RugbyRebels

Digby wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Digby wrote:
That's pretty much it, by dint of what he's selected and praised for and his own judgement on how to play he's lining up a hit not a tackle. He's hardly unique in that of course.

...but given his alleged USP's of defence, goal kicking, and general ice-mannery..........

Given all of those I'd imagine Barnes had to stay seated a while after everyone else had left before he wouldn't have been embarrassed to stand up

indeed...though I'm amazed that Barnes is remotely a Faz fan. He could hardly bear to be nice about Johnny, and faz is johnny-lite minus minus.

Banquo wrote:

Digby wrote:

Banquo wrote: ...but given his alleged USP's of defence, goal kicking, and general ice-mannery..........

Given all of those I'd imagine Barnes had to stay seated a while after everyone else had left before he wouldn't have been embarrassed to stand up

indeed...though I'm amazed that Barnes is remotely a Faz fan. He could hardly bear to be nice about Johnny, and faz is johnny-lite minus minus.

To be fair he spent the first 10 minutes pleasing himself over Goode. Once Goode had made a few 'uncharacteristic' mistakes he turned his attentions onto Faz. After Faz failed to live up to the hype he was left with Itoje's hand or Taylor's tight perm.

Very disappointing as a Wasp. Kept battering away and getting nowhere, moved it into space and broke through, then immediately went back to ineffectual battering and going nowhere until Sarries cheat the ball back. What was most noticeable was that Ashton's defence was hilarious even by his standards, Fazlet is an arsewipe of the highest order and must be the most disliked player in the Prem (with good reason), Daly is the best 13 by a decent distance, and Wade is back baby!

Whilst I can appreciate their effectiveness, Sarries really are very unlikeable. From cheating the salary cap, to their dedication to cynical and dirty play, to giving a Farrell any kind of career, they can poke right off.

Robson going off was a major blow, Simpson was very disappointing as a replacement. Didn't see the Farrell tackle as oddly there was no replay on the big screen, but it looked like he flew in head first - which potentially should have been a red.

But then McIntyre should have had a red too, probably. You just can't get kick someone, regardless of whether they're holding you or not.

Ashton is a proper dick though. I enjoyed his being bought cedar and giving away stupid penalties

I R Geech wrote:Very disappointing as a Wasp. Kept battering away and getting nowhere, moved it into space and broke through, then immediately went back to ineffectual battering and going nowhere until Sarries cheat the ball back. What was most noticeable was that Ashton's defence was hilarious even by his standards, Fazlet is an arsewipe of the highest order and must be the most disliked player in the Prem (with good reason), Daly is the best 13 by a decent distance, and Wade is back baby!

Whilst I can appreciate their effectiveness, Sarries really are very unlikeable. From cheating the salary cap, to their dedication to cynical and dirty play, to giving a Farrell any kind of career, they can poke right off.

Sarries put a lot of pressure on Gopperth, which limited things a bit, but I don't understand whey Wasps weren't targeting Ashton and Goode more. Ashton in particular just asks to be stood up and his flappy tackles are just begging to be exploited. The Piutau boys should have been putting the fear of God into Goode as well. When Wasps starting shifting it quickly into space instead of arseing around at every breakdown the go forward was pretty good(e).

morepork wrote:

I R Geech wrote:Very disappointing as a Wasp. Kept battering away and getting nowhere, moved it into space and broke through, then immediately went back to ineffectual battering and going nowhere until Sarries cheat the ball back. What was most noticeable was that Ashton's defence was hilarious even by his standards, Fazlet is an arsewipe of the highest order and must be the most disliked player in the Prem (with good reason), Daly is the best 13 by a decent distance, and Wade is back baby!

Whilst I can appreciate their effectiveness, Sarries really are very unlikeable. From cheating the salary cap, to their dedication to cynical and dirty play, to giving a Farrell any kind of career, they can poke right off.

Sarries put a lot of pressure on Gopperth, which limited things a bit, but I don't understand whey Wasps weren't targeting Ashton and Goode more. Ashton in particular just asks to be stood up and his flappy tackles are just begging to be exploited. The Piutau boys should have been putting the fear of God into Goode as well. When Wasps starting shifting it quickly into space instead of arseing around at every breakdown the go forward was pretty good(e).

they had eff all ball until they fell behind. Credit to sarries defence I think.

Peej wrote:Robson going off was a major blow, Simpson was very disappointing as a replacement. Didn't see the Farrell tackle as oddly there was no replay on the big screen, but it looked like he flew in head first - which potentially should have been a red.

But then McIntyre should have had a red too, probably. You just can't get kick someone, regardless of whether they're holding you or not.

Ashton is a proper dick though. I enjoyed his being bought cedar and giving away stupid penalties

Robson was playing well, but I dont think Simpson was that disappointing tbh.

