RugbyRebels

jngf wrote:

Banquo wrote:

fivepointer wrote:Clifford replaces Billy in the training squad.

Presume that's the end of the Hask then. What's the story on Billy, is it a diagnosed bad one?

Hask's future with England is at 6/bench now imo.

even if he isn't even 1st reserve for the training squadthatweshouldntreadanythinginto

Beasties wrote:

Scrumhead wrote:

Stom wrote:
Indeed. Collier has started the season well, though. He should also be in the mix at 3rd/4th choice. Need some caps into Williams and Collier, imo. But maybe only after the WC, when Cole is gone.

I think it's telling that Collier is starting ahead of Sinckler today. I strongly suspect it is becasue Kingston/Rowntree feel that he'll be better equipped to cope with Genge.

Even taking club bias out of the equation, I think Collier was more impressive than Williams in Argentina. He massively improved the scrum when he came on and while I appreciate he doesn't offer that much outside of the scrum, neither does Cole these days. I'd say Collier is the best scrummaging prop in the Premiership and used correctly, that could be a real weapon for England.

Jones has stated he thinks Collier is Eng's best scrummaging TH a while ago iirc. I don't happen to agree with him, Williams for me. Collier looked like he sorted the scrum in Arg but it was after their first choice LH went off (and rest of their front row was changed?). Can't remember the details now but their TH was causing problems for us? I haven't seen any of the Tigers Quins game yet but it sounds like he struggled against Genge(?) who isn't yet an awesome scrummager.

Difficult to tell on he scrums, as Tigers got moidered in a couple.

Scrumhead wrote: Brown has been as good as ever this season. I'm really not sure on the alleged struggles? OK, he missed a tackle on Veainu yesterday, but he's not the first to do that. Still one of the best 15s in the league.

He did also get utterly dismissed by Bateman on his way to the line, which is slightly more embarrassing. And he offered very little in attack.

Digby wrote:Edit - Actually it's an interesting one. Given Brown didn't train last week, partly down to a new family arrival and not just the ankle?, should an England EPS player have been stood down for an irrelevant game with the AIs looming? It's highly improbable Quins are going to achieve anything, so if Brown is Eddie's #1 choice this maybe shows there's nothing in the EPS to give England the control they likely still want

I think both Quins and Quins fans might debate your designation of that as "an irrelevant game" considering Leicester at the Stoop was eminently winnable and they will need to contest those kind of games if they want to get into Europe. I wouldn't expect the EPS to be able to offer Eddie the right to pull a fit-to-play player from an AP game, just because of a mild niggle and a new baby, 6 weeks away from the first AI!

Puja

It's not so much an irrelevant game as two largely irrelevant clubs as things stand, they're just there to make up the numbers and stumble to something of a mid table finish. Though I don't actually think England should be able to remove a player, just noting if they lose a player they might want then in week the player hasn't been available to train in a game with not a lot at stake it might be England would want to be able to remove a player

Digby wrote:It's not so much an irrelevant game as two largely irrelevant clubs as things stand, they're just there to make up the numbers and stumble to something of a mid table finish. Though I don't actually think England should be able to remove a player, just noting if they lose a player they might want then in week the player hasn't been available to train in a game with not a lot at stake it might be England would want to be able to remove a player

I again question your definition of "not a lot at stake". That game could affect who gets into the top 4 and it will definitely affect who qualifies for the ERC.

Puja

Puja wrote:

Digby wrote:It's not so much an irrelevant game as two largely irrelevant clubs as things stand, they're just there to make up the numbers and stumble to something of a mid table finish. Though I don't actually think England should be able to remove a player, just noting if they lose a player they might want then in week the player hasn't been available to train in a game with not a lot at stake it might be England would want to be able to remove a player

I again question your definition of "not a lot at stake". That game could affect who gets into the top 4 and it will definitely affect who qualifies for the ERC.

Puja

As of today I'm really interested in what Exeter, Wasps and Sarries do. After that I can enjoy any given team/game, but none of the other clubs suggest to me as a neutral they're doing anything all that interesting, bar maybe Newcastle simply to the extent they're above expectation. I'm sure top 4 and top 6 matters to the fans, but it's not that interesting to me right now, it'll be more interesting with 3 games to go I suppose, just right now the teams are more in the making up the numbers category.

