RugbyRebels

Scrumhead wrote:That penalty call to win the game is an absolutely disgraceful mistake. Carley is clueless.

Wallace puts his hands straight on the floor, so was a penalty even if Carley gave it for a different reason.

Thought Saints deserved it in the end. They definitely played like they were more desperate for the win, which makes sense as they are. Quins a tad soft and the uncontested scrums were a blow for them.

Mitchell is way, way better than Randall. Has to go on the Oz tour and should be in the 23 at least.

FKAS wrote:

Scrumhead wrote:That penalty call to win the game is an absolutely disgraceful mistake. Carley is clueless.

Quins did get a few 50/50s in their own 22. Not quite sure what the last one was for mind. Danny Care adding another yellow to his tally. I wonder at what point the RFU issue a suspension for the shear accumulation. He did nearly talk himself into a red.

Highly entertaining game. Hope the various injuries aren't too serious.

Maybe, but it was clearly a wrong decision that directly impacted the result. It was given for ‘No clear release’, but Wallace wasn’t even the tackler. Just made up bullshit.

Also James Grayson played very well. Took his opportunity to make a statement after Biggar's suspension.

Aside from my annoyance with Carley, I thought Mitchell, Ludlam and Iyogun all had excellent games. Fair play to Ratuniyawara too - definitely didn’t look like a 35 year old.

FKAS wrote:Also James Grayson played very well. Took his opportunity to make a statement after Biggar's suspension.

Yeah, and stood up to repeated batterings from Esterhuizen.

Not sure how Lawes was judged to be supporting his body-weight, which made the Wallace one feel worse.

Well feck. But well played Saints, big statement for 4th place

Agree on Mitchell, he's been solid at worst all season, and with Quirke out I'd be more than happy to see him in Aus. Randall hasn't been going so well, but I'd stick with him as the starter

The only thing with Mitchell is his fitness. It's happened a few times this season, where there's a fast-paced game and he's shattered by 50 minutes and walking from breakdown to breakdown. You wonder if he's got the engine to cope with international rugby.

I'd still take him to Australia, if only so Jones can give him a piece of his mind about his conditioning.

Puja

I'm not sure the England style of play would require the same output from the 9 as what saints play

Adam_P wrote:I'm not sure the England style of play would require the same output from the 9 as what saints play

True, but international play is more demanding physically anyway. And it does raise questions about Mitchell that he isn't able to keep up with what his club requires of him.

Puja

Thought Hinkley put in a very decent showing when he came on early for Augustus. Would be more than happy for him to be offered a contract to stay on at the club

Scrumhead wrote:

FKAS wrote:

Scrumhead wrote:That penalty call to win the game is an absolutely disgraceful mistake. Carley is clueless.

Quins did get a few 50/50s in their own 22. Not quite sure what the last one was for mind. Danny Care adding another yellow to his tally. I wonder at what point the RFU issue a suspension for the shear accumulation. He did nearly talk himself into a red.

Highly entertaining game. Hope the various injuries aren't too serious.

Maybe, but it was clearly a wrong decision that directly impacted the result. It was given for ‘No clear release’, but Wallace wasn’t even the tackler. Just made up bullshit.

Oh I was thinking the last free for all ruck from which Care got his yellow. Wallace was very unlucky, there were some less clear turnovers rewarded in that game.

Terrific match.
Saints were outstanding in the 1st half. Some of their attacking play was just sublime. Mitchell was excellent, though i do agree there might be an issue with his fitness. Some of his passing was quite sensational. He has to go to Australia. Thought Lawes and Ludlam excelled too, and Dingwall, who times a pass to perfection, is surely another who has a realistic chance of touring.
I thought there were a few close calls that Carley got wrong for both sides. Sometimes you get a 50/50, sometimes you dont.

Yes, but a top level ref shouldn’t be getting a decision that wrong when it effectively decides the game. Ultimately, we should be fine, but I’d be even more hacked off if I was a Gloucester fan.