Barnes' theme of Sarries not getting the rub of the green really grated throughout that match. What happened was that we had a ref who actually reffed even-handedly generally with the occasional questionable decision. Welcome to what other teams have to put up with against Sarries when they always get the rub of the green.

Pathetic display generally from Sky: coverage starting 5 mins before kickoff? Talk about treating the fans with contempt.

I R Geech wrote:Very disappointing as a Wasp. Kept battering away and getting nowhere, moved it into space and broke through, then immediately went back to ineffectual battering and going nowhere until Sarries cheat the ball back. What was most noticeable was that Ashton's defence was hilarious even by his standards, Fazlet is an arsewipe of the highest order and must be the most disliked player in the Prem (with good reason), Daly is the best 13 by a decent distance, and Wade is back baby!

Whilst I can appreciate their effectiveness, Sarries really are very unlikeable. From cheating the salary cap, to their dedication to cynical and dirty play, to giving a Farrell any kind of career, they can poke right off.

Not sure Daly was anything more than efficient....its a tight run thing with him and JJ (and imo JJ is a better defender).

Beasties wrote:Barnes' theme of Sarries not getting the rub of the green really grated throughout that match. What happened was that we had a ref who actually reffed even-handedly generally with the occasional questionable decision. Welcome to what other teams have to put up with against Sarries when they always get the rub of the green.

Pathetic display generally from Sky: coverage starting 5 mins before kickoff? Talk about treating the fans with contempt.

I'm not a sarries fan, but lol; that's what happens when a team is dominant.

Banquo wrote:

Peej wrote:Robson going off was a major blow, Simpson was very disappointing as a replacement. Didn't see the Farrell tackle as oddly there was no replay on the big screen, but it looked like he flew in head first - which potentially should have been a red.

But then McIntyre should have had a red too, probably. You just can't get kick someone, regardless of whether they're holding you or not.

Ashton is a proper dick though. I enjoyed his being bought cedar and giving away stupid penalties

Robson was playing well, but I dont think Simpson was that disappointing tbh.

Eh, it's an opinion thing but from my seat he looked a little slow and indecisive from the breakdown, at one point in particular when we were in the Sarries 22. And he dropped the ball at the end having slowly pirouetted his way into contact rather than just shift it off the floor.

I can taste the very sour grapes up here Wade great going forward with a mean step on him, shoite tackler and defence way worse than Ashton and he's utter garbage in the air.

p/d wrote: To be fair he spent the first 10 minutes pleasing himself over Goode. Once Goode had made a few 'uncharacteristic' mistakes he turned his attentions onto Faz. After Faz failed to live up to the hype he was left with Itoje's hand or Taylor's tight perm.

At least Itoje's hand was having a big positive influence on the game for his team.

WiganShark wrote:I can taste the very sour grapes up here Wade great going forward with a mean step on him, shoite tackler and defence way worse than Ashton and he's utter garbage in the air.

Do think a few are being a tad dismissive of how Sarries are able to nullify opponents. This is a skill in itself and only effective when a side play as a team. Sarries are masters of that.

As for Wade and Ashton, both are pants in defence. In attack both can be devastating, one with genuine pace and disco feet the other with the art of reading an attack very well indeed.

Peej wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Peej wrote:Robson going off was a major blow, Simpson was very disappointing as a replacement. Didn't see the Farrell tackle as oddly there was no replay on the big screen, but it looked like he flew in head first - which potentially should have been a red.

But then McIntyre should have had a red too, probably. You just can't get kick someone, regardless of whether they're holding you or not.

Ashton is a proper dick though. I enjoyed his being bought cedar and giving away stupid penalties

Robson was playing well, but I dont think Simpson was that disappointing tbh.

Eh, it's an opinion thing but from my seat he looked a little slow and indecisive from the breakdown, at one point in particular when we were in the Sarries 22. And he dropped the ball at the end having slowly pirouetted his way into contact rather than just shift it off the floor.

..he sparked the counter attack which shifted the momentum in the game. He played like he always plays imo, ergo not 'very disappointing'....which was your phrase.

btw...it wasn't 'odd' that the faz tackle wasn't on screen-- they don't replay stuff that might show a serious injury.

p/d wrote:

WiganShark wrote:I can taste the very sour grapes up here Wade great going forward with a mean step on him, shoite tackler and defence way worse than Ashton and he's utter garbage in the air.

Do think a few are being a tad dismissive of how Sarries are able to nullify opponents. This is a skill in itself and only effective when a side play as a team. Sarries are masters of that.

As for Wade and Ashton, both are pants in defence. In attack both can be devastating, one with genuine pace and disco feet the other with the art of reading an attack very well indeed.

Quite. But seems to me that WiganShark is a little over protective of wiganites- they shouldn't need 'defending' if they were doing the job, surely?

