Argentina tour

[Captainhaircut]

I think Charlie Atkinson gets a bit of a harsh review on here. He’s only 1-1.5 years older than Benson and Donoghue. I thought he went really well against Ireland A and has looked decent for me the last few times he’s started for Gloucs.

His issue is that he’s not getting a run of games but then neither do Benson or Donoghue. I would take Atkinson as Ford back up and take Donoghue as a full back option, likely starting him against USA.

[Mellsblue]

Ford’s been hard done by internationally full stop. Messed around due to the wooden soldier/auxiliary flanker/test match ice animal for England and then unlucky to have Gatland as head coach for the Lions when in his pomp.
All that a due to some perceived worries about his goal kicking and d when you could argue he’s been consistently the best 10 in the world over the span of his career.
It pisses me off no end.

[Danno]

Ford’s been hard done by internationally full stop. Messed around due to the wooden soldier/auxiliary flanker/test match ice manimal for England and then unlucky to have Gatland as head coach for the Lions when in his pomp.
All that a due to some perceived worries about his goal kicking and d when you could argue he’s been consistently the best 10 in the world over the span of his career.
It pisses me off no end.

Bang on. All of it.

[FKAS]

I think Charlie Atkinson gets a bit of a harsh review on here. He’s only 1-1.5 years older than Benson and Donoghue. I thought he went really well against Ireland A and has looked decent for me the last few times he’s started for Gloucs.

His issue is that he’s not getting a run of games but then neither do Benson or Donoghue. I would take Atkinson as Ford back up and take Donoghue as a full back option, likely starting him against USA.

I think with Atkinson it's frustration. He's been given opportunities, plenty of them, and generally blown it. Inconsistency, inability to fix fundamental issues in his game. He's still young and he could overcome those bits, kick on etc. Yet Tigers released him because they didn't have confidence in him (he lost out to utility back Shillcock) and then Glaws have so much confidence in him they've signed a marquee 10 for next season.

Benson and Donoghue have less experience and have developed a bit later but when given a chance have grabbed it and run with it.

[Which Tyler]

Ford’s been hard done by internationally full stop. Messed around due to the wooden soldier/auxiliary flanker/test match ice animal for England and then unlucky to have Gatland as head coach for the Lions when in his pomp.
All that a due to some perceived worries about his goal kicking and d when you could argue he’s been consistently the best 10 in the world over the span of his career.
It pisses me off no end.

[Captainhaircut]

Had a look and we took 36 to Japan/NZ with 6 props, 3 hookers, 4 locks, 7 back row, 3 9s, 2 10s, 4 centres, 4 wings and 3 full backs (with Furbank offering 10 cover)

Assuming a similar split, I’m thinking something like the below. Possible that we take a few extra with USA being last and therefore giving us the possibility of letting a few players go home if we want. Other names that would surely be in the mix then would probably be the likes of Woodward, RMW and Elliott. Unclear on Kpoku’s availability- noise on him signing for Sale has gone quiet but they will surely be signing a lock with Hill and Du Preez x 2 leaving.

Baxter, Rodd, iyogun
George, Langdon, Dan
Heyes, AOF, Afo
CCS, Clark
Coles, Lockett
Underhill, THill, Kenningham
BCurry, Pepper
Willis, Barbeary
JVP, Quirke, Randall
Ford, CAtkinson
Dingwall, SAtkinson
Beard, Ojomoh
Muir, OHC
Roebuck, Murley
Furbank, Carpenter, Donoghue

[Puja]

I think Charlie Atkinson gets a bit of a harsh review on here. He’s only 1-1.5 years older than Benson and Donoghue. I thought he went really well against Ireland A and has looked decent for me the last few times he’s started for Gloucs.

His issue is that he’s not getting a run of games but then neither do Benson or Donoghue. I would take Atkinson as Ford back up and take Donoghue as a full back option, likely starting him against USA.

I think with Atkinson it's frustration. He's been given opportunities, plenty of them, and generally blown it. Inconsistency, inability to fix fundamental issues in his game. He's still young and he could overcome those bits, kick on etc. Yet Tigers released him because they didn't have confidence in him (he lost out to utility back Shillcock) and then Glaws have so much confidence in him they've signed a marquee 10 for next season.

Benson and Donoghue have less experience and have developed a bit later but when given a chance have grabbed it and run with it.

