RugbyRebels

32000 sounds much more likely than the 40k you seemingly pulled out of yer erse for the other thread. Half full as I said.

It was actually the figure I heard during the commentary. Anyway, the main thing is the final is sell-out. That's going to be one helluva final. I'm almost glad the Canes lost (almost) . . .

South African ref for the final. Surely the ref should come from a neutral country.

Eugene Wrayburn wrote:32000 sounds much more likely than the 40k you seemingly pulled out of yer erse for the other thread. Half full as I said.

So 32K, if that's the official figure, sounds paltry to you. But I just checked the attendance figures for the Pro 12 semis, both of which were held in Ireland, and they were 15K and 18K, - or basically half the size of the crowd at Ellis Park on Saturday. Moreover, the final, also held in Ireland, draw just over 40K. The final at Ellis Park is already a sell-out with over 60K tickets available.

Why on earth would you want to stage the sport's premier event on a tiny, rain-swept island that has a miserable record at the tournament and doesn't even get decent crowds along to major games? Worst idea ever!

rowan wrote:SA has not won a Super Rugby title since 2010. Since then 5 new champs have been crowned, including 3 in the past 3 years. The Bulls are the only SA team to have won the championship. The Lions, Sharks & Stormers are the only Super Rugby foundation teams yet to win the title. NZ has won 14 titles (Crusaders claiming half of them), Australia 4 and SA 3. NZ teams won the first 5 Super Rugby titles, but have not won 3 in a row this century

So the Crusaders move to 8 titles, which is more than half of NZ's share and more than Australian & SA teams combined. Bulls are still the only SA team to have won the title, and the Lions, Sharks & Stormers remain the only foundation teams yet to win it. NZ teams have won 3 championships in a row for the first time this century.

Most capped tier 1 XV

15. Chris Paterson – Scotland (109 caps)

14. Adam Ashley-Cooper – Australia (116 caps)

13. Brian O’Driscoll – Ireland (141 caps)

12. Ma’a Nonu – New Zealand (103 caps)

11. Bryan Habana – South Africa (124 caps)

10. Ronan O’Gara – Ireland (130 caps)

9. George Gregan – Australia (139 caps)

1. Gethin Jenkins – Wales (134 caps)

2. Kevin Mealamu – New Zealand (132 caps)

3. Martin Castrogiovani – Italy (119 caps)

4. Victor Matfield – South Africa (127 caps)

5. Alun Wyn Jones – Wales (119 caps)

6. George Smith – Australia (111 caps)

7. Richie McCaw – New Zealand (148 caps)

8. Sergio Parisse – Italy (126 caps)

https://www.ruck.co.uk/capped-rugby-xv- ... o-parisse/

Do those numbers for O'Driscoll, O'Gara, Jenkins and Jones include Lions tests?

My guess is - no - but I'm not sure.

Rugby Championship teams' all-time records against 6 Nations teams:

Team: NZL . SAF . Aus . Arg
v Eng 32-7 23-13 25-22 4-17
v Fra 44-12 25-11 27-18 14-34
v Wal 30-3 28-3 29-10 5-11
v Sco 28-0 21-5 21-10 9-7
v Ire 28-1 18-6 21-11 6-10
v Ita 13-0 12-1 17-0 15-5

Totals & winning averages

NZL 173 - 23 88%
SAF 129 - 39 77%
Aus 145 - 71 67%
Arg 53 - 85 38%

Combined totals:

RC 510 6N 218
RC winning average 70%

NB: Only Argentina has losing averages against any 6 Nations teams (all of them except Scotland & Italy).
NB: Scotland & Italy have never beaten NZ, and Italy has also never beaten Australia.

rowan wrote:Rugby Championship teams' all-time records against 6 Nations teams:

Team: NZL . SAF . Aus . Arg
v Eng 32-7 23-13 25-22 4-17
v Fra 44-12 25-11 27-18 14-34
v Wal 30-3 28-3 29-10 5-11
v Sco 28-0 21-5 21-10 9-7
v Ire 28-1 18-6 21-11 6-10
v Ita 13-0 12-1 17-0 15-5

Totals & winning averages

NZL 173 - 23 88%
SAF 129 - 39 77%
Aus 145 - 71 67%
Arg 53 - 85 38%

Combined totals:

RC 510 6N 218
RC winning average 70%

NB: Only Argentina has losing averages against any 6 Nations teams (all of them except Scotland & Italy).
NB: Scotland & Italy have never beaten NZ, and Italy has also never beaten Australia.

6 Nations teams v Rugby Championship teams:

Team Wins Losses Average
England 59-84 41%
France 75-110 40.5%
Wales 27-92 32%
Scotland 22-79 21.7%
Ireland 28-73 27.7%
Italy 6-57 9.5%

Pro14
No T2/3 players at Dragons, Munster, Scarlets, Kings, Ulster, .

