RugbyRebels

Wilson instead of Shields for me.

No Cockanasiga but Ashton and Nowell, yawn

Wilson is being looked at as an 8.

Moon
Hepburn
Hartley
George
Sinckler
Williams
Itoje
Kruis
Ewels
Stooke
Wilson
Shields
Curry
Mercer

Youngs
Care
Ford
Farrell
Te'o
Manu
Slade
May
Nowell
Ashton
Daly

So Stooke to go from the forwards and one of the inside backs. That is a lot, lot better than I was expecting.

Puja

Hmmm, so

1. Hepburn, Moon
2. George, Hartley
3. Williams, Sinckler,
4 & 5: Itoje, Kruis, Ewels, Stooke
6. Shields, Wilson
7. Curry
8. Mercer

9. Youngs, Care
10. Ford
12. Farrell, Te’o
13. Slade, Tuilagi
11, 14, 15: Ashton, Daly, May, Nowell

Exciting, but some really noticeable players missing

Think this looks decidedly weak.

Excuse my ignorance, but has Te'o actually played this season?

Peej wrote:Think this looks decidedly weak.

It's not going to be pretty.

You never know, maybe Hartley has been sandbagging this season and is all set to deliver a captain's performance

Crikey, I'm genuinely shocked. I fully expected Brown on the wing. I would've put money on Rhodes being in the 23 too.

I don't want Rhodes in the squad but he's surely better than Shields.

Oakboy wrote:I don't want Rhodes in the squad but he's surely better than Shields.

Why must he surely be better? How many times have you seen Shields play?

Do Teo or Nowell actually have any minutes this season?

I half think that Eddie will go with Wilson at 8, Shields 6 and Curry 7. Leave Mercer on the bench for the last 20. With the forwards we have missing we aren’t matching the Boks for power, so I think we may be looking at a backrow that’s going to be very fit, disrupt their ball as much as possible and have a massive work rate. Happy to operate on the backfoot and get us some turnovers. The kind of backrow that’s done pretty well against England in recent times.

Several permutations still possible and i wouldnt rule out one or two surprises.
4 locks retained. Itoje at 6? Might explain why Morgan has been released.
Daly set for FB, which is a good thing.
Wilson ahead of Rhodes makes me happy.

Mikey Brown wrote:Do Teo or Nowell actually have any minutes this season?

Te’o about 25 minutes. Nowell’s started Exeter last 5/6 European/Prem games.

Timbo wrote:

Oakboy wrote:I don't want Rhodes in the squad but he's surely better than Shields.

Why must he surely be better? How many times have you seen Shields play?

I've seen him every time he's appeared for England and I watched him for Wasps in the European match where he was visibly off the pace, arriving too late at every breakdown and never making a significant tackle - an absolute contrast with Armand for Exeter, for example. Rhodes has looked more effective than Shields in European club games - not marginally but significantly.

Are you suggesting that something from Shields' past record in NZ leads you to believe that there is far more to come than I have seen?

fivepointer wrote:Several permutations still possible and i wouldnt rule out one or two surprises.
4 locks retained. Itoje at 6? Might explain why Morgan has been released.
Daly set for FB, which is a good thing.
Wilson ahead of Rhodes makes me happy.

So, will Slade be at 12 or 13? Will he miss out altogether, be on the bench or, if you are looking for surprises, will he be at FB?

Oakboy wrote:

fivepointer wrote:Several permutations still possible and i wouldnt rule out one or two surprises.
4 locks retained. Itoje at 6? Might explain why Morgan has been released.
Daly set for FB, which is a good thing.
Wilson ahead of Rhodes makes me happy.

So, will Slade be at 12 or 13? Will he miss out altogether, be on the bench or, if you are looking for surprises, will he be at FB?