It's obviously possible that Quins, Leicester or anyone else could become more interesting, but I'd want to seem them do it before actually thinking they're interesting. Bath I suppose are a little more interesting with their team shape, and Glaws for ongoing insanity

Aside from Sarries and Exe I was thinking it had started to look like anyone could beat anyone. When the ground gets a bit softer the balance will swing for and against teams. I'm finding it an interesting season so far.

What the hell are you on about? We're 4 games in to the season. You're aware of that, right?

I don't see how what is interesting to you relates to it being a game they feel they should bother to try and win.

Mikey Brown wrote:What the hell are you on about? We're 4 games in to the season. You're aware of that, right?

I don't see how what is interesting to you relates to it being a game they feel they should bother to try and win.

Before the season those two sides didn't look interesting, 4 games in they don't look interesting, and another 4 games I'll be surprised if they've progressed to being interesting - though one lives in hope.

And it's not me this is all that relevant to, I wouldn't be picking Brown period. It's more an England EPS player who wasn't available train and has played and worsened an existing injury, and whether that perturbs England. It's quite possible that doesn't perturb England/Eddie, in which case fair enough.

Apparent Ennui re: three quarters of the league aside, I reckon the last few weeks have shown us that we may well be going back to the days of our AI pack being whoever was still standing come the first weekend.

There have been a few upsets and I'm enjoying the new amendments.

Digby wrote: should an England EPS player have been stood down for an irrelevant game with the AIs looming? It's highly improbable Quins are going to achieve anything

This is the bit I am saying is totally ridiculous. Not whether you find them interesting or not.

Mikey Brown wrote:

Digby wrote: should an England EPS player have been stood down for an irrelevant game with the AIs looming? It's highly improbable Quins are going to achieve anything

This is the bit I am saying is totally ridiculous. Not whether you find them interesting or not.

I'm assuming you're not disagreeing Quins will achieve not a lot?

Beyond that I'm not surprised as you're a fan of one of those sides and presumably actually care about their results. I'm really only interested in Quins or Leicester when they're pushing at the top of the English club game, and they're miles off that. As is I really only care about how for instance are Yarde and Clifford playing when it comes to forming an England squad.

16th man wrote:Apparent Ennui re: three quarters of the league aside, I reckon the last few weeks have shown us that we may well be going back to the days of our AI pack being whoever was still standing come the first weekend.

I'm finding the sheer level of attrition at the moment a bit of a turn off tbh.

Digby wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:

Digby wrote: should an England EPS player have been stood down for an irrelevant game with the AIs looming? It's highly improbable Quins are going to achieve anything

This is the bit I am saying is totally ridiculous. Not whether you find them interesting or not.

I'm assuming you're not disagreeing Quins will achieve not a lot?

Beyond that I'm not surprised as you're a fan of one of those sides and presumably actually care about their results. I'm really only interested in Quins or Leicester when they're pushing at the top of the English club game, and they're miles off that. As is I really only care about how for instance are Yarde and Clifford playing when it comes to forming an England squad.

Are you actually being serious?

Do I think they'll win the league? No. I really, really doubt it.

Should we write off our entire season after 3 games (including beating last years finalists away) because we probably/possibly won't win it? No. That would be absolutely retarded. Why would anybody ever think that way? They're professional, competitive sportsmen.

Now that I've written all that down I think I've been duped here.

Mikey Brown wrote:

Digby wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:
This is the bit I am saying is totally ridiculous. Not whether you find them interesting or not.

I'm assuming you're not disagreeing Quins will achieve not a lot?

Beyond that I'm not surprised as you're a fan of one of those sides and presumably actually care about their results. I'm really only interested in Quins or Leicester when they're pushing at the top of the English club game, and they're miles off that. As is I really only care about how for instance are Yarde and Clifford playing when it comes to forming an England squad.

Are you actually being serious?

Do I think they'll win the league? No. I really, really doubt it.

Should we write off our entire season after 3 games (including beating last years finalists away) because we probably/possibly won't win it? No. That would be absolutely retarded. Why would anybody ever think that way? They're professional, competitive sportsmen.

Now that I've written all that down I think I've been duped here.

I don't recall saying Quins or anyone else should write off their season, they should aim for being one of the interesting teams. The query I have is for England and whether they want their EPS players playing when they do into a game with an injury that sees them missing training? Now were it a European quarter-final then it's more worthwhile to risk a player, for a league game, and a league game where they're one of the also-rans less so.

