England vs South Africa

[WaspInWales]

Anyone else feeling just a bit pessimistic about our chances this autumn?

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35 - 18 to the Saffas?

Sounds about right.

I think we're on for a dry humping.

The perfect preparation for NZ next week.

[Lizard]

Ok. So the English media is having a crack at Hansen for handing out test caps like confetti yet your guy can’t even find enough fit players to make a coherent XXIII. And the All Blacks’ back row tonight will have more caps than England’s.

[CONVEX HULL]

Ok. So the English media is having a crack at Hansen for handing out test caps like confetti yet your guy can’t even find enough fit players to make a coherent XXIII. And the All Blacks’ back row tonight will have more caps than England’s.

What has that got to do with England vs SA?

[Digby]

Not if Te'o goes off early it doesn't. And he will.

When he does, the options are either moving Daly to centre with Ashton to full-back or Farrell to centre and Ford to fly half.
Ashton often played at 15 for Toulon, but I'd prefer not to move Daly.
Or maybe Nowell to full-back?

I'd've thought Nowell to centre would be a more likely option. Eddie did go through that phase of naming Nowell in squad with the "inside backs" and it would likely be the least disruptive option.

Puja

Nowell might move in if Eddie wants to see Farrell remain at standoff but Ford coming on and Farrell going wider is surely the least disruptive

[Stom]

When he does, the options are either moving Daly to centre with Ashton to full-back or Farrell to centre and Ford to fly half.
Ashton often played at 15 for Toulon, but I'd prefer not to move Daly.
Or maybe Nowell to full-back?

I'd've thought Nowell to centre would be a more likely option. Eddie did go through that phase of naming Nowell in squad with the "inside backs" and it would likely be the least disruptive option.

Puja

Nowell might move in if Eddie wants to see Farrell remain at standoff but Ford coming on and Farrell going wider is surely the least disruptive

And have Ford, Farrell, Slade? I'd rather disrupt...

[Digby]

I nearly added it was sadly given previous selections it was the least disruptive, but given Ford, Farrell and Slade as the midfield front three has game time it'd be the least disruptive, even if one thought it sub optimal

[Mr Mwenda]

Seems a decent enough side. I don't believe anyone omitted would make a difference on their own. It's about how the team plays together and i can understand a preference for people familiar with the systems. C'mon England!

[fivepointer]

Robert Kitson on the game https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2018/ ... ernational

"There are those at Twickenham, including some senior figures, who are already weary of the Jones era and will shed few tears when it is time to part company.

This was not the anticipated legacy when Jones arrived but, latterly, the head coach has resembled a frustrated angler for whom the fish have stopped biting. The final bill for last summer’s losing tour in South Africa was apparently far in excess of the supposed budget and the expensive hiring of John Mitchell also prompted internal RFU disquiet. No one disputes Jones’s expertise as a turnaround specialist but sustaining that initial success remains a work-on. Take this week’s hiring of Will Carling as a leadership mentor: if it works then fair play but there is more than a whiff of headline-grabbing short-termism about it. If Owen Farrell needs any advice on elite captaincy it would be far easier – and cheaper – to call his father"

Beat South Africa and stand up to the All Blacks and Jonestown becomes a happy-clappy place once again. If, alternatively, England start limply, their new combinations struggle and the crowd grows impatient, it will be harder to pacify those wondering how many clothes the emperor is actually wearing.

Unfairly fine margins? Inflated expectations at odds with reality? Possibly. Jones is hardly the first England coach to suffer from the conflicting interests of club and country. But let it be remembered England are still the best resourced rugby nation on the planet. No other nation could have spent this past week training in foreign climes with no expense spared. The players do look impressively fit but, frankly, so they should. Rather more pertinent, even more so than Saturday’s result, is how they collectively perform"

[Mikey Brown]

It’s weird seeing everyone in the media so openly pessimistic. I was feeling pretty negative before it was even cool man, way back in 2016.

In turn my expectations have sunk so low I’ve already got a bit bored of it, I actually look at this team now and think yeah with a bit of work we could become definitely not totally shit?

We’ll spank them today. We’ll end up with a midfield of Farrell/Teo/Nowell and show off some slick backs moves with glorious handling.

[Oakboy]

Rather more pertinent, even more so than Saturday’s result, is how they collectively perform"

Result OR performance? No!

At this stage, it should be a given that every time England take the field they are prepared for a 'best-possible' collective performance. The selection should be fully resolved, the system totally familiar and the mind-set 100% solid behind the coaching set-up.

Basically, if we are capable of winning we should win. That is what Jones has spent three years on, surely? Whatever state the team unit is in, it is his fault and nobody else's. Should we be capable of winning this match? Yes, definitely, even with the injuries.

