RugbyRebels

Is he not quite ropey at 12 too? Not to the same extent?

Mikey Brown wrote:Is he not quite ropey at 12 too? Not to the same extent?

Not to the same extent- he's not very light on his feet, and that gets more heavily exposed on the edge.

though struggling to muster the enthusiasm cant help thinking that if we are going to play kick 'n chase then let Manu go back to Leicester to work on his French, play the Ford/Farrell axis, Daly at 13 with Goode coming in at 15.

If, however, we want to play rugby and entertain then go with Robson & Cips (sorry, Ford), Devoto in at 12 with Manu pushed out one and Nowell at fb. May and the big man out wide.

p/d wrote:though struggling to muster the enthusiasm cant help thinking that if we are going to play kick 'n chase then let Manu go back to Leicester to work on his French, play the Ford/Farrell axis, Daly at 13 with Goode coming in at 15.

If, however, we want to play rugby and entertain then go with Robson & Cips (sorry, Ford), Devoto in at 12 with Manu pushed out one and Nowell at fb. May and the big man out wide.

Devoto is not retained, is he? Cipriani hasn't been called up. So, it looks like you'll have to put up with Ford and Slade.

Looks like we'll get most of the same 23, but with a few changes between starters and bench. I didnt expect anything else tbh.

I'd basically pick the team that'll play Scotland, though I concede my idea of that team and possible tactics isn't wholly synced up with Eddie's

Digby wrote:I'd basically pick the team that'll play Scotland, though I concede my idea of that team and possible tactics isn't wholly synced up with Eddie's

Never mind, Diggers. Maybe you'll be more in tune with Gatland.

Mikey Brown wrote:Is he not quite ropey at 12 too? Not to the same extent?

I wouldn’t say so personally. He’s not helped by never having had much opportunity to establish a partnership with anyone, but I think he’s a pretty sound defender.

Oakboy wrote:

Digby wrote:I'd basically pick the team that'll play Scotland, though I concede my idea of that team and possible tactics isn't wholly synced up with Eddie's

Never mind, Diggers. Maybe you'll be more in tune with Gatland.

It's an ongoing concern that the RFU are stupid enough to appoint him

Timbo wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:Is he not quite ropey at 12 too? Not to the same extent?

I wouldn’t say so personally. He’s not helped by never having had much opportunity to establish a partnership with anyone, but I think he’s a pretty sound defender.

His decision making and foot speed isn't good enough for an intl 13, but he's an ok 12 in defence-- your point about partnerships is valid, though part of that is his own availability and fitness.

Digby wrote:

Oakboy wrote:

Digby wrote:I'd basically pick the team that'll play Scotland, though I concede my idea of that team and possible tactics isn't wholly synced up with Eddie's

Never mind, Diggers. Maybe you'll be more in tune with Gatland.

It's an ongoing concern that the RFU are stupid enough to appoint him

I’m not really a fan of Gatland, but I don’t think appointing him would be ‘stupid’.

Whether you like him or not, his record is hard to argue with.

Is there a backup No.8 besides Hughes (English rugby's own Morph)?

It's Brad Shields isn't it?

morepork wrote:Is there a backup No.8 besides Hughes (English rugby's own Morph)?

It's Brad Shields isn't it?

Morgan. Great player, just ignored by little eddie.

TheDasher wrote:

morepork wrote:Is there a backup No.8 besides Hughes (English rugby's own Morph)?

It's Brad Shields isn't it?

Morgan. Great player, just ignored by little eddie.

Morgan, Mercer, Simmonds

Scrumhead wrote:

Digby wrote:

Oakboy wrote:
Never mind, Diggers. Maybe you'll be more in tune with Gatland.

It's an ongoing concern that the RFU are stupid enough to appoint him

I’m not really a fan of Gatland, but I don’t think appointing him would be ‘stupid’.

Whether you like him or not, his record is hard to argue with.

Pick big players, big players make big smash

As a record that suggests delivery at the highest levels is and will continue to be wanting, and of course it's turgid to watch

Which Tyler wrote:

TheDasher wrote:

morepork wrote:Is there a backup No.8 besides Hughes (English rugby's own Morph)?

It's Brad Shields isn't it?

Morgan. Great player, just ignored by little eddie.

Morgan, Mercer, Simmonds

Truly odd to ignore Mercer

Digby wrote:

Which Tyler wrote:

TheDasher wrote:
Morgan. Great player, just ignored by little eddie.

Morgan, Mercer, Simmonds

Truly odd to ignore Mercer

See your previous post.....

Surely Clifford is on the list, too, as he's actually in the squad.

I imagine the 8 slot is: Billy, Hughes, Wilson, Clifford, daylight, Do I really have to pick someone else? Can't I put Itoje there? Dors'll be pleased, Simmonds, Mercer.

Which Tyler wrote:

TheDasher wrote:

morepork wrote:Is there a backup No.8 besides Hughes (English rugby's own Morph)?

It's Brad Shields isn't it?

Morgan. Great player, just ignored by little eddie.

Morgan, Mercer, Simmonds

We all appear to have forgotten about Wilson already.

Puja

Puja wrote:

Which Tyler wrote:

TheDasher wrote:
Morgan. Great player, just ignored by little eddie.

Morgan, Mercer, Simmonds

We all appear to have forgotten about Wilson already.

Puja

I did forget Clifford, but wasn't about to name a starter as being a backup

Kvesic

TheDasher wrote:

morepork wrote:Is there a backup No.8 besides Hughes (English rugby's own Morph)?

It's Brad Shields isn't it?

Morgan. Great player, just ignored by little eddie.

You keep saying this. He has never been a great player.

Banquo wrote:

TheDasher wrote:

morepork wrote:Is there a backup No.8 besides Hughes (English rugby's own Morph)?

It's Brad Shields isn't it?

Morgan. Great player, just ignored by little eddie.

You keep saying this. He has never been a great player.

He was never a great player for 80 minutes, but he was on another planet to Hughes/Shields when coming off the bench.

That doesn’t help the issue of not adding much flexibility to a 23, or if there’s an early injury. I have a feeling EJ might be able to get a bit more consistency out of him, but that ship has surely sailed. Shame.

Mikey Brown wrote:

Banquo wrote:

TheDasher wrote:
Morgan. Great player, just ignored by little eddie.

You keep saying this. He has never been a great player.

He was never a great player for 80 minutes, but he was on another planet to Hughes/Shields when coming off the bench.

That doesn’t help the issue of not adding much flexibility to a 23, or if there’s an early injury. I have a feeling EJ might be able to get a bit more consistency out of him, but that ship has surely sailed. Shame.

He's a decent player who had a purple patch and got international honours during that patch. There are many players like that around the world.

Just because Hughes and Shields have been pretty poor internationally so far doesn't mean we should unfavourably compare them to domestic players when they're obviously better and offer more in different parts of the game.

OK, it's hard to make a case for Hughes, he's pretty crap, but Shields has more strings to his bow, potentially. He had form and showed it for more than 1 season. Granted in a very different style of league, but there should be no reason he cannot replicate that form in Europe and then internationally. He just hasn't been able to, yet. The bigger question is why?

I’m not sure if you think I’m actually saying Morgan should be in the squad, because I’m not, but I’d have looked at him again before the other two. I don’t really get the purple patch thing, as far as I can see he’s playing far better than either of those two at club level, anything beyond that would be guesswork.

I’m sure Shields has got something and ta not unreasonable that it might take a while to settle in on the other side of the world, but this has got echoes of Burgess the way we’re hoping that form will miraculously appear if we keep giving him international caps.