you want the extra territory, you need to be absorbing the kids and the costs.

As it stands it looks likely that only a proportion of the players will get picked up, even if it does logistically work for them. You've also got plenty of DPP and U18 coaches seemingly now looking for work after the announcement. Effectively the only interest of the clubs in forcing this seems to be increasing their catchment, so they can catch a few more potential superstars. Without being made to fully commit to keeping existing structures running for the overall health of the game.

They get to have their cake and eat it.

[Epaminondas Pules]

For me, even before you get to the Champ issue, if you want the extra territory, you need to be absorbing the kids and the costs.

As it stands it looks likely that only a proportion of the players will get picked up, even if it does logistically work for them. You've also got plenty of DPP and U18 coaches seemingly now looking for work after the announcement. Effectively the only interest of the clubs in forcing this seems to be increasing their catchment, so they can catch a few more potential superstars. Without being made to fully commit to keeping existing structures running for the overall health of the game.

They get to have their cake and eat it.

Which is odd cause they'd get first dibs on any coming out of those academies anyway, Like Sarries have with the best talent from the old L Irish one. Yes they'll lose some to higher bidders, but it'll be marginal.

Narrowing the pool through DPP and academies won't necessarily concentrate the best talent.

[Margin_Walker]

Yep. I know Offiah seems to be Bath bound, but guys like Griffin/Adegbemile (last summer) and Tuipulotu (this summer by all accounts) are being picked up by Sarries.

I assume we'll never know, but it would be interesting to one day just how many kids are taken out of the pathways as a result of this change at a young age. And how many fewer DPP slots there will be overall going forward. I'd venture it will be a lot.

[Puja]

For me, even before you get to the Champ issue, if you want the extra territory, you need to be absorbing the kids and the costs.

As it stands it looks likely that only a proportion of the players will get picked up, even if it does logistically work for them. You've also got plenty of DPP and U18 coaches seemingly now looking for work after the announcement. Effectively the only interest of the clubs in forcing this seems to be increasing their catchment, so they can catch a few more potential superstars. Without being made to fully commit to keeping existing structures running for the overall health of the game.

They get to have their cake and eat it.

Which is odd cause they'd get first dibs on any coming out of those academies anyway, Like Sarries have with the best talent from the old L Irish one. Yes they'll lose some to higher bidders, but it'll be marginal.

Narrowing the pool through DPP and academies won't necessarily concentrate the best talent.

It's not about the academy products themselves, but about ring-fencing themselves as top-flight clubs. If Prem 2 becomes a thing, then it is likely going to involve promotion and relegation again and none of the existing top 10 fancy themselves as future Prem 2 fodder. If only they have academies, then it puts the other X clubs at a massive disadvantage and ensures that they can never become truly competitive or establish themselves in the top tier. This way, one of the "elite 10" may have to go down for one season, but they'll be guaranteed of bouncing straight back up again and not losing their status.

Rather reduce the entire pie than run the risk that they might not be one of the ones getting the biggest share.

Puja

[Margin_Walker]

Well, yeah. That too Puja.

It's a huge advantage for a second tier club over the rest*, which they'd clearly like to retain should promotion and relegation ever be a thing again.

*edit- something not lost on me whenever LI were in the Championship!

[Epaminondas Pules]

Hence PRL only looking after their own interests, rather than the game.

[Banquo]

Also have to think through the consequences of 35 + 12, DCMS repayments....you wouldn't start from here.

[Epaminondas Pules]

Was speaking to a few, now, ex-Mids academy (Wuss), and apparently Glous were offered it, and it got pretty close to being a done deal, until the RFU stiffed them on cost / price. Would have given them access all the way through to Sutton Coldfield in Brum. Lots of Hartpury student actually are in the old Wuss acedemy, plus Bromsgrove, and the King Eddies in Brum.

[Banquo]

Was speaking to a few, now, ex-Mids academy (Wuss), and apparently Glous were offered it, and it got pretty close to being a done deal, until the RFU stiffed them on cost / price. Would have given them access all the way through to Sutton Coldfield in Brum. Lots of Hartpury student actually are in the old Wuss acedemy, plus Bromsgrove, and the King Eddies in Brum.

If the RFU give (more) money to glaws to expand an academy which benefits er Glaws, who loses that money? They have increased funding via PGP for other PRL academies that said.
That said, be good to know the ‘deal’ actually offered.

[SixAndAHalf]

This kind of thing is why I would rather the RFU ended or modified the domestic player rule and allowed some internationals to be funded by the French club.

[FKAS]

This kind of thing is why I would rather the RFU ended or modified the domestic player rule and allowed some internationals to be funded by the French club.

Creates open season on the best English players and you end up with a Welsh Region style death spiral.

[Puja]

This kind of thing is why I would rather the RFU ended or modified the domestic player rule and allowed some internationals to be funded by the French club.

Creates open season on the best English players and you end up with a Welsh Region style death spiral.

While I agree, we do already have one thread that has turned into discussion about the rule on foreign-based English players and the repercussions of changing it (Toulouse vs Exeter), so let's not have a parallel thread here.

Puja