That's very much it - CAtkinson has much more experience and is possibly a better player right this second, but does not currently look as if he's ever going to be a starting Prem 10, let alone someone who might challenge for international honours. I'm willing to eat my words if he kicks on, and Haircut's right that he still has time to do that, but as things stand it's not looking likely.

Benson and Donoghue may not ever make it either, but at least with them we're starting from a position of hope.

Puja

[Mikey Brown]

Had a look and we took 36 to Japan/NZ with 6 props, 3 hookers, 4 locks, 7 back row, 3 9s, 2 10s, 4 centres, 4 wings and 3 full backs (with Furbank offering 10 cover)

Assuming a similar split, I’m thinking something like the below. Possible that we take a few extra with USA being last and therefore giving us the possibility of letting a few players go home if we want. Other names that would surely be in the mix then would probably be the likes of Woodward, RMW and Elliott. Unclear on Kpoku’s availability- noise on him signing for Sale has gone quiet but they will surely be signing a lock with Hill and Du Preez x 2 leaving.

Baxter, Rodd, iyogun
George, Langdon, Dan
Heyes, AOF, Afo
CCS, Clark
Coles, Lockett
Underhill, THill, Kenningham
BCurry, Pepper
Willis, Barbeary
JVP, Quirke, Randall
Ford, CAtkinson
Dingwall, SAtkinson
Beard, Ojomoh
Muir, OHC
Roebuck, Murley
Furbank, Carpenter, Donoghue

Looks a pretty good squad to me.

Is Ojomoh not injured though? Dingwall can take either centre spot (and likely captain?) but not sure who else fits in. If Northmore isn’t already injured you can assume he will be. Butt, Woodward, Hartley?

[Which Tyler]

Is Ojomoh not injured though?

Yes, but ERTA of weeks, not months

[Banquo]

Ford’s been hard done by internationally full stop. Messed around due to the wooden soldier/auxiliary flanker/test match ice animal for England and then unlucky to have Gatland as head coach for the Lions when in his pomp.
All that a due to some perceived worries about his goal kicking and d when you could argue he’s been consistently the best 10 in the world over the span of his career.
It pisses me off no end.

Aye. Absolutely superb 10 and if it’s possible to be underrated with 98 caps…

[Banquo]

Had a look and we took 36 to Japan/NZ with 6 props, 3 hookers, 4 locks, 7 back row, 3 9s, 2 10s, 4 centres, 4 wings and 3 full backs (with Furbank offering 10 cover)

Assuming a similar split, I’m thinking something like the below. Possible that we take a few extra with USA being last and therefore giving us the possibility of letting a few players go home if we want. Other names that would surely be in the mix then would probably be the likes of Woodward, RMW and Elliott. Unclear on Kpoku’s availability- noise on him signing for Sale has gone quiet but they will surely be signing a lock with Hill and Du Preez x 2 leaving.

Baxter, Rodd, iyogun
George, Langdon, Dan
Heyes, AOF, Afo
CCS, Clark
Coles, Lockett
Underhill, THill, Kenningham
BCurry, Pepper
Willis, Barbeary
JVP, Quirke, Randall
Ford, CAtkinson
Dingwall, SAtkinson
Beard, Ojomoh
Muir, OHC
Roebuck, Murley
Furbank, Carpenter, Donoghue

Bit harsh on steward

[Captainhaircut]

Had a look and we took 36 to Japan/NZ with 6 props, 3 hookers, 4 locks, 7 back row, 3 9s, 2 10s, 4 centres, 4 wings and 3 full backs (with Furbank offering 10 cover)

Assuming a similar split, I’m thinking something like the below. Possible that we take a few extra with USA being last and therefore giving us the possibility of letting a few players go home if we want. Other names that would surely be in the mix then would probably be the likes of Woodward, RMW and Elliott. Unclear on Kpoku’s availability- noise on him signing for Sale has gone quiet but they will surely be signing a lock with Hill and Du Preez x 2 leaving.

Baxter, Rodd, iyogun
George, Langdon, Dan
Heyes, AOF, Afo
CCS, Clark
Coles, Lockett
Underhill, THill, Kenningham
BCurry, Pepper
Willis, Barbeary
JVP, Quirke, Randall
Ford, CAtkinson
Dingwall, SAtkinson
Beard, Ojomoh
Muir, OHC
Roebuck, Murley
Furbank, Carpenter, Donoghue

Bit harsh on steward

I just don’t see the value of taking him as a full back. He’s never going to be the style we want which was proven in the six nations with Daly and MSmith ahead of him.