Who knows? I thought Morgan was odds on to play 8 and was sure Rhodes would get a start. Back row could end up Shields, Curry, Mercer but might just as easily be Itoje, Curry, Wilson.
I said earlier in the thread that i thought Farrell-Te'o-Tuilagi will form the midfield, which i stand by. Slade might play but i wouldnt be shocked if he's left on the bench as he can cover multiple positions.
Daly is a definite for FB and i feel sure Ashton will start.

Really not sure how I feel about this ...

Why bother calling up Morgan only to discard him again?

I don’t think Mercer is ready to go up against the likes of Vermeulen as an 8. Wilson will fill in manfully if needed but he isn’t an 8.

As far as the backs go, I truly hate the idea of Te’o and Tuilagi together with Farrell at 10. No creativity, no subtlety and not good enough to win a test IMO.

If Ashton plays, I think he could do well. A desire to prove himself to Eddie seems to be firing him up.

Be interesting to see what the team is with that squad.

I'm surprised. There's still a best and worst...

Moon
Hartley
Williams
Kruis
Ewels
Itoje
Curry
Wilson
Youngs
Farrell
May
Te'o
Tuilagi
Ashton
Nowell

Or

Hepburn
George
Williams
Itoje
Kruis
Wilson
Curry
Mercer
Care
Ford
May
Slade
Tuilagi
Nowell
Daly

Oakboy wrote:

Timbo wrote:

Oakboy wrote:I don't want Rhodes in the squad but he's surely better than Shields.

Why must he surely be better? How many times have you seen Shields play?

I've seen him every time he's appeared for England and I watched him for Wasps in the European match where he was visibly off the pace, arriving too late at every breakdown and never making a significant tackle - an absolute contrast with Armand for Exeter, for example. Rhodes has looked more effective than Shields in European club games - not marginally but significantly.

Are you suggesting that something from Shields' past record in NZ leads you to believe that there is far more to come than I have seen?

Your ‘every time’ amounts to about 80mins as far as Shields’ England career is concerned.

I do share some of your concerns though. He has been poor for Wasps so far and has been notably out of position or been misaligned in defence in his appearances so far which have directly led to tries (against Exeter in Round 1) and in one of the European games (can’t recall which).

I watched him a fair bit in SR and he’s better than that but I maintain that I’m a big fan of Wilson. In a like for like there’s currently no contest. Which obviously means Eddie will pick Shields.

I am not a fan of Rhodes at all.

Stom wrote:I'm surprised. There's still a best and worst...

Moon
Hartley
Williams
Kruis
Ewels
Itoje
Curry
Wilson
Youngs
Farrell
May
Te'o
Tuilagi
Ashton
Nowell

Or

Hepburn
George
Williams
Itoje
Kruis
Wilson
Curry
Mercer
Care
Ford
May
Slade
Tuilagi
Nowell
Daly

Within the constraints of Jones's squad selection, your latter XV is not too bad at all.

Timbo wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:Do Teo or Nowell actually have any minutes this season?

Te’o about 25 minutes. Nowell’s started Exeter last 5/6 European/Prem games.

Oh right. Whoops.

Has he done anything to merit being ahead of Cokanasiga?

Oakboy wrote:

Timbo wrote:

Oakboy wrote:I don't want Rhodes in the squad but he's surely better than Shields.

Why must he surely be better? How many times have you seen Shields play?

I've seen him every time he's appeared for England and I watched him for Wasps in the European match where he was visibly off the pace, arriving too late at every breakdown and never making a significant tackle - an absolute contrast with Armand for Exeter, for example. Rhodes has looked more effective than Shields in European club games - not marginally but significantly.

Are you suggesting that something from Shields' past record in NZ leads you to believe that there is far more to come than I have seen?

The guy was captain of the Hurricanes, i’d guess there’s a bit more to come from him. The likes of Blade Thompson and Vaea Fifita couldn’t get in their team at 6 ahead of him.

But fundamentally you really need to watch someone play more than 3 or 4 times (in teams they’ve never played in before) to see what they’re all about.