RugbyRebels

Is Hill now going to start at 6? Or, will SB start with CCS? In that case, who plays the last 20? Coles or Hill for the 20 shirt?

It will be interesting. Despite the majority opinion on here, I'm left unconvinced by either player in international terms (so far anyway based on seeing them less than others seem to have done).

Maybe, SB will give the 20 shirt to Isiekwe or B Curry, I suppose.

I’d expect CCS to start, unless Slightly Bullying goes for the Cunderhill thing. And hopefully Ted Hill gets a chance.

Surely Hill deserves a bench spot at least...

Oakboy wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 8:00 am Is Hill now going to start at 6? Or, will SB start with CCS? In that case, who plays the last 20? Coles or Hill for the 20 shirt?

It will be interesting. Despite the majority opinion on here, I'm left unconvinced by either player in international terms (so far anyway based on seeing them less than others seem to have done).

Maybe, SB will give the 20 shirt to Isiekwe or B Curry, I suppose.

Either player being Coles or Hill? I’m not sure anyone here is saying they’re close to a proven international yet, but both have earned the chance to be involved and have much more potential than Ewels/Roots.

CCS still has a way to go, but had an emphatically positive start to test rugby.

Hard to answer where Hill might get to in the pecking order without knowing what Borthwick’s issues were around his game. Great to respond to a selection snub with (I think) a MOTM showing though.

Yeah, this is a massive chance for Hill to propel himself from the fringes to the 23, possibly even the starting XV. I really rate CCS and I think he may eventually be better than Hill, but today Ted is the better out and out 6 IMO.

If he gets a fair shot, I’d back him to take the chance with both hands.

It's hard to imagine either Curry or Underhill missing out, but I like the idea of CCS/Hill sharing 6/20, with CCS covering 8 and Earl covering 7.

With Ewels - are we betting it was head-on-head during tackle practice?
Or the same incident as Chessum's knee?

I think it was saying Borthwick himself had a head injury when he selected him.

Stom wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 8:30 am Surely Hill deserves a bench spot at least...

Given he wasn’t in the original squad….

But he should have been

p/d wrote: ↑Sun Oct 27, 2024 10:11 pm

Epaminondas Pules wrote: ↑Sun Oct 27, 2024 7:05 pm Ted Hill called up.

Now there’s a thing….

And Coles, would you believe it. Many things are possible

Moving Ted Hill to 6 and keeping CCS back as an impact sub is favourable. We need to keep some strong carriers in reserve. In the summer we did struggle in the second halfs Vs New Zealand and whilst injuries did limit our bench options (no Chessum and no Genge/Obano for instance). I think with the ability to launch say Genge, Dan, CCS and Sleightholme all from the bench around 50 mins in should see us finish strong.

Banquo wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:12 am

Stom wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 8:30 am Surely Hill deserves a bench spot at least...

Given he wasn’t in the original squad….

But he should have been

Mitchell wasn't in the original RWC squad and ended up as the starting 9. Borthwick does reward those that deliver in camp, irrespective of when they come in. It's one of his better qualities.

FKAS wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:21 am

Banquo wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:12 am

Stom wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 8:30 am Surely Hill deserves a bench spot at least...

Given he wasn’t in the original squad….

But he should have been

Mitchell wasn't in the original RWC squad and ended up as the starting 9. Borthwick does reward those that deliver in camp, irrespective of when they come in. It's one of his better qualities.

Fair point, but that was a position with not many options. Different scenario. But agreed the ability to change one’s mind is a good thing.

Banquo wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:23 am

FKAS wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:21 am

Banquo wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:12 am

Given he wasn’t in the original squad….

But he should have been

Mitchell wasn't in the original RWC squad and ended up as the starting 9. Borthwick does reward those that deliver in camp, irrespective of when they come in. It's one of his better qualities.

Fair point, but that was a position with not many options. Different scenario. But agreed the ability to change one’s mind is a good thing.

Mitchell did have a few weeks to prove himself in training before the RWC though. Given that Hill is turning up on the Monday of game-week, I think it's fanciful to suggest he'll be in the XXIII for New Zealand.

I fully expect the starting team to hove pretty close to the one that played the summer tour, with the only change being enforced at scrum-half and potentially putting Genge back in at loosehead (which I wouldn't personally, but I can see the argument).

Puja

Puja wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 11:00 am

Banquo wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:23 am

FKAS wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 10:21 am

Mitchell wasn't in the original RWC squad and ended up as the starting 9. Borthwick does reward those that deliver in camp, irrespective of when they come in. It's one of his better qualities.

Fair point, but that was a position with not many options. Different scenario. But agreed the ability to change one’s mind is a good thing.

