There were lots of young whelps at the polling stations in Philly yesterday. They were pretty hot on civil/human rights.
Re: America
Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2022 7:11 pm
by Sandydragon
Puja wrote: ↑Wed Nov 09, 2022 1:13 pm
I am cautiously optimistic about the American election results so far. Admittedly, "Didn't elect quite enough fascists that have openly boasted they will rig all forthcoming elections, to completely and irrevocably ruin the democratic process, but only enough that it's still a massive problem," is a very low bar for success, but it's the one that they appear to be getting over despite predictions that they wouldn't, so kudos to the Yanks.
Exit polls suggest it's the kids wot did it - much larger than expected turnout of 20-30s quashing the red wave.
Puja
Cautiously optimistic so far but everything crossed that the Dems can keep some control.
My only concern is what this means for the next presidential election. A red wave would probably have helped trump and sealed the deal for him to be the Republican candidate. But, it’s clear that his influence isn’t helping them. But DeSantis is obviously riding high and must be a favourite now for the nomination. I don’t think Biden can compete against anyone but Trump. Nd from what I’ve read about DeSantis he is from the same political stable as Trump but with better presentation.
Puja wrote: ↑Wed Nov 09, 2022 1:13 pm
I am cautiously optimistic about the American election results so far. Admittedly, "Didn't elect quite enough fascists that have openly boasted they will rig all forthcoming elections, to completely and irrevocably ruin the democratic process, but only enough that it's still a massive problem," is a very low bar for success, but it's the one that they appear to be getting over despite predictions that they wouldn't, so kudos to the Yanks.
Exit polls suggest it's the kids wot did it - much larger than expected turnout of 20-30s quashing the red wave.
Puja
Cautiously optimistic so far but everything crossed that the Dems can keep some control.
My only concern is what this means for the next presidential election. A red wave would probably have helped trump and sealed the deal for him to be the Republican candidate. But, it’s clear that his influence isn’t helping them. But DeSantis is obviously riding high and must be a favourite now for the nomination. I don’t think Biden can compete against anyone but Trump. Nd from what I’ve read about DeSantis he is from the same political stable as Trump but with better presentation.
I read the situation slightly differently, myself. To me, DeSantis is a politician, like many others. He'd undoubtedly be a nightmare as President. But he's not the weird force of nature that Trump has become. Trump has personally captured the undying loyalty of an alarming percentage of the American population - he's a cult leader.
I don't think Biden can compete with either of them - he's a lame duck and will lose the 2024 election to just about anyone. Quite apart from his lack of significant accomplishments and his milquetoast attempts to get people working together by avoiding doing anything good, the perception of him as a doddering fool has gone too far. His perceived failures will drive engagement from the right's voters and his pandering to the right and apathy to change will drive disengagement from the left's voters. He'll lose in a landslide barring something miraculous.
I would rather him lose to DeSantis, who is just another politician (admittedly a wicked and mendacious one), than to give any further power to the Trump cult.
Puja
Re: America
Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2022 11:15 pm
by morepork
Don't say Gay De Santis, who hid public health data during COVID to downplay his ridiculous hands off approach to the pandemic. The guy that appropriated federal money to pay to fly migrants from Texas to Massachusetts. The guy that actually uses the phrase "Marxist wokeism" to justify legislation that mandates revisionist history in the public school curriculum. DeSantis who retaliated against Disney's criticism of his anti-LGBTQ legislation by cancelling tax breaks. Disney, that paragon of equality and social justice, is too woke for Ron DeSantis's Florida.
Puja wrote: ↑Wed Nov 09, 2022 1:13 pm
I am cautiously optimistic about the American election results so far. Admittedly, "Didn't elect quite enough fascists that have openly boasted they will rig all forthcoming elections, to completely and irrevocably ruin the democratic process, but only enough that it's still a massive problem," is a very low bar for success, but it's the one that they appear to be getting over despite predictions that they wouldn't, so kudos to the Yanks.
Exit polls suggest it's the kids wot did it - much larger than expected turnout of 20-30s quashing the red wave.
Puja
Cautiously optimistic so far but everything crossed that the Dems can keep some control.
My only concern is what this means for the next presidential election. A red wave would probably have helped trump and sealed the deal for him to be the Republican candidate. But, it’s clear that his influence isn’t helping them. But DeSantis is obviously riding high and must be a favourite now for the nomination. I don’t think Biden can compete against anyone but Trump. Nd from what I’ve read about DeSantis he is from the same political stable as Trump but with better presentation.