He needs to move to centre if he wants any sort of international career.

[Banquo]

Had a look and we took 36 to Japan/NZ with 6 props, 3 hookers, 4 locks, 7 back row, 3 9s, 2 10s, 4 centres, 4 wings and 3 full backs (with Furbank offering 10 cover)

Assuming a similar split, I’m thinking something like the below. Possible that we take a few extra with USA being last and therefore giving us the possibility of letting a few players go home if we want. Other names that would surely be in the mix then would probably be the likes of Woodward, RMW and Elliott. Unclear on Kpoku’s availability- noise on him signing for Sale has gone quiet but they will surely be signing a lock with Hill and Du Preez x 2 leaving.

Baxter, Rodd, iyogun
George, Langdon, Dan
Heyes, AOF, Afo
CCS, Clark
Coles, Lockett
Underhill, THill, Kenningham
BCurry, Pepper
Willis, Barbeary
JVP, Quirke, Randall
Ford, CAtkinson
Dingwall, SAtkinson
Beard, Ojomoh
Muir, OHC
Roebuck, Murley
Furbank, Carpenter, Donoghue

Bit harsh on steward

I just don’t see the value of taking him as a full back. He’s never going to be the style we want which was proven in the six nations with Daly and MSmith ahead of him.

He needs to move to centre if he wants any sort of international career.

Not sure I agree with the style of dual playmaker tbh- and a plan b is always handy, plus its a new backline anyway.... and he's definitely improved his game at club level.

I don't really see him as a centre with his lack of agility, and even if I did, how does that happen? Hi Leicester, I know I'm a really good club 15, but forget that and drop Joe Woodward and give me a go? Change clubs?

I'd also have a look at Radwan.

[Which Tyler]

Do we think that having Blackett and McGuigan on the coaching staff for this tour will boost the chances of Bath & Sale players?

Specifically thinking of decisions like Obano vs Iyogun, Ewels vs Coles, Quirke vs Randall, Carpenter vs... well Carpenter vs De Glanville...

[Puja]

Do we know when the squad will be announced?

I'd imagine it'll be similar to previous years - a training squad announced after the final regular round of the Prem, with players selected just from the bottom 6 clubs, giving some of the fringe one week to impress before some of them are evicted for the players from the losing semi-finalists, then another tranche of entrances and exists after the final. I don't see Selects Belatedly doing anything too early, especially when there's likely to be Lions callups with the various injuries in the back end of the season and also potential runs of games/form which could bring someone into contention.


Here's a twist on the conversation so far - who are you hoping not to be selected? Ordinarily, I'd've said Dombrandt but, given Fisilau's unavailability, I don't know I'd be too distraught, especially if TWillis gets a late callup. I don't think he's the future, but he's still a good player and it is important to win as well. Slade as well - I absolutely do not want to see a Dingwall/Slade midfield, but as I said above, I can see the point of having him on tour as 10-cover. I'd prefer not to see Isiekwe, but that's a weird one, because it does still feel like there's a very good player somewhere in there that no-one's ever been able to unlock. I don't know if it was Eddie's treatment of him in South Africa that crippled his development, but it does feel like a waste if we can't ever get a good player out of him. If Stands ByHisMan reckons he can get him to kick on, I'm willing to trust his judgement.

The major one would've been Daly blocking one of the exciting young players and Gatland Farrell has taken care of that for us.

Puja

[Puja]

Had a look and we took 36 to Japan/NZ with 6 props, 3 hookers, 4 locks, 7 back row, 3 9s, 2 10s, 4 centres, 4 wings and 3 full backs (with Furbank offering 10 cover)

Assuming a similar split, I’m thinking something like the below. Possible that we take a few extra with USA being last and therefore giving us the possibility of letting a few players go home if we want. Other names that would surely be in the mix then would probably be the likes of Woodward, RMW and Elliott. Unclear on Kpoku’s availability- noise on him signing for Sale has gone quiet but they will surely be signing a lock with Hill and Du Preez x 2 leaving.

Baxter, Rodd, iyogun
George, Langdon, Dan
Heyes, AOF, Afo
CCS, Clark
Coles, Lockett
Underhill, THill, Kenningham
BCurry, Pepper
Willis, Barbeary
JVP, Quirke, Randall
Ford, CAtkinson
Dingwall, SAtkinson
Beard, Ojomoh
Muir, OHC
Roebuck, Murley
Furbank, Carpenter, Donoghue

Bit harsh on steward

I just don’t see the value of taking him as a full back. He’s never going to be the style we want which was proven in the six nations with Daly and MSmith ahead of him.

