RugbyRebels

Which Tyler wrote:

Raggs wrote:I'm still very much of the opinion that a youngsters first time in camp, regardless of game time, is going to be a positive experience.

This is NOT Colts level at the local club, where everyone gets a go

Thing is, given the way Daly has been playing at FB being rewarded with a start at 13, is the best way to send the message that not everyone gets a go to reinforce the message that if your face fits a spot will be found for you?

twitchy wrote:

Spent 2 games there for his club, 6 months ago, isn' reassuring me. Anyone feeling better?

Daly can play 13. He's got plenty of experience in the position. Jones hasnt picked him there for over 4 years so must have thought that he wasnt the best option available. His defence is the real problem.
Meanwhile a chance to give Lawrence a start in his preferred position - one in which he's got far more potential than Daly - is spurned.
Dont make much sense to me.

16th man wrote:

twitchy wrote:

Spent 2 games there for his club, 6 months ago, isn' reassuring me. Anyone feeling better?

I'm feeing better that Daly is not starting FB. He was good on the wing IIRC. I just dont think he's a natural FB, or last line of defence.

fivepointer wrote:Daly can play 13. He's got plenty of experience in the position. Jones hasnt picked him there for over 4 years so must have thought that he wasnt the best option available. His defence is the real problem.
Meanwhile a chance to give Lawrence a start in his preferred position - one in which he's got far more potential than Daly - is spurned.
Dont make much sense to me.

It does if you look at how we have set up our attacks. Slade has been a key distributor and decision maker off either Ford or Farrell behind the front rank of attacking forwards. Lawrence just doesn't possess a similar, or more likely, trusted skill set. I don't like putting Daly there, but you can see the logic.

loudnconfident wrote:

16th man wrote:

twitchy wrote:

Spent 2 games there for his club, 6 months ago, isn' reassuring me. Anyone feeling better?

I'm feeing better that Daly is not starting FB. He was good on the wing IIRC. I just dont think he's a natural FB, or last line of defence.

he was briefly one of the best wings in the world imo. Mind, I'm equally if not more worried with him at 13 in defence.

Ewels has 20 caps, wow!

twitchy wrote:

Good stuff!
(do you get a cut from Charlie or the DT )

Banquo wrote:

fivepointer wrote:Daly can play 13. He's got plenty of experience in the position. Jones hasnt picked him there for over 4 years so must have thought that he wasnt the best option available. His defence is the real problem.
Meanwhile a chance to give Lawrence a start in his preferred position - one in which he's got far more potential than Daly - is spurned.
Dont make much sense to me.

It does if you look at how we have set up our attacks. Slade has been a key distributor and decision maker off either Ford or Farrell behind the front rank of attacking forwards. Lawrence just doesn't possess a similar, or more likely, trusted skill set. I don't like putting Daly there, but you can see the logic.

Is he really a key distributor?

He made 3 passes against France and 4 against Wales. One of my gripes is that he doesnt get his hands on the ball enough for England.

fivepointer wrote:

Banquo wrote:

fivepointer wrote:Daly can play 13. He's got plenty of experience in the position. Jones hasnt picked him there for over 4 years so must have thought that he wasnt the best option available. His defence is the real problem.
Meanwhile a chance to give Lawrence a start in his preferred position - one in which he's got far more potential than Daly - is spurned.
Dont make much sense to me.

It does if you look at how we have set up our attacks. Slade has been a key distributor and decision maker off either Ford or Farrell behind the front rank of attacking forwards. Lawrence just doesn't possess a similar, or more likely, trusted skill set. I don't like putting Daly there, but you can see the logic.

Is he really a key distributor?

He made 3 passes against France and 4 against Wales. One of my gripes is that he doesnt get his hands on the ball enough for England.

If you look at when he touches it, and what he is doing in attack, that's the way he is set up. Whether he then chooses to run, or to kick, or to pass, or even not used, that's his role- he's chosen to run a fair bit more in those two games, and done pretty well in fairness.

Banquo wrote:

loudnconfident wrote:

16th man wrote:
Spent 2 games there for his club, 6 months ago, isn' reassuring me. Anyone feeling better?

I'm feeing better that Daly is not starting FB. He was good on the wing IIRC. I just dont think he's a natural FB, or last line of defence.

he was briefly one of the best wings in the world imo. Mind, I'm equally if not more worried with him at 13 in defence.

He is a quality footballer, he surprised us all on the wing with he well he delivered at top level, he's underwhelmed for some and flat out disappointed for others at 15. I'm not sold in advance 13 is a good position for him, never have been, but he is a quality so it's not impossible he'll work out there. And if he does work out there we've some interesting add ons to our current style. It looks easier in advance to just pick JJ, to me, but I'm wrong so often the broken clock theory looks at risk

Digby wrote:

Banquo wrote:

loudnconfident wrote: I'm feeing better that Daly is not starting FB. He was good on the wing IIRC. I just dont think he's a natural FB, or last line of defence.

he was briefly one of the best wings in the world imo. Mind, I'm equally if not more worried with him at 13 in defence.