I read the situation slightly differently, myself. To me, DeSantis is a politician, like many others. He'd undoubtedly be a nightmare as President. But he's not the weird force of nature that Trump has become. Trump has personally captured the undying loyalty of an alarming percentage of the American population - he's a cult leader.
I don't think Biden can compete with either of them - he's a lame duck and will lose the 2024 election to just about anyone. Quite apart from his lack of significant accomplishments and his milquetoast attempts to get people working together by avoiding doing anything good, the perception of him as a doddering fool has gone too far. His perceived failures will drive engagement from the right's voters and his pandering to the right and apathy to change will drive disengagement from the left's voters. He'll lose in a landslide barring something miraculous.
I would rather him lose to DeSantis, who is just another politician (admittedly a wicked and mendacious one), than to give any further power to the Trump cult.
Puja
There is the hope that Trump and DeSantis will tear the Republicans apart. Faint hope but with a weakened but not dead Trump we could see some measure of this.
For the Democrats, I hate to say it but the best thing would be for Biden to have a health problem (or simply realise that he is too old) that makes him give up standing for a second term.
Re: America
Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2022 9:25 am
by Sandydragon
Biden is already past it and if this mid-term has given him the confidence to go for reelection then that's not a great outcome. There has to be a younger generation of Democrat leaders looking to push through who can be given some media time in preparation for this.
I assume that just because he is the sitting president, that doesn't mean his nomination is automatic. Does anyone know?
Re: America
Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2022 9:35 am
by Mikey Brown
Sandydragon wrote: ↑Thu Nov 10, 2022 9:25 amI assume that just because he is the sitting president, that doesn't mean his nomination is automatic. Does anyone know?
I don't think it does, technically, but look what happened last time. He wasn't even in the race until it looked worryingly like someone else might shake things up.
Re: America
Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2022 9:43 am
by Son of Mathonwy
Dream scenario - Trump loses the primary to DeSantis then claims that the vote was rigged, doesn't accept the result. His fanatical followers desert the Republicans.
Re: America
Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2022 9:52 am
by Mikey Brown
I've got say I'm kind of warming to the guy.
Re: America
Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2022 9:53 am
by Puja
Sandydragon wrote: ↑Thu Nov 10, 2022 9:25 am
Biden is already past it and if this mid-term has given him the confidence to go for reelection then that's not a great outcome. There has to be a younger generation of Democrat leaders looking to push through who can be given some media time in preparation for this.
I assume that just because he is the sitting president, that doesn't mean his nomination is automatic. Does anyone know?
It's not automatic, but it's considered bad form to challenge and also a no-win situation - either you get demolished and become the idiot who invited the boss outside (John Redwood) or you bring him down and become the dick who stabbed the previous winner in the back (Michael Gove).
You're absolutely right that the best scenario is him handing over to someone younger, but the only person I can see him doing that for is a coronation for Kamala Harris, rather than a competitive primary. Harris has not come out of this presidency with her reputation unscathed, as well as carrying the significant political disadvantages of being a PoC and a woman, whilst also not having any liberal credentials with which to energise a youth vote. She'd be better than Biden by a distance, but I'm not sure she could take down DeSantis or Trump, except in Son of Mathonwy's dream scenario.
Puja
Re: America
Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2022 10:56 am
by Son of Mathonwy
Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Thu Nov 10, 2022 9:52 am
I've got say I'm kind of warming to the guy.
Love it. He says it tongue in cheek but he's kidding on the square.
The complete answer is narcissism 101.
Re: America
Posted: Fri Nov 11, 2022 9:23 pm
by Mikey Brown
Oh no did she found out about those “the venn diagram of X is a circle” memes? Why are there so many videos out there of her being a total nutcase at the moment? Is she relatable for somebody out there or something?
Re: America
Posted: Fri Nov 11, 2022 11:11 pm
by morepork
Character assassination of a female politician shoved to the back of a long line of old white dudes. When she starts shooting effigies of other politicians with a .50 Cal, then I'll get worried. Men can brag about casual sexual assault with impunity, apparently, but those Venn diagram rants are unacceptable.
Oh no did she found out about those “the venn diagram of X is a circle” memes? Why are there so many videos out there of her being a total nutcase at the moment? Is she relatable for somebody out there or something?
This is her being a total nutcase? What does that make Truss, then? As this seems perfectly normal to me.
Re: America
Posted: Sat Nov 12, 2022 9:05 am
by morepork
Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Fri Nov 11, 2022 11:31 pm
Yes, it’s definitely one or the other.