He needs to move to centre if he wants any sort of international career.

I mean, Carpenter's never going to be a playmaker either and, other than a 40m sprint, I don't see him as better at anything than Steward.

Steward has kicked on a tremendous amount this season with his handling and playmaking - he might not ever be Furbank or MSmith at 15, but he's definitely our third-best full-back by a large distance, and his development does need to be rewarded.

Puja

[Danno]

Ford’s been hard done by internationally full stop. Messed around due to the wooden soldier/auxiliary flanker/test match ice animal for England and then unlucky to have Gatland as head coach for the Lions when in his pomp.
All that a due to some perceived worries about his goal kicking and d when you could argue he’s been consistently the best 10 in the world over the span of his career.
It pisses me off no end.

Aye. Absolutely superb 10 and if it’s possible to be underrated with 98 caps…

Yep, we should have built around him from 2013 but he got the yips kicking at goal in one game in the 2014 6N and ever since he's been more of an 'if we have to' selection. I'm pretty confident that if Manu was fit or if another real IC was available he'd have been warming the bench for about 9 years

[Banquo]

Bit harsh on steward

I just don’t see the value of taking him as a full back. He’s never going to be the style we want which was proven in the six nations with Daly and MSmith ahead of him.

He needs to move to centre if he wants any sort of international career.

I mean, Carpenter's never going to be a playmaker either and, other than a 40m sprint, I don't see him as better at anything than Steward.

Steward has kicked on a tremendous amount this season with his handling and playmaking - he might not ever be Furbank or MSmith at 15, but he's definitely our third-best full-back by a large distance, and his development does need to be rewarded.

Puja

Who is the second best?

[TheDasher]

Had a look and we took 36 to Japan/NZ with 6 props, 3 hookers, 4 locks, 7 back row, 3 9s, 2 10s, 4 centres, 4 wings and 3 full backs (with Furbank offering 10 cover)

Assuming a similar split, I’m thinking something like the below. Possible that we take a few extra with USA being last and therefore giving us the possibility of letting a few players go home if we want. Other names that would surely be in the mix then would probably be the likes of Woodward, RMW and Elliott. Unclear on Kpoku’s availability- noise on him signing for Sale has gone quiet but they will surely be signing a lock with Hill and Du Preez x 2 leaving.

Baxter, Rodd, iyogun
George, Langdon, Dan
Heyes, AOF, Afo
CCS, Clark
Coles, Lockett
Underhill, THill, Kenningham
BCurry, Pepper
Willis, Barbeary
JVP, Quirke, Randall
Ford, CAtkinson
Dingwall, SAtkinson
Beard, Ojomoh
Muir, OHC
Roebuck, Murley
Furbank, Carpenter, Donoghue

Haven't really read the rest of the thread so apols if repeating anyone.

Happy with the props, at hooker I might take Blake over George.

Can't get onboard with CCS as a lock... might take Bamber as 4th choice if we're taking 4.

Back row, if he's fit, I'd take Pearson over Kenningham.

Side note, I think T Willis should be a lion, presumably he's not because he's new to intl rugby, but so's Pollock and T Willis has been phenomenal this year. Other than Conan, Farrell hasn't taken a big ball carrying No8. T Willis would hurt some Aussies and I think should've gone.

SHs look good, Ford and Donoghue for me with the Quins lad 3rd choice.

Radwan has to be in there, I'd say over Murley and maybe over OHC to be honest. I like OHC but I think Roebuck and Muir are both better and between those two and Freeman we have some big, strong wing options who are good in the air. Good to find another fire-cracker to back up IFW and Radwan is the man me thinks...

Steward has to be in - has had a tough run for England, he's so much better than he's shown at times, as we see for Tigers.

[jngf]

Had a look and we took 36 to Japan/NZ with 6 props, 3 hookers, 4 locks, 7 back row, 3 9s, 2 10s, 4 centres, 4 wings and 3 full backs (with Furbank offering 10 cover)

Assuming a similar split, I’m thinking something like the below. Possible that we take a few extra with USA being last and therefore giving us the possibility of letting a few players go home if we want. Other names that would surely be in the mix then would probably be the likes of Woodward, RMW and Elliott. Unclear on Kpoku’s availability- noise on him signing for Sale has gone quiet but they will surely be signing a lock with Hill and Du Preez x 2 leaving.