He is a quality footballer, he surprised us all on the wing with he well he delivered at top level, he's underwhelmed for some and flat out disappointed for others at 15. I'm not sold in advance 13 is a good position for him, never have been, but he is a quality so it's not impossible he'll work out there. And if he does work out there we've some interesting add ons to our current style. It looks easier in advance to just pick JJ, to me, but I'm wrong so often the broken clock theory looks at risk

JJ is my default, and he could well fit into the system, and certainly offers something extra defensively.

I can only imagine Lawrence and, even more so, Odogwu, just aren't there yet with the off ball, positional stuff that we don't really see, and that seems so massively important to the structure with and without the ball.
As long as Daly has gotten over his tits for hands stint I've not got much of a problem with him at 13. He can certainly make a line break and the left footed kicker thing is useful...
Lawrence and Marchant both on the bench seems like it would end up in a lot of needless shuffling in the event of injury though. But I guess the starters are deemed flexible enough to cope.

Dan. Dan. Dan. wrote:I can only imagine Lawrence and, even more so, Odogwu, just aren't there yet with the off ball, positional stuff that we don't really see, and that seems so massively important to the structure with and without the ball.
As long as Daly has gotten over his tits for hands stint I've not got much of a problem with him at 13. He can certainly make a line break and the left footed kicker thing is useful...
Lawrence and Marchant both on the bench seems like it would end up in a lot of needless shuffling in the event of injury though. But I guess the starters are deemed flexible enough to cope.

Mr.23 is probably due to sit on the bench for 80 minutes whoever it is anyway...

I've been surprised Marchant hasn't been in more squads. He's quality

Dan. Dan. Dan. wrote:I can only imagine Lawrence and, even more so, Odogwu, just aren't there yet with the off ball, positional stuff that we don't really see, and that seems so massively important to the structure with and without the ball.
As long as Daly has gotten over his tits for hands stint I've not got much of a problem with him at 13. He can certainly make a line break and the left footed kicker thing is useful...
Lawrence and Marchant both on the bench seems like it would end up in a lot of needless shuffling in the event of injury though. But I guess the starters are deemed flexible enough to cope.

Daly covers all the back three and Marchant has played wing a lot. But yes, if Malins gets hurt, two changes; Lawrence sort of covers 12.

Banquo wrote:Lawrence sort of covers 12.

As does the 12

Mellsblue wrote:

Banquo wrote:Lawrence sort of covers 12.

As does the 12

at a push

Ireland have picked a back row containing Conan and VDF - England are home and dry!

Van Der flier is a great name, though.

It does rather take the fun out of this message board that the performances we see mean nothing in contrast to getting on board with Eddie’s systems in training. But that’s just professional sport I guess.

He might be great. He certainly was a fantastic runner but I can’t remember when I last saw it. If his defence is up to it then great, but it does seem odd to me if nobody else is deemed capable there. He did look a bit more fired up off the bench, hopefully he brings that again.

Mr Mwenda wrote:Van Der flier is a great name, though.

Yes. To be fair he's not a bad flanker, with a good engine, but perhaps a tad small and less physically imposing than others. Perhaps we will see the rabid O'Mahony get a good snarl off the bench.

Mikey Brown wrote:It does rather take the fun out of this message board that the performances we see mean nothing in contrast to getting on board with Eddie’s systems in training. But that’s just professional sport I guess.

He might be great. He certainly was a fantastic runner but I can’t remember when I last saw it. If his defence is up to it then great, but it does seem odd to me if nobody else is deemed capable there. He did look a bit more fired up off the bench, hopefully he brings that again.

He's been running very well all the time he's been at 15. His hands have let him down and he's struggled positionally, but he's still quick and elusive.

On the Eddie systems front, its not getting on board or whatever, its just rationalising his choices. I think if anything its a bit over organised, but good to see a framework that leads to opportunities to make decisions, even if we aren't good at that or passing

Spiffy wrote:Ireland have picked a back row containing Conan and VDF - England are home and dry!

I suppose its to compensate for Beirne going to second row and losing Ryan's physicality.

Banquo wrote:
On the Eddie systems front, its not getting on board or whatever, its just rationalising his choices. I think if anything its a bit over organised, but good to see a framework that leads to opportunities to make decisions, even if we aren't good at that or passing

I'm glad to see someone is still wanting to push the standards, I've been quite content to see the last four games after the previous (almost) two decades.

Eddie will not be able to simply stick with this system, so maybe there's some thought it'll open up. But I don't see Eddie as much of an Ashton, and I'm okay with drilling something more akin to the Japan setup with all the inherent structure. Though this fast and able to go more on the hoof would be nice, if also vomit inducing to play