RugbyRebels

Spiffy wrote:

Banquo wrote:Sarries far better on the day. They were very good ball in hand. Itoje, Vunipolas, Kruis, George all good, and faz played very well 1st half.

Sarries would be even better without the pedestrian Wiggy.

Spencer was way worse, not that that helps.

Banquo wrote:

Spiffy wrote:

Banquo wrote:Sarries far better on the day. They were very good ball in hand. Itoje, Vunipolas, Kruis, George all good, and faz played very well 1st half.

Sarries would be even better without the pedestrian Wiggy.

Spencer was way worse, not that that helps.

Spencer has not come close to realizing the potential he showed a few seasons ago. Wonder what went wrong. He should probablay have changed clubs a couple of years ago. It seems the window of opportunity has passed and he's well down the national peck order now.

16th man wrote:Can't help but feel Baxter failed a test today. When it became apparent after 30 minutes that their plan A, wrapping around, putting power through 1 or 2 out runners and denying the opposition ball through repeated phases, guaranteed by sealing off, wasn't working, there didn't appear to be a plan B.

You are right to an extent but that is the whole game plan that works on most other teams. It's just that sarries sort of hard counter it.

Spiffy wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Spiffy wrote:
Sarries would be even better without the pedestrian Wiggy.

Spencer was way worse, not that that helps.

Spencer has not come close to realizing the potential he showed a few seasons ago. Wonder what went wrong. He should probablay have changed clubs a couple of years ago. It seems the window of opportunity has passed and he's well down the national peck order now.

I thought Wigglesworth went well. Accurate passes, swift service from the base when required, a few snipes round the fringes to keep the guards honest and good box kicking.

Spencer is going to SA, albeit only because Care and the Wiggler are rested. I’ve never thought he’s been the answer, though. If he were he would’ve pushed past Wiggles. You could argue that their conservative gameplan has kept Wigster in place as he suits a kicking game better but even when Sarries have changed to more of a running game this year Spencer still hasn’t become first choice.

twitchy wrote:

16th man wrote:Can't help but feel Baxter failed a test today. When it became apparent after 30 minutes that their plan A, wrapping around, putting power through 1 or 2 out runners and denying the opposition ball through repeated phases, guaranteed by sealing off, wasn't working, there didn't appear to be a plan B.

You are right to an extent but that is the whole game plan that works on most other teams. It's just that sarries sort of hard counter it.

The problem is that it consistently doesn't work when it comes to the really big games against top teams. It happened vs Sarries in 2016, again in 2018, and pretty much every time in Europe. They've got to adapt sooner or later.

Puja

Fair dos, Sarries have been awesome the last two weeks, there's so much to admire about their game. Exeter never really got going because they were constantly taking the ball 10 yards back rather than almost on the gainline like Sarries. Wasps had the same trouble last week and it's a constant refrain against Sarries defence. It wasn't just Simmonds though, very few of their forwards were taking it flat or in sufficient numbers.

When everyone's at full strength Sarries overall quality just makes the difference. Itoje was an absolute menace yest, back to his best.

Puja wrote:

twitchy wrote:

16th man wrote:Can't help but feel Baxter failed a test today. When it became apparent after 30 minutes that their plan A, wrapping around, putting power through 1 or 2 out runners and denying the opposition ball through repeated phases, guaranteed by sealing off, wasn't working, there didn't appear to be a plan B.

You are right to an extent but that is the whole game plan that works on most other teams. It's just that sarries sort of hard counter it.

The problem is that it consistently doesn't work when it comes to the really big games against top teams. It happened vs Sarries in 2016, again in 2018, and pretty much every time in Europe. They've got to adapt sooner or later.

Puja

Yep, though I think Exe have been very unlucky in Europe this year. Both the quality of their group and a couple of results.
Until Baxter gets them consistently into the later stages of Europe and makes them a more rounded team he shouldn’t be considered for England.

Beasties wrote:Exeter never really got going because they were constantly taking the ball 10 yards back rather than almost on the gainline like Sarries. Wasps had the same trouble last week and it's a constant refrain against Sarries defence. It wasn't just Simmonds though, very few of their forwards were taking it flat or in sufficient numbers.

This stuck me as odd, too.

Mellsblue wrote: Yep, though I think Exe have been very unlucky in Europe this year. Both the quality of their group and a couple of results.
Until Baxter gets them consistently into the later stages of Europe and makes them a more rounded team he shouldn’t be considered for England.

Sarries a few seasons back were a far more prescriptive side doing certain things in certain areas, now they're a much more on the field decision based outfit which gives them more options than Exeter, though Sarries are a few seasons ahead of Exeter.

For Baxter to run England I'd certainly want him to develop the attack, ideally I'd like to see him succeed elsewhere with a different culture as well as develop a side to offer more on attack. That said the last few actual England coaches haven't done a lot to develop attack beyond some very prescriptive ideas.

Spiffy wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Spiffy wrote:
Sarries would be even better without the pedestrian Wiggy.

Spencer was way worse, not that that helps.

Spencer has not come close to realizing the potential he showed a few seasons ago. Wonder what went wrong. He should probablay have changed clubs a couple of years ago. It seems the window of opportunity has passed and he's well down the national peck order now.

..except he has just been picked to tour SA

Which Tyler wrote:

fantastic

Ha. Very good.