GOAT - The eternal debate

[Numbers]

Djokovic has the tennis GOAT wrapped up:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/67468494

He's not very good at Biology mind you, this is what he had to say about the Donkey cheese he's so fond of:

"It is a very expensive one and it is good quality. I have heard that they milk donkeys but I was not sure if that was possible. It is such an interesting story," he said.

He's not sure if you can milk a donkey it seems, perhaps he's been trying to milk the wrong ones..

[Stom]

Djokovic has the tennis GOAT wrapped up:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/67468494

No. A prize cwnt like him can't be GOAT. The GOAT of Tennis is surely more like Serena Williams...

[Son of Mathonwy]

Djokovic has the tennis GOAT wrapped up:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/67468494

He's not very good at Biology mind you, this is what he had to say about the Donkey cheese he's so fond of:

"It is a very expensive one and it is good quality. I have heard that they milk donkeys but I was not sure if that was possible. It is such an interesting story," he said.

He's not sure if you can milk a donkey it seems, perhaps he's been trying to milk the wrong ones..

Yeah, I would definitely establish if donkeys can be milked before tasting their cheese.

I'm not sure I'd take his immunological advice either.

[Son of Mathonwy]

Djokovic has the tennis GOAT wrapped up:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/67468494

No. A prize cwnt like him can't be GOAT. The GOAT of Tennis is surely more like Serena Williams...

Coz she's such a sweetie.

Djokovic ain't going to win the all-time most popular tennis player poll, but sport isn't about popularity.

[Stom]

Djokovic has the tennis GOAT wrapped up:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/67468494

No. A prize cwnt like him can't be GOAT. The GOAT of Tennis is surely more like Serena Williams...

Coz she's such a sweetie.

Djokovic ain't going to win the all-time most popular tennis player poll, but sport isn't about popularity.

It’s also about how they make you feel. And not only is he an absolute cwnt, he’s also the most boring champion in history. It’s just so hideously boring.

[Mellsblue]

No. A prize cwnt like him can't be GOAT. The GOAT of Tennis is surely more like Serena Williams...

Coz she's such a sweetie.

Djokovic ain't going to win the all-time most popular tennis player poll, but sport isn't about popularity.

It’s also about how they make you feel.

In that case, I nominate Sam Quek.

[Son of Mathonwy]

No. A prize cwnt like him can't be GOAT. The GOAT of Tennis is surely more like Serena Williams...

Coz she's such a sweetie.

Djokovic ain't going to win the all-time most popular tennis player poll, but sport isn't about popularity.

It’s also about how they make you feel. And not only is he an absolute cwnt, he’s also the most boring champion in history. It’s just so hideously boring.

That's just another way of saying how popular they are. I know these GOAT debates are difficult but if we ignore sporting achievements in favour of 'I like him more' then we might as well just have a popularity contest. I mean I suspect Michael Schumacher was more popular in Germany than in the UK but was he a better driver in Germany than the UK?

[Stom]

Coz she's such a sweetie.

Djokovic ain't going to win the all-time most popular tennis player poll, but sport isn't about popularity.

It’s also about how they make you feel. And not only is he an absolute cwnt, he’s also the most boring champion in history. It’s just so hideously boring.

That's just another way of saying how popular they are. I know these GOAT debates are difficult but if we ignore sporting achievements in favour of 'I like him more' then we might as well just have a popularity contest. I mean I suspect Michael Schumacher was more popular in Germany than in the UK but was he a better driver in Germany than the UK?

On F1, Senna always enters the chat because of how he made people feel. He didn't win 7 titles...

Anyway, I still think there is someone who is often overlooked here, who has a genuine claim...

Sir Steve Redgrave.

[Puja]

Coz she's such a sweetie.

Djokovic ain't going to win the all-time most popular tennis player poll, but sport isn't about popularity.

It’s also about how they make you feel. And not only is he an absolute cwnt, he’s also the most boring champion in history. It’s just so hideously boring.

That's just another way of saying how popular they are. I know these GOAT debates are difficult but if we ignore sporting achievements in favour of 'I like him more' then we might as well just have a popularity contest. I mean I suspect Michael Schumacher was more popular in Germany than in the UK but was he a better driver in Germany than the UK?

While I agree that Djokovic is a terrible person, I agree with SoM - GOAT is about performances on the pitch/court, not what they do outside of it.