Baxter, Rodd, iyogun
George, Langdon, Dan
Heyes, AOF, Afo
CCS, Clark
Coles, Lockett
Underhill, THill, Kenningham
BCurry, Pepper
Willis, Barbeary
JVP, Quirke, Randall
Ford, CAtkinson
Dingwall, SAtkinson
Beard, Ojomoh
Muir, OHC
Roebuck, Murley
Furbank, Carpenter, Donoghue

Haven't really read the rest of the thread so apols if repeating anyone.

Happy with the props, at hooker I might take Blake over George.

Can't get onboard with CCS as a lock... might take Bamber as 4th choice if we're taking 4.

Back row, if he's fit, I'd take Pearson over Kenningham.

Side note, I think T Willis should be a lion, presumably he's not because he's new to intl rugby, but so's Pollock and T Willis has been phenomenal this year. Other than Conan, Farrell hasn't taken a big ball carrying No8. T Willis would hurt some Aussies and I think should've gone.

SHs look good, Ford and Donoghue for me with the Quins lad 3rd choice.

Radwan has to be in there, I'd say over Murley and maybe over OHC to be honest. I like OHC but I think Roebuck and Muir are both better and between those two and Freeman we have some big, strong wing options who are good in the air. Good to find another fire-cracker to back up IFW and Radwan is the man me thinks...

Steward has to be in - has had a tough run for England, he's so much better than he's shown at times, as we see for Tigers.

Hi Dasher, really interested to get your perspective as to why you think that’s the case? - I think if CCS’ paired with an expert lineout jumper/tactician in the other lock berth he would add real value - certainly see him as a step up from Martin who for me is really rather limited at test level and CCS offers much, much better carrying without much loss in physical presence.

[Mellsblue]

As we all know, I’m not Steward’s biggest fan but, in my opinion, he’s still the best 15 behind Furbank, who may not even be fit to go. I also wouldn’t use the attack as the reason to drop him as he’s come on loads in that regard and there’s little tweaks that can be made to accommodate the different styles of player. It’s not as if it would need wholesale changes to the attacking shape.
Now if you were to say drop him due to him being a human oil tanker in d then I could understand that…
I’d also understand the argument for seeing what Carpenter can do as I think he has a higher ceiling but Steward, along with Ford, may well be the only experienced international in the bank line.

[Puja]

Haven't really read the rest of the thread so apols if repeating anyone.

How dare you! It's 100% gold!

Happy with the props, at hooker I might take Blake over George.

Can't get onboard with CCS as a lock... might take Bamber as 4th choice if we're taking 4.

Back row, if he's fit, I'd take Pearson over Kenningham.

Side note, I think T Willis should be a lion, presumably he's not because he's new to intl rugby, but so's Pollock and T Willis has been phenomenal this year. Other than Conan, Farrell hasn't taken a big ball carrying No8. T Willis would hurt some Aussies and I think should've gone.

SHs look good, Ford and Donoghue for me with the Quins lad 3rd choice.

Radwan has to be in there, I'd say over Murley and maybe over OHC to be honest. I like OHC but I think Roebuck and Muir are both better and between those two and Freeman we have some big, strong wing options who are good in the air. Good to find another fire-cracker to back up IFW and Radwan is the man me thinks...

Steward has to be in - has had a tough run for England, he's so much better than he's shown at times, as we see for Tigers.

Agreed with most of that, but I will repeat my comments from earlier in the thread as you didn't see them - I'd like to see whether it is possible to get a lock out of CCS while keeping most of the carrying and tackling. We've got so many back rows and so few powerful locks that I think it's worth the experiment. Might not work, but now's a really good opportunity to find out, and then at least we'd know going forwards.

Puja

[Puja]

I just don’t see the value of taking him as a full back. He’s never going to be the style we want which was proven in the six nations with Daly and MSmith ahead of him.

He needs to move to centre if he wants any sort of international career.

I mean, Carpenter's never going to be a playmaker either and, other than a 40m sprint, I don't see him as better at anything than Steward.

Steward has kicked on a tremendous amount this season with his handling and playmaking - he might not ever be Furbank or MSmith at 15, but he's definitely our third-best full-back by a large distance, and his development does need to be rewarded.

Puja

Who is the second best?

If we are building a team around having a second playmaker at 15, and seeking to replace Furbank without rearranging the team, then MSmith is. But that is specific to the situation, rather than in general. On potential, I think MSmith could be better full-stop, but I couldn't argue that today.