Mitchell did have a few weeks to prove himself in training before the RWC though. Given that Hill is turning up on the Monday of game-week, I think it's fanciful to suggest he'll be in the XXIII for New Zealand.

I fully expect the starting team to hove pretty close to the one that played the summer tour, with the only change being enforced at scrum-half and potentially putting Genge back in at loosehead (which I wouldn't personally, but I can see the argument).

Puja

indeed.

Yeah. Same here. I was talking about Hill getting in the 23/XV over the course of the AIs, not this week.

Scrumhead wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 11:25 am Yeah. Same here. I was talking about Hill getting in the 23/XV over the course of the AIs, not this week.

Great that he's in the squad, offers a point of difference.

I'm all for Hill starting but its highly unlikely.

I too cant see much deviation from the side that played in NZ.

The big call is going to be who gets in at 9. I'd adore having Randall - he'd be the perfect accompaniment to the faster game we played from Ireland onwards, potentially even better than Mitchell, but there's no doubt that his box-kicking and control isn't as good. JVP is the balanced option, but doesn't feel like he's back to his best yet, by a distance. Spencer feels like he should be the obvious choice, but he just won't stop shitting the bed at international level and the way he's played previously would put the absolute handbrake on any thoughts of attack, so I'm loathe to hand him the reins once again and hope that, this time, he'll look like the player he is at club level.

Puja

Puja wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 6:42 pm The big call is going to be who gets in at 9. I'd adore having Randall - he'd be the perfect accompaniment to the faster game we played from Ireland onwards, potentially even better than Mitchell, but there's no doubt that his box-kicking and control isn't as good. JVP is the balanced option, but doesn't feel like he's back to his best yet, by a distance. Spencer feels like he should be the obvious choice, but he just won't stop shitting the bed at international level and the way he's played previously would put the absolute handbrake on any thoughts of attack, so I'm loathe to hand him the reins once again and hope that, this time, he'll look like the player he is at club level.

Puja

Spencer at 9, Ford at 10. The ball would be hoofed high rather a lot!

Puja wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 6:42 pm The big call is going to be who gets in at 9. I'd adore having Randall - he'd be the perfect accompaniment to the faster game we played from Ireland onwards, potentially even better than Mitchell, but there's no doubt that his box-kicking and control isn't as good. JVP is the balanced option, but doesn't feel like he's back to his best yet, by a distance. Spencer feels like he should be the obvious choice, but he just won't stop shitting the bed at international level and the way he's played previously would put the absolute handbrake on any thoughts of attack, so I'm loathe to hand him the reins once again and hope that, this time, he'll look like the player he is at club level.

Puja

I read earlier today that Spencer has never started for England which surprised me. I’m expecting him to start against NZ so I’m hoping that might give him the confidence to play like he does for Bath.

Scrumhead wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 8:36 pm

Puja wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 6:42 pm The big call is going to be who gets in at 9. I'd adore having Randall - he'd be the perfect accompaniment to the faster game we played from Ireland onwards, potentially even better than Mitchell, but there's no doubt that his box-kicking and control isn't as good. JVP is the balanced option, but doesn't feel like he's back to his best yet, by a distance. Spencer feels like he should be the obvious choice, but he just won't stop shitting the bed at international level and the way he's played previously would put the absolute handbrake on any thoughts of attack, so I'm loathe to hand him the reins once again and hope that, this time, he'll look like the player he is at club level.

Puja

I read earlier today that Spencer has never started for England which surprised me. I’m expecting him to start against NZ so I’m hoping that might give him the confidence to play like he does for Bath.

True. Maybe he would be better from the off. Possibly worth a go, although I'd still prefer Randall as a statement of intent.

I had actually thought he had had more than 4 caps and at least one start until I just looked it up now, so I'm perhaps being unfair to him, but I still haven't recovered from him coming on against Scotland this year, while we were behind on the scoreboard and short on time, then using his minutes solely timewasting, slowing the ball down and kicking it aimlessly away, like he thought we were winning and defending a lead! He then got dropped for the next game, worked his way back into contention and proceeded to do EXACTLY THE SAME THING in his return test by coming off the bench while we were losing and short on time, then timewasting, slowing the ball down, and kicking it aimlessly away!

Puja

Oh I totally agree. I’m just looking for a way to make myself comfortable with the idea of him starting.

I genuinely thought he had 10 or more caps.

Oakboy wrote: ↑Mon Oct 28, 2024 7:56 pm Spencer at 9, Ford at 10. The ball would be hoofed high rather a lot!

living the dream!!

Really hope Randall gets the nod and gets given a run at it.