Schumacher's actually a difficult example, because his bad behaviour was on the track (I understand he was an absolute gent in person) and arguably was responsible for one of his Championship wins through what a lot of people would define as cheating.

Puja

[Which Tyler]

That's just another way of saying how popular they are.

GOAT always includes some of that.

You can change the game and draw a crowd, whilst not winning.
You can win a lot and turn existing viewers off the sport, and not bring in new fans.

That's why it's unanswerable for any sport, let alone across sports - and is always a fund debate.
If it was just on stat.s then we might as well play Top Trumps instead.

Sometimes the stats stand out so far above anyone else, that they over-rule any charismatic (personal or on-pitch) argument - which is why Bradman always comes first, and Gretsky usually comes second. If the stats are remotely close (as they are in men's tennis) then it's down to so much more.

[Son of Mathonwy]

It’s also about how they make you feel. And not only is he an absolute cwnt, he’s also the most boring champion in history. It’s just so hideously boring.

That's just another way of saying how popular they are. I know these GOAT debates are difficult but if we ignore sporting achievements in favour of 'I like him more' then we might as well just have a popularity contest. I mean I suspect Michael Schumacher was more popular in Germany than in the UK but was he a better driver in Germany than the UK?

On F1, Senna always enters the chat because of how he made people feel. He didn't win 7 titles...

Anyway, I still think there is someone who is often overlooked here, who has a genuine claim...

Sir Steve Redgrave.

I think a case can be made for someone who didn't get the top stats if their career was cut short or derailed for reasons beyond their control, eg Monica Seles's stabbing.

[Numbers]

It's very subjective and most people have their favourites, the following I think are pretty much nailed on GOATs:

Pub Sports: Ronnie O'Sullivan, Phil Taylor

Athletics: Ed Moses, Michael Johnson, Usain Bolt, Armand Duplantis, Hicham El Guerroj

Tennis: Serena Williams, Djokovic

Football: Maradonna

F1: Lots of Senna talk and he was great, also Jim Clark who was believed by many to be the most naturally gifted driver before his untimely death, I suppose you could say that these two were potential GOATS, I think Verstappen is going to surpass Hamilon and Schummacher as the most successful in due course.

Golf: Woods

Gymnastics: Biles, nod to Korbut

MotoGP: Valentino Rossi

Boxing: Julio Cesar Chavez, won his first 87 fights then started to not bother with training and taking recreational drugs but still won the majority of those fights too despite not training.

[cashead]

Djokovic has the tennis GOAT wrapped up:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/tennis/67468494

No. A prize cwnt like him can't be GOAT. The GOAT of Tennis is surely more like Serena Williams...

Coz she's such a sweetie.

Djokovic ain't going to win the all-time most popular tennis player poll, but sport isn't about popularity.

She has the versatility to be successful at both singles and doubles, and has an Olympic gold medal, which Djokovic doesn’t. Boom, check mate, ladies and gentlemen of the jury.

[cashead]

It's very subjective and most people have their favourites, the following I think are pretty much nailed on GOATs:

Pub Sports: Ronnie O'Sullivan, Phil Taylor

Athletics: Ed Moses, Michael Johnson, Usain Bolt, Armand Duplantis, Hicham El Guerroj

Tennis: Serena Williams, Djokovic

Football: Maradonna

F1: Lots of Senna talk and he was great, also Jim Clark who was believed by many to be the most naturally gifted driver before his untimely death, I suppose you could say that these two were potential GOATS, I think Verstappen is going to surpass Hamilon and Schummacher as the most successful in due course.

Golf: Woods

Gymnastics: Biles, nod to Korbut

MotoGP: Valentino Rossi

Boxing: Julio Cesar Chavez, won his first 87 fights then started to not bother with training and taking recreational drugs but still won the majority of those fights too despite not training.

In addition:

MMA
Kazushi Sakuraba
Anderson Silva
Wanderlei Silva
GSP
would be my Mt Rushmore for the blokes

You could make an argument for Khabib and Mighty Mouse, but those are the guys I'd put down as "The Guys."

No room for the R-Gracies, and the bullshit "rules" that they demand whenever they fight. SO MUCH BULLSHIT when it came to those assholes.

Also, Conor McGregor. Yes, champ-champ and all that, but nah. Always weak against grappling, and just spouts so much shit. Like, so do I, but he does it on a grand stage. Also, lol at "only knock-outs are true wins." So you never beat Nate Diaz or Max Holloway, then? Also that old guy he punched not even reacting is never not funny.