However, SGB’s yellow was a far bigger factor IMO. We were in front with momentum and his actions screwed is over. His first offence was totally unnecessary and directly led to 3 points for Saints. His second was fairly fortunate not to be red, but as it was the yellow gave the initiative back to Saints at a critical point. With Kerrod now covering loosehead and Baxter swapping sides, I’m now really hacked off we extended his contract.

Atgentine props, eh?

Puja

Carley is crap - by far the worst Prem ref, imo. My favourite was when he pinged Grayson for side entry into the ruck when he was the one on the floor having been tackled.

Mellsblue wrote:Carley is crap - by far the worst Prem ref, imo. My favourite was when he pinged Grayson for side entry into the ruck when he was the one on the floor having been tackled.

In fairness, he was actually pinging Proctor who was blatantly in the side, and just said the wrong number.

I don't mind him as a ref. Okay, so I'd prefer it if he was a bit more generous to jackallers (the Wallace one at the end was the least objectionable of the decisions he gave against/didn't give for a jackaller, most of them against Saints!), but he is vaguely consistent in his bias on that. We could do far worse for referees.

Puja

Puja wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:Carley is crap - by far the worst Prem ref, imo. My favourite was when he pinged Grayson for side entry into the ruck when he was the one on the floor having been tackled.

In fairness, he was actually pinging Proctor who was blatantly in the side, and just said the wrong number.

Puja

I know that - I didn’t actually think he was pinging the bloke on the floor for side entry. He’s response when Grayson questioned him was “10/14, whichever”…. symptomatic of the fact the game always seems too fast for him at the breakdown. Compare with Wayne Barnes who can and does concisely and accurately explain what is happening.

Mellsblue wrote:

Puja wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:Carley is crap - by far the worst Prem ref, imo. My favourite was when he pinged Grayson for side entry into the ruck when he was the one on the floor having been tackled.

In fairness, he was actually pinging Proctor who was blatantly in the side, and just said the wrong number.

Puja

I know that - I didn’t actually think he was pinging the bloke on the floor for side entry. He’s response when Grayson questioned him was “10/14, whichever”…. symptomatic of the fact the game always seems too fast for him at the breakdown. Compare with Wayne Barnes who can and does concisely and accurately explain what is happening.

Ah, it wasn't clear that you knew - it isn't unknown for a ref to make a perplexingly bad decision like penalising a tackled player for entry.

Agreed that he's not Wayne Barnes, but few referees are. I find him to be solid enough and generally pretty reliable, so I don't tend to have a huge problem with him.

Puja

Carley's OK.
There are poorer Prem refs but overall the standard is higher then its ever been.
The reality is that the game is played at such intensity and at such pace, with a lawbook so complicated, with so many things to consider in the hurly burly that some decisions are going to be either plain wrong, or highly marginal.
I do sympathise with refs. Its a horribly difficult gig.

I think generally the refereeing didn't particularly favour either side, there were some dubious calls/non-calls both ways. The yellow for a tucked arm shoulder to Furbank's face for example, which Carley saw as 'a clear attempt to wrap'

Nutter.

Puja wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:

Puja wrote:
In fairness, he was actually pinging Proctor who was blatantly in the side, and just said the wrong number.

Puja

I know that - I didn’t actually think he was pinging the bloke on the floor for side entry. He’s response when Grayson questioned him was “10/14, whichever”…. symptomatic of the fact the game always seems too fast for him at the breakdown. Compare with Wayne Barnes who can and does concisely and accurately explain what is happening.

Ah, it wasn't clear that you knew - it isn't unknown for a ref to make a perplexingly bad decision like penalising a tackled player for entry.

Agreed that he's not Wayne Barnes, but few referees are. I find him to be solid enough and generally pretty reliable, so I don't tend to have a huge problem with him.

Puja

It’s the number of perplexing bad decisions, for me, with this one just being a personal favourite wtf.

fivepointer wrote: I do sympathise with refs. Its a horribly difficult gig.

Completely agree.

twitchy wrote:Nutter.

That's pretty grim. He's done well to play with that mess.

Just rewatched the incident that lead to Paul Hill going off and Quins were lucky to avoid another red card as Tizard clocks Lawes on the head in that tackle.