IMO, we will know after the first ten minutes whether the players are fully on board. I am desperate to be hopeful but . . .

[Digby]

Wtf are we getting reports the RFU are getting tired of Eddie? They hired him and they extended his contract, if they want talk about being rid of Eddie it should be rolled up into such arrangement getting rid of those that brought and then actively sought to retain him

[Oakboy]

It’s weird seeing everyone in the media so openly pessimistic. I was feeling pretty negative before it was even cool man, way back in 2016.

In turn my expectations have sunk so low I’ve already got a bit bored of it, I actually look at this team now and think yeah with a bit of work we could become definitely not totally shit?

We’ll spank them today. We’ll end up with a midfield of Farrell/Teo/Nowell and show off some slick backs moves with glorious handling.

I applaud your efforts to scrabble for optimism. Just to pick on one item, though: T'eo is 31, injury-prone and has only played a few minutes this season. His chances of going the full 80 against such a physical unit as SA, can't be great. I'd guess that Jones has his fingers crossed that he'll manage 60. Would anybody be surprised if he's off after 20?

[Oakboy]

Wtf are we getting reports the RFU are getting tired of Eddie? They hired him and they extended his contract, if they want talk about being rid of Eddie it should be rolled up into such arrangement getting rid of those that brought and then actively sought to retain him

I hope that it's just hot air but I'm a bit concerned that it might reflect the players' mood in the training camp. The RFU recruitment process has yet to function efficiently. Few would argue against a clear-out of individuals, I suspect.

[Puja]

It’s weird seeing everyone in the media so openly pessimistic. I was feeling pretty negative before it was even cool man, way back in 2016.

In turn my expectations have sunk so low I’ve already got a bit bored of it, I actually look at this team now and think yeah with a bit of work we could become definitely not totally shit?

We’ll spank them today. We’ll end up with a midfield of Farrell/Teo/Nowell and show off some slick backs moves with glorious handling.

I applaud your efforts to scrabble for optimism. Just to pick on one item, though: T'eo is 31, injury-prone and has only played a few minutes this season. His chances of going the full 80 against such a physical unit as SA, can't be great. I'd guess that Jones has his fingers crossed that he'll manage 60. Would anybody be surprised if he's off after 20?

After 20? I'm hoping that we haven't yet sent Stooke back to Bath so that we still have 8 subs when he inevitably pulls up in the warmup.

Puja

[Renniks]

After 20? I'm hoping that we haven't yet sent Stooke back to Bath so that we still have 8 subs when he inevitably pulls up in the warmup.

Puja

I've never considered what would happen if a player pulls up in warm-up for a home international…

Has it happened in recent times?

[Puja]

After 20? I'm hoping that we haven't yet sent Stooke back to Bath so that we still have 8 subs when he inevitably pulls up in the warmup.

Puja

I've never considered what would happen if a player pulls up in warm-up for a home international…

Has it happened in recent times?

It's the idea behind keeping a squad of 25 and not releasing the spare two back to the clubs, but since we've already used our backs substitute, Stooke's our only spare man.

I can't think of it happening in recent memory though.

Puja

[Digby]

After 20? I'm hoping that we haven't yet sent Stooke back to Bath so that we still have 8 subs when he inevitably pulls up in the warmup.

Puja

I've never considered what would happen if a player pulls up in warm-up for a home international…

Has it happened in recent times?

It's the idea behind keeping a squad of 25 and not releasing the spare two back to the clubs, but since we've already used our backs substitute, Stooke's our only spare man.

I can't think of it happening in recent memory though.

Puja

Surely they'll have had a word with someone located nearby of a reasonable standard in the backs if not simply calling up another?

[Mellsblue]

Anybody know which channel, if any, the game will be on in the US?

[francoisfou]

Ok, prediction time:

Me - Boks by 13

[p/d]

Curry will have a stormer and Nowell will be the pick of the backs

See us scrambling home but, by God, there will be some shit amongst the good.

Farrell’s kicking from hand will raise questions

[Timbo]

Where the hell do Sky Sports get their heights and weights from!? Sinckler 17 stone 11? Vermeulen 17 stone? Hepburn 15 stone 10?

Stupid.

[WaspInWales]

Boks by 15. Comfortable too

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[Scrumhead]

Nearly kick off so let’s all stop whinging and support the team.

[WaspInWales]

Ffs. I thought it was a 5pm kickoff. Stuck in Cardiff and it isn't going to be on in any pubs with Wales playing at the same time!

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[Mellsblue]

p/d must be loving those tracksuit tops.