For the ladies, it would be
Amanda Nunes
Valentina Shevchenko
Ayaka Hamasaki
Megumi Fujii
and, some people won't be happy with this, but Ronda Rousey.

When Rousey was focused on grappling, she completely dominated the women's bantamweight scene in the UFC, and it really was poor coaching by her coach Edmond Tarverdyan that really ruined her (HeAd MoVeMeNt!), convincing an Olympic medalist judoka to try to outbox a multitime women's boxing and kickboxing champion. Fucking lol, and might I add, lmao. Seeing as how Holm was immediately grapplefucked to oblivion by Miesha Tate in her first bantamweight title defence, a fighter that Rousey had been able to defeat in fairly dominant fashion in the past tells you all you need to know. Like, Tarverdyan is a dipship hackfuck fake coach that ruined the golden goose of his failing gym. Losing to Holm was shitty coaching while enablers all around her were screaming their heads off over how great her striking was (*cue that gif of Rousey doing that weird arm flailing thing. You know the one*). Losing to Nunes, well, basically everyone loses to Nunes. No shame in that.

Cris Cyborg can fuck off. She pisses so hot, I'm surprised the piss cup when she's drug tested doesn't melt from all the roids in her system.


Olympic wrestling
Aleksandr Karelin for the lads
Saori Yoshida for the ladies. Kaori Icho is in with a shout too.

[Which Tyler]

So, DuPont.

At the very least, he's entered the conversation for Rugby's GOAT.

[Donny osmond]

So, DuPont.

At the very least, he's entered the conversation for Rugby's GOAT.

Def rugby's GOAT for me. I get that cross generation comparison is difficult, but I can't think that anyone in my lifetime has been as good as DuPont.

[Which Tyler]

I'm still biased towards Carter and Lomu, but Dupont is just so good at bringing the best out of everyone else as well, that I have to agree.
I think k that if he had a RWC winners medal there's be no debate, but too much of that relies on those around you to actually carry much weight.

I don't think I've ever seen anyone so far ahead of his competitors (well, Lomu, but that's more about being the opposite of the zeigiest at the time)

[Puja]

I'm still biased towards Carter and Lomu, but Dupont is just so good at bringing the best out of everyone else as well, that I have to agree.
I think k that if he had a RWC winners medal there's be no debate, but too much of that relies on those around you to actually carry much weight.

I don't think I've ever seen anyone so far ahead of his competitors (well, Lomu, but that's more about being the opposite of the zeigiest at the time)

Lomu is a definite contender for being so dominant in his era, but there is no denying that there were some things that he was actively bad at. Dupont just doesn't appear to have flaws or, when he does, he goes away and then comes back later to be the best in the world at them.

Watching him throw a perfect double-top to hit the hands of a moving jumper at the back of a lineout was just unfair. There are full-time first-choice international hookers who can't do it as well as this prick who took up the skill 6 months ago, as a side-hobby inbetween his day job winning titles with Toulouse.

Puja

[Banquo]

Yep amazing, similar to Gareth Edwards in lots of ways imo, but maybe even better.

[Donny osmond]

What makes DuPont the best, for me, is that he's not just an outstanding scrum half, he does things that an outstanding 7 or 10 or 15 does too. As much affection as I carry for the likes of Lomu, no-one would've asked him to play at 9. DuPont could be asked to play anywhere outside of the front five and he'd make a pretty decent fist of it.

[Banquo]

What makes DuPont the best, for me, is that he's not just an outstanding scrum half, he does things that an outstanding 7 or 10 or 15 does too. As much affection as I carry for the likes of Lomu, no-one would've asked him to play at 9. DuPont could be asked to play anywhere outside of the front five and he'd make a pretty decent fist of it.

Ditto Edwards in fairness, and he was amateur. One of the very few from his era who would cut it as world class these days.

[paddy no 11]

Think you'd want your head tested if you're engaging in one of these debates, I mean tiger Woods isn't even an athlete

....its Maradona!

[Stom]

https://www.reddit.com/r/rugbyunion/s/DxmKyxxuqJ

[Donny osmond]

I read that Portia Woodman has retired from rugby. Got to be considered in a GOAT conversation, and not just in women’s rugby where I think she’s pretty much untouched, but in rugby overall.

[paddy no 11]

Duplantis