RugbyRebels

caldeyrfc wrote:

gthedog wrote:

caldeyrfc wrote:The idea that putting a couple of check points across a few roads while blocking others will stop people who mean harm is truly laughable We have some of the most strictest border controls in Europe and yet, if we were to believe some, we are being overrun by by illegal immigrants and lets not start on how all the drugs come into this country

And yet the discussion is about a Belgian national who made the bombs that detonated in Paris and hopefully doing something to take back control of a porous situation that isn't working particularly well
You're mixing apples and oranges to suit your argument just for a change

Says the man who refuses to answer a simple question

Are we safer in the EU? Debatable
Does Brussels have a jihadi issue? And does Europe also? By its own Europol leader's own words he reckons there's 5000 jihadists

gthedog wrote:

caldeyrfc wrote:The idea that putting a couple of check points across a few roads while blocking others will stop people who mean harm is truly laughable We have some of the most strictest border controls in Europe and yet, if we were to believe some, we are being overrun by by illegal immigrants and lets not start on how all the drugs come into this country

And yet the discussion is about a Belgian national who made the bombs that detonated in Paris and hopefully doing something to take back control of a porous situation that isn't working particularly well
You're mixing apples and oranges to suit your argument just for a change

How would have tighter immigration controls stopped a BELGIAN national from bombing BELGIUM?!?!

gthedog wrote:

caldeyrfc wrote:

gthedog wrote:
And yet the discussion is about a Belgian national who made the bombs that detonated in Paris and hopefully doing something to take back control of a porous situation that isn't working particularly well
You're mixing apples and oranges to suit your argument just for a change

Says the man who refuses to answer a simple question

Are we safer in the EU? Debatable
Does Brussels have a jihadi issue? And does Europe also? By its own Europol leader's own words he reckons there's 5000 jihadists

Well if you are going to ask yourself a question and then answering it yourself there no point in you joining the thread is there

gthedog wrote:

caldeyrfc wrote:

gthedog wrote:
And yet the discussion is about a Belgian national who made the bombs that detonated in Paris and hopefully doing something to take back control of a porous situation that isn't working particularly well
You're mixing apples and oranges to suit your argument just for a change

Says the man who refuses to answer a simple question

Are we safer in the EU? Debatable
Does Brussels have a jihadi issue? And does Europe also? By its own Europol leader's own words he reckons there's 5000 jihadists

Must be telling the truth then....I mean it's not like he's not got a conflict of interest in promoting a bogeyman for us all to fear now is....

G is obviously fearful that the mooslamic terrorists will be along now with the mooslamic rayguns.

Idiot.

Stooo wrote:

gthedog wrote:

caldeyrfc wrote:The idea that putting a couple of check points across a few roads while blocking others will stop people who mean harm is truly laughable We have some of the most strictest border controls in Europe and yet, if we were to believe some, we are being overrun by by illegal immigrants and lets not start on how all the drugs come into this country

And yet the discussion is about a Belgian national who made the bombs that detonated in Paris and hopefully doing something to take back control of a porous situation that isn't working particularly well
You're mixing apples and oranges to suit your argument just for a change

How would have tighter immigration controls stopped a BELGIAN national from bombing BELGIUM?!?!

The man who supposedly made the bombs did so for Paris and another was involved in the Paris attacks
Is this difficult to understand? Plus the weapons used in Paris by a Belgian born French national who ran back to Belgium were moved across Europe freely

So a french national then.

Nothing to do with Schengen then?

Thanks for admitting it G. Most big of you.

Stooo wrote:So a french national then.

Nothing to do with Schengen then?

Thanks for admitting it G. Most big of you.

God you're confusing yourself here
He is Belgian born french national, attacked Paris and went to Brussels - a different city in a different country - using weapons moved across Europe probably from the Balkans. But no you carry on with your bellix

gthedog wrote:

Stooo wrote:So a french national then.

Nothing to do with Schengen then?

Thanks for admitting it G. Most big of you.

God you're confusing yourself here
He is Belgian born french national, attacked Paris and went to Brussels - a different city in a different country - using weapons moved across Europe probably from the Balkans. But no you carry on with your bellix

If he's belgian born AND a french national he would be able to move between both without schengen.

But no.. leaving the EU is a magic wand to solve your "muslim problem"

gthedog wrote:

Stooo wrote:

gthedog wrote:
And yet the discussion is about a Belgian national who made the bombs that detonated in Paris and hopefully doing something to take back control of a porous situation that isn't working particularly well
You're mixing apples and oranges to suit your argument just for a change

How would have tighter immigration controls stopped a BELGIAN national from bombing BELGIUM?!?!

The man who supposedly made the bombs did so for Paris and another was involved in the Paris attacks
Is this difficult to understand? Plus the weapons used in Paris by a Belgian born French national who ran back to Belgium were moved across Europe freely

Don't know if you ever moved about Europe before Schengenn but there were hardly long hold ups between borders back then In fact I travelled round various parts of Europe before 95 playing rugby and the ONLY time I have been asked to produce my passport was to get into the UK

caldeyrfc wrote:

gthedog wrote:

Stooo wrote:
How would have tighter immigration controls stopped a BELGIAN national from bombing BELGIUM?!?!

