RugbyRebels

What an awful way to treat the match officials. No TMO is a right cock up as well.

Gosh, I'm so glad that I'm spending the evening respecting the Queen by watching a film instead of the rugby.

Puja

Wonder if Bristol and Sale will do a Gloucester and go after the two clubs that blocked the Friday games? It's a lot of money to lose out on...

jimKRFC wrote:Wonder if Bristol and Sale will do a Gloucester and go after the two clubs that blocked the Friday games? It's a lot of money to lose out on...

It’s a fantastic sign we’re having these discussions and the season hasn’t even kicked off. Jesus. Anyone else see the team-sheets today and just feel all interest in the season disappear?

Mikey Brown wrote:It’s a fantastic sign we’re having these discussions and the season hasn’t even kicked off. Jesus. Anyone else see the team-sheets today and just feel all interest in the season disappear?

From a pretty low point TBH.

I should be all up for the new season, and raring to go; with new coaches, fair old churn of players, brilliant new shirt etc. I should be fascinated to see how Bath can bounce back from last season, and IF it goes well, we've the talent to be top 4 - just not the systems... yet.

But

Fallow weekends, ringfencing, financial issues for Worcester and Wasps (seemingly resolved for now) and allegedly 1-2 other clubs, concussion risks - were all limiting my interest anyway.
Add in further throwing out of player welfare measures, and the clusterf*** around last night's matches - I doubt I'll watch a single match this weekend, and I don't remember the last time that happened (at least on PRTV 48 hours later).
I've not even put anything in the Predictions thread...

So will this be on a dodgy stream somewhere or did the tv people not have time to sort it out?

Annoying this hasn't been rescheduled on the TV that I can see. I was hoping for a later afternoon/early evening of back to back rugby. Like Puja had to find a film to watch last night, considerably less entertaining than the game would have been.

twitchy wrote:So will this be on a dodgy stream somewhere or did the tv people not have time to sort it out?

It's not even being filmed, as I understand it. Outside broadcast production costs a lot of money and Briz are understandably, not willing to pay a premium to hire a team on one day's notice when it wasn't their idea to postpone in the first place. Hence, no TMO.

Puja

Puja wrote:

twitchy wrote:So will this be on a dodgy stream somewhere or did the tv people not have time to sort it out?

It's not even being filmed, as I understand it. Outside broadcast production costs a lot of money and Briz are understandably, not willing to pay a premium to hire a team on one day's notice when it wasn't their idea to postpone in the first place. Hence, no TMO.

Puja

What a cock up. I'm surprised BT didn't fancy it though, could have filled a lot of time and then they could have used the replay to cover the empty airspace caused by the lack of football.

Sounds like BT might be kicking themselves for not rearranging the televising of this one. Yellow card a piece, Annett has somehow managed to get a red card from the subs bench, plenty of tries.

Bris 31 (bp) - 29 Bath

Hard to tell anything from this, but sounds like line out and discipline need a lot of work for Bris.

Bath seem to be moving in the right direction, but going the Sale/SA style of play.

It's so stupid this wasn't on tv at all.

What a shot from Randall.

Mikey Brown wrote:What a shot from Randall.

I noticed that. And then expeditious retreat before he realises who messed up his celebration.

Puja

twitchy wrote:It's so stupid this wasn't on tv at all.

I bet that move will get a few work outs this season. Having two props that can offer that carrying power really lends itself to a range of one/two or dummy moves. It's a really nice line by Ellis and the defence all honey pots in to Sinckler.

Apparently it was filmed:


Looks like a hell of a match.

Puja

You can tell there was no TMO because there was two cards following the handbags and neither was for Redpath who started it all by acting like a dick.

Special efforts from Genge for his two tries. Neat try from Spencer, too.

Right, watch Bath v Bristol now - only going to comment on stuff I think would go to the TMO had he existed. I'll ignore defensive line being offside at every breakdown, as that really ought to be the same for both teams.
I apologise in advance if this post is going to come across as critical of the ref - but then, that's kinda the point of it.

Times on the PRL video, as obviously, there's no match clock


0:53 - forward pass from Sinckler to Genge, resulting in the first try to Genge. Ref is un-sighted as Bath's close defense rushes past him. It's a brilliant line, good hands from both, and identifies a slight dogleg in the Bath defense (which I'd put down to a lack of understanding between McNally and Cloete); but it's still forward, and a TMO would still likely have called that back.

4:00 - mess of collecting a high ball, Bath emerge with it - no idea what's going on from the 1 angle available. Ref is well positioned, but I suspect a TMO would have a look in the background whilst play continues.

6:52 - Bristol player runs into his own man before setting a ruck - immaterial, and nothing comes from it, but I'm amazed the ref doesn't even mention it. Probably more one for Bath's skipper to mention than the TMO.

12:00 - Bristol wing involving himself on the wrong side of a ruck - pretty sure the ref sees it and regards it as immaterial as the ball bobbles out, but is clean away from Spencer - may have been looked at as the recipient of Spencer's pass then has help from an offside man - ref allows both to go, but wonder if he'd have done the same if TMO had been there.
ETA: probably not, as ref has a word with McNally next time the ball goes dead. Obviously considered both to have been accidental and immaterial.

35:50 - Boyce carries into the tackle, and for my money, he gets his timing wrong to push the tackler off, and it becomes a forearm smash - I'd want a TMO to have a look at that. PRTV is not convenient for multiple watches though.