However, I also don't get the anti-sarries 'style' at all. sure there are a couple of dicks in their team, but there are in most teams.

Banquo wrote:

p/d wrote:

WiganShark wrote:I can taste the very sour grapes up here Wade great going forward with a mean step on him, shoite tackler and defence way worse than Ashton and he's utter garbage in the air.

Do think a few are being a tad dismissive of how Sarries are able to nullify opponents. This is a skill in itself and only effective when a side play as a team. Sarries are masters of that.

As for Wade and Ashton, both are pants in defence. In attack both can be devastating, one with genuine pace and disco feet the other with the art of reading an attack very well indeed.

Quite. But seems to me that WiganShark is a little over protective of wiganites- they shouldn't need 'defending' if they were doing the job, surely?

However, I also don't get the anti-sarries 'style' at all. sure there are a couple of dicks in their team, but there are in most teams.

They also should not need defending as they are grown men with a pair of balls. I dont know what all the fuss is about as everyone loves the Chav twins.

Someone snuck 14/15 and previous Fazlet onto the pitch today in place of his modern day counterpart - iffy goal kicking, poor decision making, dangerous and borderline incompetent in defence. I'd hoped we'd seen the last of that.

Puja

Puja wrote:Someone snuck 14/15 and previous Fazlet onto the pitch today in place of his modern day counterpart - iffy goal kicking, poor decision making, dangerous and borderline incompetent in defence. I'd hoped we'd seen the last of that.

Puja

Yes. He reverted to type. He has been playing well this season and I thought he'd matured. He is a hard bloke to like (like Ashton). Sarries seem to be terribly unpopular, but I would not judge the team by a couple of individuals. Most of the players seem OK. The Vunipola brothers, Kruis, Itoje and Brits form the basis of a pack that is hard to get the better of and always put in a good stint with 100% effort.

Puja wrote:Someone snuck 14/15 and previous Fazlet onto the pitch today in place of his modern day counterpart - iffy goal kicking, poor decision making, dangerous and borderline incompetent in defence. I'd hoped we'd seen the last of that.

Puja

Reversion to the mean.

Odd game. Sarries strangled the opposition as they always do. They are a hard team to like and I certainly don't enjoy watching them, much as there are some very competent bits of rugby and some excellent players.

In what universe is a deliberate kick to the head not a red card? I found myself agreeing with Quinnell - yellow for Itoje, red for the kicker - and Andy Goode who said referees just are tough on the sort of holding and scatter rucking that goes on. It's been going on for years now and has to stop. I remember a game at LI years ago when Steffon was being held down preventing him from covering in the defensive line. The touch judge came onto the pitch to politely ask if the opposing player wouldn't mind letting go. When he didn't and they scored in the area there was not a peep. As an aside Alex Goode taking wade out on his supporting line for Robson's try should also have seen yellow.

Itoje was held in the ruck by Wasps players on three occasions in the first half alone, no yellows. Do you only get a yellow if it is concomitant with being kicked in the head?

skidger wrote:

Banquo wrote:

p/d wrote: Do think a few are being a tad dismissive of how Sarries are able to nullify opponents. This is a skill in itself and only effective when a side play as a team. Sarries are masters of that.

As for Wade and Ashton, both are pants in defence. In attack both can be devastating, one with genuine pace and disco feet the other with the art of reading an attack very well indeed.

Quite. But seems to me that WiganShark is a little over protective of wiganites- they shouldn't need 'defending' if they were doing the job, surely?

However, I also don't get the anti-sarries 'style' at all. sure there are a couple of dicks in their team, but there are in most teams.

They also should not need defending as they are grown men with a pair of balls. I dont know what all the fuss is about as everyone loves the Chav twins.

It's the pies mate, they fecking get to you

Maybe the coaching set-up at Saracens needs more credit for the exceptional effectiveness achieved by the team unit. If I was picking an 'on-paper' XV from the two starting line-ups, I'd have 13 Wasps players with Itoje and Kruis (though I'd play Itoje at 6).

Saracens are a damn good side. Sure they've got a couple of players that are hard to like but they have plenty who are.

Their style might not be easy on the eye but you cant argue with the results they get.

Not only are they supremely well coached - their workrate is phenomenal. The way their forwards in particular work off the ball is hugely impressive.

Credit where its due. They are quite a side.

Eugene Wrayburn wrote:Goode taking wade out on his supporting line for Robson's try should also have seen yellow.

Had he prevented a try being scored maybe, but taking out a player off the ball is normally only a penalty. Yes it was a shoulder charge rather than a tackle but it wasn't dangerous which is the only reason I'd reasonably want a card. I do think it should have been registered by the officials and been added to a list, along the lines of you've not gotten a card there but be careful