The man who supposedly made the bombs did so for Paris and another was involved in the Paris attacks
Is this difficult to understand? Plus the weapons used in Paris by a Belgian born French national who ran back to Belgium were moved across Europe freely

Don't know if you ever moved about Europe before Schengenn but there were hardly long hold ups between borders back then In fact I travelled round various parts of Europe before 95 playing rugby and the ONLY time I have been asked to produce my passport was to get into the UK

I imagine if you've got a belgian passport because you were born there it's not exactly a hinderance either.

Don't want to talk about the weapons then? Or those coming back and forth from Syria?
I too have moved freely round Europe - great isn't it - but I wouldn't have minded a few moments a border control to check my passport

BTW Schengen was originally signed in 1985 by 5 including France and Belgium but I won't let some facts get in the way of you

agh. Just say "racial profiling" and be done with it.

morepork wrote:agh. Just say "racial profiling" and be done with it.

All of these men were known to the authorities so it doesn't even need to be that advanced.
Recently read an article that looking at everyone doesn't help as it creates more noise and confusion than clarity for those who need to look

gthedog wrote:

morepork wrote:agh. Just say "racial profiling" and be done with it.

All of these men were known to the authorities so it doesn't even need to be that advanced.
Recently read an article that looking at everyone doesn't help as it creates more noise and confusion than clarity for those who need to look

Are you saying that if someone "is known to the authorities" whatever that means, should be followed 24 hours a day? Like to see you bleat about how much extra tax that would mean to pay for it

caldeyrfc wrote:

gthedog wrote:

morepork wrote:agh. Just say "racial profiling" and be done with it.

All of these men were known to the authorities so it doesn't even need to be that advanced.
Recently read an article that looking at everyone doesn't help as it creates more noise and confusion than clarity for those who need to look

Are you saying that if someone "is known to the authorities" whatever that means, should be followed 24 hours a day? Like to see you bleat about how much extra tax that would mean to pay for it

You don't really understand what our security services do a lot of their time do you? We're already paying for it

gthedog wrote:

caldeyrfc wrote:

gthedog wrote:
All of these men were known to the authorities so it doesn't even need to be that advanced.
Recently read an article that looking at everyone doesn't help as it creates more noise and confusion than clarity for those who need to look

Are you saying that if someone "is known to the authorities" whatever that means, should be followed 24 hours a day? Like to see you bleat about how much extra tax that would mean to pay for it

You don't really understand what our security services do a lot of their time do you? We're already paying for it

Do you? how else would we know what they are doing? Unless you want to set up internment again and lock away all the "little brown men" you don't like the look of

What of the caucasian cowboys that have been going over to fight against Assad with Kurdish militia? Is that shyte clamped down on?

They're always 'known to the security services' aren't they?

And we never ever get trials in open court to examine the evidence.

Gladio anyone?

caldeyrfc wrote:The idea that putting a couple of check points across a few roads while blocking others will stop people who mean harm is truly laughable We have some of the most strictest border controls in Europe and yet, if we were to believe some, we are being overrun by by illegal immigrants and lets not start on how all the drugs come into this country

We aren't part of the broader EU agreement on open boarders.

Stooo wrote:

gthedog wrote:

Stooo wrote:So a french national then.

Nothing to do with Schengen then?

Thanks for admitting it G. Most big of you.

God you're confusing yourself here
He is Belgian born french national, attacked Paris and went to Brussels - a different city in a different country - using weapons moved across Europe probably from the Balkans. But no you carry on with your bellix

If he's belgian born AND a french national he would be able to move between both without schengen.

But no.. leaving the EU is a magic wand to solve your "muslim problem"

He would have, but the movement of weapons would have been more difficult.

Even with the more stringent border checks, contraband will always get through. But, this involves a risk that the good that are being smuggled will be intercepted. Between the countries where many of these weapons start their journey and the likes of France and Belgium, there are about half a dozen or so opportunities for border checks. As a terrorist planner, or more likely as an arms smuggler for general black market purposes, that would involve considerable risk. At the moment, there is very minimal risk that anything will be intercepted, provided the couriers behave themselves en-route.

This doesn't really affect the UK (or Ireland) as we are not part of Schengen and have geography on our side. But it does affect mainland Europe. With the current heightened threat, how many explosive detection dogs would be posted at crossing points, or something like a Backscatter vehicle? It would be a hell of a risk which is why the current situation makes life much easier. Naturally, it would also inhibit free trade, which is why the border controls aren't there under Schengen.

To hijack that particular example for the leave or remain campaign is a bit dishonest. As we aren't part of Schengen, it doesn't affect us directly, although the presence of border checks across western Europe would add a defence in depth approach to our own borders. Us remaining or leaving the EU wont change that. The security debate for us involves things like intelligence sharing and closer police cooperation, not border checks as much.

Sandydragon wrote:

caldeyrfc wrote:The idea that putting a couple of check points across a few roads while blocking others will stop people who mean harm is truly laughable We have some of the most strictest border controls in Europe and yet, if we were to believe some, we are being overrun by by illegal immigrants and lets not start on how all the drugs come into this country

We aren't part of the broader EU agreement on open boarders.

Never said we was Sandy

There's a lot of to do about a couple of dozen dead Belgians, which I agree is tragic, but why no international media response to 142 students killed by Islamic extremists in Kenya?

Lizard wrote:There's a lot of to do about a couple of dozen dead Belgians, which I agree is tragic, but why no international media response to 142 students killed by Islamic extremists in Kenya?

Are you talking about the attack from this time last year?

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