For myself I think England should keep the hands off and leave the clubs and the players to make their own minds up. But there is a query there given England are paying for some level of player control

Digby wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:

Digby wrote:
I'm assuming you're not disagreeing Quins will achieve not a lot?

Beyond that I'm not surprised as you're a fan of one of those sides and presumably actually care about their results. I'm really only interested in Quins or Leicester when they're pushing at the top of the English club game, and they're miles off that. As is I really only care about how for instance are Yarde and Clifford playing when it comes to forming an England squad.

Are you actually being serious?

Do I think they'll win the league? No. I really, really doubt it.

Should we write off our entire season after 3 games (including beating last years finalists away) because we probably/possibly won't win it? No. That would be absolutely retarded. Why would anybody ever think that way? They're professional, competitive sportsmen.

Now that I've written all that down I think I've been duped here.

I don't recall saying Quins or anyone else should write off their season, they should aim for being one of the interesting teams. The query I have is for England and whether they want their EPS players playing when they do into a game with an injury that sees them missing training? Now were it a European quarter-final then it's more worthwhile to risk a player, for a league game, and a league game where they're one of the also-rans less so.

For myself I think England should keep the hands off and leave the clubs and the players to make their own minds up. But there is a query there given England are paying for some level of player control

Yeh, but should Gary Neville give a presentation to the England squad?

What on? How to combine the facial hair of a 16 year old with the face of a 46 year old?

Peat wrote:What on? How to combine the facial hair of a 16 year old with the face of a 46 year old?

That was my point at the time. Lancaster asked him to address the squad during his first year as coach. We had the most pointless argument about it at the time. Diggers and M Brown were in danger of going down the same cul de sac.

Mellsblue wrote:

Peat wrote:What on? How to combine the facial hair of a 16 year old with the face of a 46 year old?

That was my point at the time. Lancaster asked him to address the squad during his first year as coach. We had the most pointless argument about it at the time. Diggers and M Brown were in danger of going down the same cul de sac.

Mate they're at number 8 and the car behind is blowing its horn asking whether they're ever gonna move again.

Still, I like the odd pointless argument when I'm not stupid enough to get involved, and its only slightly more pointless than trying to second guess Eddie at this stage. The only thing I have to add is I'd love to see Launch/Itoje given a run, which means it will never happen.

Oh no, wait. Hang on. Why the hell is Tom Dunn in the training squad?

Mellsblue wrote:

Peat wrote:What on? How to combine the facial hair of a 16 year old with the face of a 46 year old?

That was my point at the time. Lancaster asked him to address the squad during his first year as coach. We had the most pointless argument about it at the time. Diggers and M Brown were in danger of going down the same cul de sac.

There have been some belters over the years. I probably started most of them.

Peat wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:

Peat wrote:What on? How to combine the facial hair of a 16 year old with the face of a 46 year old?

That was my point at the time. Lancaster asked him to address the squad during his first year as coach. We had the most pointless argument about it at the time. Diggers and M Brown were in danger of going down the same cul de sac.

Mate they're at number 8 and the car behind is blowing its horn asking whether they're ever gonna move again.

Still, I like the odd pointless argument when I'm not stupid enough to get involved, and its only slightly more pointless than trying to second guess Eddie at this stage. The only thing I have to add is I'd love to see Launch/Itoje given a run, which means it will never happen.

Oh no, wait. Hang on. Why the hell is Tom Dunn in the training squad?

Dunn is there becasue Taylor and LCD are injured, but he's also a player Eddie's had his eye on for a while.

Okay the injuries make sense.

Mellsblue wrote:

Peat wrote:What on? How to combine the facial hair of a 16 year old with the face of a 46 year old?

That was my point at the time. Lancaster asked him to address the squad during his first year as coach. We had the most pointless argument about it at the time. Diggers and M Brown were in danger of going down the same cul de sac.

What's most amazing is that I was involved at the start and have decided that it's a silly argument and a waste of time. When even *I* consider an internet argument too pointless to perpetuate, that's a cue for the participants to feel shame!

Puja

Mellsblue wrote:

Peat wrote:What on? How to combine the facial hair of a 16 year old with the face of a 46 year old?

That was my point at the time. Lancaster asked him to address the squad during his first year as coach. We had the most pointless argument about it at the time. Diggers and M Brown were in danger of going down the same cul de sac.

Shut your festering gob you tit. Your type makes me puke you vacuous toffee nose malodorous pervert