According to Twitter vignettes, yes, but I'm sure you also sympathize.
X
Re: America
Posted: Sat Nov 12, 2022 10:10 am
by Mikey Brown
Righto.
Re: America
Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2022 8:37 am
by cashead
Dems take the Senate.
Re: America
Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2022 4:05 pm
by Sandydragon
Been reading today about how many senior Republicans are beginning to turn on Trump publicly. Naturally, they were happy with his brand of quasi-fascist populism when it won them elections, but not now he is seen to be a liability.
I wonder how many of them regret not supporting the impeachment case which at least would have lanced the boil straight after the election?
Re: America
Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2022 7:22 pm
by Puja
Sandydragon wrote: ↑Sun Nov 13, 2022 4:05 pm
Been reading today about how many senior Republicans are beginning to turn on Trump publicly. Naturally, they were happy with his brand of quasi-fascist populism when it won them elections, but not now he is seen to be a liability.
I wonder how many of them regret not supporting the impeachment case which at least would have lanced the boil straight after the election?
Notable as well how little time the Yankee voters are having for the election denial bullshit. This is an election that the Dems should be losing by a landslide - Biden is uninspiring as a kind description, the economy's gone to shit (not strictly his fault, but still), and his legislative accomplishments have not been much to drum up the base. Even with the tailwind provided by the Roe v Wade shit, they should be losing both houses by a distance. Yet, it appears they will barely lose one and most of the big name election deniers have either lost or have had a very rough ride (Boebert nearly losing her seat in a Republican district was joyous, even if it looks like it won't quite come through in the end).
It appears that integrity still matters to Yankees and not enough of them have been poisoned by Fox News to believe the fuckery being peddled.
Puja
Re: America
Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2022 7:58 pm
by morepork
Less than 30% of registered American voters support that election denial bullshit. It's only prominent because of a spinless 4th estate. Election weirdos don't actually have any policy initiatives that aren't about voting restrictions and white grievance. That shit gets old pretty quickly.
Re: America
Posted: Sun Nov 13, 2022 8:33 pm
by Puja
morepork wrote: ↑Sun Nov 13, 2022 7:58 pm
Less than 30% of registered American voters support that election denial bullshit. It's only prominent because of a spinless 4th estate. Election weirdos don't actually have any policy initiatives that aren't about voting restrictions and white grievance. That shit gets old pretty quickly.
But it's pleasing that it's voters are actively punishing candidates for it. I was expecting that people would see it, but still say, "Well, I want to vote Republican, so I'll just ignore them being a frothing weirdo," so I'm quite chuffed that it's not only not garnering them votes, but actively costing them as well.
Sandydragon wrote: ↑Sun Nov 13, 2022 4:05 pm
Been reading today about how many senior Republicans are beginning to turn on Trump publicly. Naturally, they were happy with his brand of quasi-fascist populism when it won them elections, but not now he is seen to be a liability.
I wonder how many of them regret not supporting the impeachment case which at least would have lanced the boil straight after the election?
Notable as well how little time the Yankee voters are having for the election denial bullshit. This is an election that the Dems should be losing by a landslide - Biden is uninspiring as a kind description, the economy's gone to shit (not strictly his fault, but still), and his legislative accomplishments have not been much to drum up the base. Even with the tailwind provided by the Roe v Wade shit, they should be losing both houses by a distance. Yet, it appears they will barely lose one and most of the big name election deniers have either lost or have had a very rough ride (Boebert nearly losing her seat in a Republican district was joyous, even if it looks like it won't quite come through in the end).
It appears that integrity still matters to Yankees and not enough of them have been poisoned by Fox News to believe the fuckery being peddled.
Puja
I suppose we shall be putting that to the test now that Trump has finally put us out of our misery and admitted that he will actually be running for president again. Will any of the other Republican big names, mostly De Santis, risk running against him and losing, or bide their time (De Santis is mid 40s? so has plenty of time on his side you would imagine)? For everyone's sake, I really hope it's not a repeat of the last election. Sadly I don't think the Dems will leave Biden in a room with a bottle of whisky and a loaded revolver and may well humour him.
Re: America
Posted: Thu Nov 17, 2022 7:57 pm
by morepork
Republicans have Congress again....just. Look for culture warrior deadweight like Margarine Taylor Greene to push all sorts of crazy Gunz and Jebus shyte "legislation" through.
And Rupert Murdoch is positioning himself to take charge of a proposed merged Fox News and News Corp shit machine and inject his wrinkled black soul into the political process again. That should be fun.