36:19 - Afters at a ruck, the ball is out, and the camera pans away, but an extra Genge is joining the ruck after the ball is gone, and has been called out - he should be helping his scrum half not bundling into the Bath man on the floor (it's Boyce with Genge and 2 other Bristol players, so I wonder if this is payback for 30 seconds earlier). This is exactly what a TMO is there for - foul play is happening, probably by both teams.

38:34 - Genge is choking Attwood in a maul, and emerges with Attwood's scrum cap as a prize - I like to think a TMO would have a word about that, but equally, I like to think Ellis wouldn't have tried it if a TMO had been there. But that's probably me showing why I'm a back, not a forward, Attwood himself doesn't seem particularly fussed about it.

38:51 - Brilliant by Bristol for Morahan's try. No way a TMO doesn't get involved in sorting out the scuffles. Annett trots across and gets involved, well deserving his red - It's stupid, but not the sort I'm unhappy about as a fan - he's helping his mate who's "fighting" 4 on his own, and doing so before the officials establish any control over things. I think this has been brewing since 35:50, and a stronger ref wouldn't have let it reach this point - a TMO would definitely have helped by looking at those 2 incidents 30 seconds apart.

43:54 - Another scuffle - well, 2 scuffles, and again, this is the point of the TMO - and again, this is happening because of weak reffing earlier - players are taking it into their own hands. HT can't come soon enough for the coaches to calm down their charges. TBH, a good long TMO review after the last one would have helped massively and allowed the captains to do so. Ref lays down the law, but it's simply too late.


And that's the half - overall impressions:
1. that Bath away kit is still utterly ghastly - mid-greys just never work.
2. First try, by Genge was brilliant play by Bristol, but it was still a forward pass - TMO would have picked it up. This is probably the only time a TMO would have made a difference on the score board.
3. Lack of TMO, coupled with a ref who wasn't really giving warnings to players to calm down, to not do that again etc etc allowed things to reach boiling point.
4. Once things have reached boiling point, teams just need a bit of time to calm down again, rather going straight at it again - a side-effect bonus of what would inevitably have been a lengthy TMO review of the first scuffle.
5. With a TMO, I think Boyce gives away a penalty and probably a yellow (or it's examined and found innocent) - and Bristol tempers don't flare at 36 minutes, and Bath tempers don't flare in response at 38 minutes.
6. General play, Bath maybe a bit better at going through the middle, Bristol better at going around. But then, we could have said as much from the team announcement. This is miles away from Bath of last season; but if we continue this style of play through the season, there's going to be a lot of bored spectators.
7. Very worried for Beno's health now.

1:06:32 - Bath get the ball over the tryline, and it's a mess - TMO always looks at those to check the grounding. The 1 camera angle we have on PRTV couldn't be positioned much worse for that. Try is given, I doubt that anyone knows if the ball was actually down or not.


1:18:00 - Bath get the ball over the line in the middle of another mess - normally, TMO would check that just in case, but I can't see a way for the ball to get to the ground, given the final carry. Try not given, and I doubt a TMO would have changed that, or taken long to reach the decision.


- Not TMO related - Gods that 2nd try for Genge - Bath were just switched off completely. I know we were tired, yes, I know he took it from 1m in front of the mark, but come on!


1:35:46 - Bristol this time get the ball over the line in the middle of a mess - As before, you'd expect a TMO review, from the one angle, I have no idea if try was good or not, but ref well positioned and a try certainly should have been scored. Try given.



TMO would have been involved the 2nd half, but I'm not convinced he would have changed anything.

General thoughts - much better fro Bath than last year, but still no particular invention, and moments of just switching off. Even the last try seemed like lazy maul defence - from someone who's never knowingly been involved in a maul.

2 weeks for Annet. What did he actually do?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/62904277

twitchy wrote:2 weeks for Annet. What did he actually do?

He sauntered onto the pitch to help pull people away from handbags. But as a sub, he's not allowed on the pitch without an invitation from the ref.

Which Tyler wrote:

twitchy wrote:2 weeks for Annet. What did he actually do?

He sauntered onto the pitch to help pull people away from handbags. But as a sub, he's not allowed on the pitch without an invitation from the ref.

He's unlucky - were he on the pitch, it'd likely be a yellow at worst, but the only sanction a ref can give a sub is a red and as soon as it's red, he's got to get banned.

Puja

Puja wrote:He's unlucky - were he on the pitch, it'd likely be a yellow at worst, but the only sanction a ref can give a sub is a red and as soon as it's red, he's got to get banned.

I didn't see anything worthy of a card, any colour, had he actually been allowed on the pitch in the first place. I also don't thin luck had anything to do with it - he was on the pitch when he wasn't allowed to be - that's surely got to be a red, and any deserved red should be a ban, the only question is how long for - anything between 1 and 3 feels about right.

Redpath was a bit of a twat - but nothing to deserve a sanction. I'd be happy for it to deserve a restart penalty, but it'd be pretty unique in rugby.
Monohan pushed him a bit - but nothing deserving a sanction.
Sheedy rushed in - escalating things, and deserving a red.
Everyone else rushed in as a result of Sheedy's intervention.
Annett eventually wanders across and pulls some people by the shoulders.

Of course, there was a lot happening with handbags spilling across 3 different groupings of players, but I didn't notice anything else worthy of more than a warning. Easily possible I missed something.

It's all around 39 minutes on the PRTV timeline, for anyone to have a look, but without replays at the time, PRTV is a right bugger to watch the same incident multiple times.