Puja

[TheDasher]

Had a look and we took 36 to Japan/NZ with 6 props, 3 hookers, 4 locks, 7 back row, 3 9s, 2 10s, 4 centres, 4 wings and 3 full backs (with Furbank offering 10 cover)

Assuming a similar split, I’m thinking something like the below. Possible that we take a few extra with USA being last and therefore giving us the possibility of letting a few players go home if we want. Other names that would surely be in the mix then would probably be the likes of Woodward, RMW and Elliott. Unclear on Kpoku’s availability- noise on him signing for Sale has gone quiet but they will surely be signing a lock with Hill and Du Preez x 2 leaving.

Baxter, Rodd, iyogun
George, Langdon, Dan
Heyes, AOF, Afo
CCS, Clark
Coles, Lockett
Underhill, THill, Kenningham
BCurry, Pepper
Willis, Barbeary
JVP, Quirke, Randall
Ford, CAtkinson
Dingwall, SAtkinson
Beard, Ojomoh
Muir, OHC
Roebuck, Murley
Furbank, Carpenter, Donoghue

Haven't really read the rest of the thread so apols if repeating anyone.

Happy with the props, at hooker I might take Blake over George.

Can't get onboard with CCS as a lock... might take Bamber as 4th choice if we're taking 4.

Back row, if he's fit, I'd take Pearson over Kenningham.

Side note, I think T Willis should be a lion, presumably he's not because he's new to intl rugby, but so's Pollock and T Willis has been phenomenal this year. Other than Conan, Farrell hasn't taken a big ball carrying No8. T Willis would hurt some Aussies and I think should've gone.

SHs look good, Ford and Donoghue for me with the Quins lad 3rd choice.

Radwan has to be in there, I'd say over Murley and maybe over OHC to be honest. I like OHC but I think Roebuck and Muir are both better and between those two and Freeman we have some big, strong wing options who are good in the air. Good to find another fire-cracker to back up IFW and Radwan is the man me thinks...

Steward has to be in - has had a tough run for England, he's so much better than he's shown at times, as we see for Tigers.

Hi Dasher, really interested to get your perspective as to why you think that’s the case? - I think if CCS’ paired with an expert lineout jumper/tactician in the other lock berth he would add real value - certainly see him as a step up from Martin who for me is really rather limited at test level and CCS offers much, much better carrying without much loss in physical presence.

I've said before that Martin hasn't proved himself yet, I'm with you on that - apart from occasionally melting someone he's doesn't do quite enough for me. With you on that one.

I want big, rangy locks that work bloody hard, dominate mauls in attack and defence, have great engines, can either soar high in the lineout or lift bloody high. CCS for me is a ball-carrier, he doesn't have a great engine, he doesn't seem to me to have a dominant tight game and I'm not sure he's a great ball player either. Chessum is a better player than CCS by a country mile in my view but he doesn't carry hard and looks lanky and ginger... I also think baring in mind Itoje will always play/start, having a 6'5 lock (Itoje) and a 6'4 lock (CCS) just ultimately seems a bit piddly too... Against the Boks or France in a WC Semi, I think you'd feel a little underpowered ultimately, there's a reason that no top tier nations field lock pairings of that size.

Personally I prefer Ted Hill to CCS at 6 too, I think CCS is an 8 ultimately.

[FKAS]

Bit harsh on steward

I just don’t see the value of taking him as a full back. He’s never going to be the style we want which was proven in the six nations with Daly and MSmith ahead of him.

He needs to move to centre if he wants any sort of international career.

I mean, Carpenter's never going to be a playmaker either and, other than a 40m sprint, I don't see him as better at anything than Steward.

Steward has kicked on a tremendous amount this season with his handling and playmaking - he might not ever be Furbank or MSmith at 15, but he's definitely our third-best full-back by a large distance, and his development does need to be rewarded.

Puja

Agreed on Carpenter, as I've said before. The England backline is likely to be down a playmaker, a long range kicking option, experience and a physical carrying option this summer with Furbank/M Smith/Daly/Lawrence all out of contention. Steward adds experience (30+ caps), a big boot and a physical carrying option. Helps cover for quite a bit we'll be without. We could add an additional playmaker into the midfield to help balance overall as we don't really have a strong carrying option there. Carpenter, whilst a good player, doesn't really offer the things we need cover for.

The other option would be to recall Slade to play in the centre but I don't think anybody wants that.