RugbyRebels

Spiffy wrote:

TheNomad wrote:Yeah Earl missing is a bit odd. Albeit I’m not as big a fan of him as some.

Great broken field runner, but other aspects aren’t quite as strong IMO

Agree. England is very well off for established and developing back row talent. Earl is a great player for the loose, open game, but as you suggest perhaps a tad lacking in the nuts and bolts/grunt department. As an all rounder, perhaps a little overrated. Jones does like a workhorse.

jngf wrote:

Spiffy wrote:

TheNomad wrote:Yeah Earl missing is a bit odd. Albeit I’m not as big a fan of him as some.

Great broken field runner, but other aspects aren’t quite as strong IMO

Agree. England is very well off for established and developing back row talent. Earl is a great player for the loose, open game, but as you suggest perhaps a tad lacking in the nuts and bolts/grunt department. As an all rounder, perhaps a little overrated. Jones does like a workhorse.

and the issue for me is Jones (and to be fair Lancaster before him) don’t appear to look at flankers as adding value in attack and select based on that approach - hence Burt only picking Robshaw at 7 (bar 1 or 2 appearances by Kvesic) and Jones seeing flankers as being all about defence and poaching (not that that’s not important) and hence our flankers play is rather on the stodgy side throughout his tenure (imo).

Scrumhead wrote:I’m not suggesting he should be ahead of Heyes who I would be happy to see in the full squad, but for the A game, I’ve seen more promise in Harper’s 97mins than I have in the entirety of Painter’s senior career. Painter is like a worse version of Kieran Brookes - big and physical but not really that good.

When I look at Harper and Street’s last two appearances from the bench, there’s absolutely no question which of them had the bigger impact.

I rate Street, but so far he hasn’t stood out at senior level. He’s been fine and when he comes on there’s no drop-off, but that’s really the biggest compliment I can give him. Harper has come on and looked a fair distance better than Oosthuizen.

We also know Eddie likes to pick players from left field. I’m telling you now, Harper is a contender. How many minutes did George Martin have? I know it was more than 97 but it really wasn’t a lot to pick up a senior cap.

Which Tyler wrote:Pity for the man; but...
It doesn't feel like a loss at all; and he should never have been there anyway - it's an A-match and a second tier "tour" - what could we possibly have learned about Manu that we don't already know?

Which Tyler wrote:Pity for the man; but...
It doesn't feel like a loss at all; and he should never have been there anyway - it's an A-match and a second tier "tour" - what could we possibly have learned about Manu that we don't already know?

Doorzetbornandbred wrote:Whos realistically going to be added from the Quins and Exeter teams after the final?

Stom wrote:

Doorzetbornandbred wrote:Whos realistically going to be added from the Quins and Exeter teams after the final?

Smith, Dombrandt, Marchant and Kenningham, imo. Plus some Exeter players.

Puja wrote:

Stom wrote:

Doorzetbornandbred wrote:Whos realistically going to be added from the Quins and Exeter teams after the final?

Smith, Dombrandt, Marchant and Kenningham, imo. Plus some Exeter players.

Potentially Northmore as well, although I feel he would've been more a shoo-in for the A game if Quins hadn't been selfish and won. Same for Kenningham.

From Exeter, hopefully not Williams, Slade, or Nowell - we know what we need to know of them. Devoto? Possibly Street? O'Flaherty is easily better than Bassett IMO.

Puja

Mikey Brown wrote:Yeah no need with Kenningham at this stage I don’t think.

Devoto I’d really like to see for England, but hard not to feel his ship has already sailed with Eddie.

FKAS wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:Yeah no need with Kenningham at this stage I don’t think.

Devoto I’d really like to see for England, but hard not to feel his ship has already sailed with Eddie.

I think Devoto will come into the squad. Currently the options at 12 are both pretty young in Kelly and Ojomoh.

Agree on Kenningham there's openside options that are more experienced and more rounded available at this point. His time will come if he keeps developing.

Puja wrote:

Stom wrote:

Doorzetbornandbred wrote:Whos realistically going to be added from the Quins and Exeter teams after the final?

Smith, Dombrandt, Marchant and Kenningham, imo. Plus some Exeter players.

Potentially Northmore as well, although I feel he would've been more a shoo-in for the A game if Quins hadn't been selfish and won. Same for Kenningham.

From Exeter, hopefully not Williams, Slade, or Nowell - we know what we need to know of them. Devoto? Possibly Street? O'Flaherty is easily better than Bassett IMO.

Puja

Scrumhead wrote:

Puja wrote:

Stom wrote:
Smith, Dombrandt, Marchant and Kenningham, imo. Plus some Exeter players.

Potentially Northmore as well, although I feel he would've been more a shoo-in for the A game if Quins hadn't been selfish and won. Same for Kenningham.

From Exeter, hopefully not Williams, Slade, or Nowell - we know what we need to know of them. Devoto? Possibly Street? O'Flaherty is easily better than Bassett IMO.

Puja

Agreed on 90% of the above minus the last sentence.

I’d say O’Flaherty and Bassett are about equal. Totally different types of wingers offering different strengths. O’Flaherty is more elusive with better footwork and is probably faster. Bassett is better under the high ball, more powerful and a better defender. I’d also argue Bassett has a better ‘rugby brain’.

That said, O’Flaherty has a bit more time on his side to improve.

Beasties wrote:

Scrumhead wrote:I’m not suggesting he should be ahead of Heyes who I would be happy to see in the full squad, but for the A game, I’ve seen more promise in Harper’s 97mins than I have in the entirety of Painter’s senior career. Painter is like a worse version of Kieran Brookes - big and physical but not really that good.

When I look at Harper and Street’s last two appearances from the bench, there’s absolutely no question which of them had the bigger impact.

I rate Street, but so far he hasn’t stood out at senior level. He’s been fine and when he comes on there’s no drop-off, but that’s really the biggest compliment I can give him. Harper has come on and looked a fair distance better than Oosthuizen.

We also know Eddie likes to pick players from left field. I’m telling you now, Harper is a contender. How many minutes did George Martin have? I know it was more than 97 but it really wasn’t a lot to pick up a senior cap.

Just caught up on this thread and in agreement on Harper. On what I've seen so far he is looking like an interesting player. To me he looks to have more potential than those other younguns mentioned. Will Stuart immediately stood out for me in a way Street, Painter and even Heyes aren't particularly exciting as yet. Long time to go yet of course, and I had high hopes for Henry Thomas back in the day, injuries aside obvs.

Raggs wrote:I suspect Bassett may be there as a very reliable tackle bag holder.

He's going to challenge whoever you pick to line up against him in every facet of the game. Great winger for the youngsters to learn from.

His desire to get a cap will be off the charts too i suspect.

Scrumhead wrote:

Raggs wrote:I suspect Bassett may be there as a very reliable tackle bag holder.

He's going to challenge whoever you pick to line up against him in every facet of the game. Great winger for the youngsters to learn from.

His desire to get a cap will be off the charts too i suspect.

Yep. Unfortunately for him, being a relatively late bloomer doesn’t really work on the wing (at least not at test level).

I think he’d actually be fine if he was picked, but I don’t ever see him challenging to be first choice.