Canada:
Jeff Hassler (Ospreys)

Fiji:
Michael Tagicakibau (Treviso)
Naulia Dawai (Connacht)
Viliame Mata (Edinburgh)
Isa Nacewa (Leinster)

Georgia:
Anton Peikrishvili (Blues)

Moldova:
Dimitri Arhip (Ospreys)

Namibia:
Torsten van Jaarsveld (Cheetahs)
Aranos Coetzee (Cheetahs)
Anton Bresler (Edinburgh)

Samoa:
Rey Lee-lo (Blues)
Kieron Fonotia (Ospreys)
Failaga Afamasaga (Zebre)

Tonga:
Tau Filise (Blues)
Siua Halanukonuka (Glasgow)
Ma'afu Fia (Ospreys)

U.S.:
Blaine Scully (Blues)
Greg Peterson (Glasgow)

Total: 18

Average per side:
Welsh sides: 2
Scottish sides: 2
Italian sides: 1
South African sides: 1
Irish sides: 0.5

Ospreys and Blues are tied for the most T2/3 players with 4 each.

Most pundits seem to be thinking the All Blacks will extend their unbeaten stretch against the Wallabies to 6 tomorrow. Even a Bledisloe clean sweep this year won’t match the record though. All Black’s longest winning streaks v Aussie:

10 (2008-2010)*
9 (1936-1947)
7 (1967-1974)
7 (1995-1997)
5 (2005-2006)
5* (2015- )

The longest undefeated run was 11, the 1967-74 fun above was ended by a draw which was followed by 3 more wins through to 1978.

The Wallabies have never won more than 3 on the trot v NZ.

Is that the 3rd time in a row South Africa have won by the same score?

Oh, just checked. Their last 4 results have been 37-15, 35-12, 37-15, 37-14. Freaky

& meanwhile SA U21 beat France U21 37-14 the day before the seniors beat them by the same score. Curiouser and curiouser...

Nations holding both Men's and Women's Rugby World Cups at the same time?

1. New Zealand, 2017, 18, 19.

To take it a step further, the RWC, Womens RWC, U20 WC, Sevens RWC and Womens Sevens RWC are all in the NZRU trophy cabinet. Plus the Bledisloe and a few other minor bits of metal, I'm sure.

zer0 wrote:To take it a step further, the RWC, Womens RWC, U20 WC, Sevens RWC and Womens Sevens RWC are all in the NZRU trophy cabinet. Plus the Bledisloe and a few other minor bits of metal, I'm sure.

Holy crap! Pretty awesome.

zer0 wrote:To take it a step further, the RWC, Womens RWC, U20 WC, Sevens RWC and Womens Sevens RWC are all in the NZRU trophy cabinet. Plus the Bledisloe and a few other minor bits of metal, I'm sure.

...such as The Rugby Championship, Freedom Cup, Dave Gallaher Trophy and Hillary Shield.* I'm not sure there is any current trophy for which an NZ rep team is eligible that we don't hold. Mind you that is only because unlike SA and Aust, we don't have a trophy at stake with the Lions.

The only other sides that have beaten the All Blacks in at least one test but with whom we do not compete for bilateral trophy are Ireland and Wales. Depending on the rules that might be applied, Ireland could have been the holder of such a trophy** after drawing what might be seen as a 2 match series last year. As for Wales, probably the less said the better about the need for such a trophy over the last 60 years.

*And of course the Raeburn Shield
**It's a shame that "Dave Gallaher Trophy" has been used for the French. Gallaher was born in Ireland, and died in France. Althought there have been 4 other Irish-born All Blacks, none were capped in tests. We would have to go for a Kiwi-born Irishman, althought I'm not sure that "Isaac Boss Cup" has the same ring to it.

No problems personally with the Dave Gallaher Trophy. Captain of the Originals back in the day when, presumably, about half the Pakeha population was British or Irish born. & at least they named it after a rugby player and not some racist twat from British history who had precisely zero to do with the game (which has occurred a few times in recent decades).

I just mean it's a shame that DG's name is not available for a bilateral trophy with the Irish.

Sure, I understood that. & while I had no objection to teams competing for silverware, I would hate to see trophies being presented in order to consolidate regular ties between the elite international teams. I realize they're already playing each other practically every season these days - often more than once - but that shouldn't be set in stone if the game has a future beyond its very limited traditional environs.

To answer a question on another thread...

Overseas win percentages by Super Rugby teams
Crusaders 54/97, 55.7%
Hurricanes 44/90, 48.9%
Highlanders 38/92 41.3%
Chiefs 37/91, 40.7%
Blues 36/89, 40.4%
Stormers 32/83, 38.6%
Brumbies 39/105, 37.1%
Sharks 33/91, 36.3%
Warratahs 35/104, 33.7%
Kings 4/12, 33.3%
Reds 28/100, 28.0%
Force 15/55, 27.3%
Jaguares 4/15, 26.7%
Bulls 17/85, 20.0%
Lions 15/81, 18.5%
Cheetahs 9/51, 17.6%
Rebels 2/29, 6.9%
Sunwolves 0/15, 0.0%

That's some quality wum stattage Liz.

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J Dory wrote:That's some quality wum stattage Liz.

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How so?

Saturday will be the All Blacks’ 4th test in New Plymouth where they are undefeated so far:
2008 NZ 101 v Samoa 14
2010 NZ 66 v Ireland 28
2013 NZ 24 v France 9

Tonga has awarded test caps against non-capped NZ sides twice at this ground, losing both matches:
1975 NZ Maori 23 v Tonga 16
2006 Junior All Blacks 38 v Tonga 10

Neutral tests have been staged here in various tournaments:
2006 PNC Samoa 53 v Japan 9
2011 RWC Ireland 22 v USA 10
2011 RWC USA 13 v Russia 6
2011 RWC Wales 81 v Namibia 7