RugbyRebels

Mr Mwenda wrote:Is it neutral refs?

LCD is gonna get done for one of his daisy cutters at some point.

Yep, Nic Berry, Ben O'Keeffe and Mathieu Raynal

Hey well, at least it isn't the 6:2 split. Unfortunately Farrell is on the bench anyway.

As said before it seems slightly superior bosh has edged out much better skills re Lawes/Beirne and VDM/Adams. But that's Gatland, we know him well. On the other positions I may not agree with each call, but the choices were finely balanced.

Not feeling too much confidence for this one.

Cameo wrote:

Big D wrote:If you allow a bit of national bias for a second I am thrilled Hogg will get a test cap. I feel like a player of his quality deserves it even though I know there is no room for sentimentality on tour.

I think MacBryde and Gatland have copped out a little to be honest. Watson isn't an ideal fit for the bench but it feels like they have though "we can't leave him out completely".

I actually wondered whether Watson's impact off the bench was one of the reasons he isn't starting. I remember a couple of games for Scotland where he has come on and bounced people for fun.

He hasn't really benched for Scotland. Once in the last 4 years where he bounced every man and his dog but can't expect that v SA IMO. I get that they don't plan for injuries but if Conan goes down it is a big issue.

6 English players to start? What a wanker Gats is.

Big D wrote:

Cameo wrote:

Big D wrote:If you allow a bit of national bias for a second I am thrilled Hogg will get a test cap. I feel like a player of his quality deserves it even though I know there is no room for sentimentality on tour.

I think MacBryde and Gatland have copped out a little to be honest. Watson isn't an ideal fit for the bench but it feels like they have though "we can't leave him out completely".

I actually wondered whether Watson's impact off the bench was one of the reasons he isn't starting. I remember a couple of games for Scotland where he has come on and bounced people for fun.

He hasn't really benched for Scotland. Once in the last 4 years where he bounced every man and his dog but can't expect that v SA IMO. I get that they don't plan for injuries but if Conan goes down it is a big issue.

Nah mate, Curry to 8 and Watson to 7.

Son of Mathonwy wrote:Hey well, at least it isn't the 6:2 split. Unfortunately Farrell is on the bench anyway.

As said before it seems slightly superior bosh has edged out much better skills re Lawes/Beirne and VDM/Adams. But that's Gatland, we know him well. On the other positions I may not agree with each call, but the choices were finely balanced.

Not feeling too much confidence for this one.

Really unsure on how confident to feel. Apart from the game last Wednesday, every match has felt too easy. Usually with international players in the regional sides, the games tend to be more of a work up. Now its hard to gauge who is genuinely playing well and who has been made to look good. We did play well for 50-60 minutes last Wednesday, hopefully we can avoid the gifted tries and hopefully prove to be the fitter team over the full 80.

Numbers wrote:I'm quite underwhelmed by this team, I'm not sure what more Hamish Watson could have done or Adams or Beirne and I would have Faletau over Conan every day of the week.

I agree tbh. Curry v Watson is the tightest of those, and I thought Watson would have edged it. I don't like Daly at 13, but Henshaw had to play 12 given our shuntness at 12.....Harris probably should have got the nod, but Daly does offer a bit more, even if I shudder at his defence.

Cameo wrote:Yeah, lots of tight calls. Some that I disagree with but the only one I don't get the logic for is Lawes. Beirne offers the same but better.

Quite a fun team though.

Think Lawes is probably a better lock than Beirne, but Beirne is definitely a better 6. I'd say Lawes is a much more destructive tackler though.

Mikey Brown wrote:

Numbers wrote:I'm quite underwhelmed by this team, I'm not sure what more Hamish Watson could have done or Adams or Beirne and I would have Faletau over Conan every day of the week.

Yep, we’re all one team bla bla bla but England having double the players of anyone else in the starting XV does seem strange.

Why?

Big D wrote:If you allow a bit of national bias for a second I am thrilled Hogg will get a test cap. I feel like a player of his quality deserves it even though I know there is no room for sentimentality on tour.

I think MacBryde and Gatland have copped out a little to be honest. Watson isn't an ideal fit for the bench but it feels like they have though "we can't leave him out completely".

I think he is a good fit with Beirne there tbh. Albeit light on 8 cover, but if you had Faletau for Watson, then Curry going off would be problematic. This way Curry can empty his tank- and he'll need to- and Watson can come in with little need to change style, or could play with Curry if we need to change up in the loose.

Banquo wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:

Numbers wrote:I'm quite underwhelmed by this team, I'm not sure what more Hamish Watson could have done or Adams or Beirne and I would have Faletau over Conan every day of the week.

Yep, we’re all one team bla bla bla but England having double the players of anyone else in the starting XV does seem strange.

Why?

Indeed. Don't think anyone can complain about LCD, Itoje, or Watson, and even if you prefer HWatson there's no doubt that Curry's a world class player and they're neck and neck. Daly and Lawes are the only decisions that're questionable, but that's because they're not brilliant choices, rather than because there's too much Englishness.

Puja

I really didn’t think that one needed the (slight) tongue in cheek disclaimer. We were shit in the 6 nations though and as you say 2 of those 6 haven’t looked great.

I’ve read that Adams is carrying a knock too.

I also share this feeling Gatland may have loosened up quite a bit and we’ll likely see a lot of different names across the test series, assuming this side doesn’t completely blow SA out of the water.

lol at that team.

Puja wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:
Yep, we’re all one team bla bla bla but England having double the players of anyone else in the starting XV does seem strange.

Why?

Indeed. Don't think anyone can complain about LCD, Itoje, or Watson, and even if you prefer HWatson there's no doubt that Curry's a world class player and they're neck and neck. Daly and Lawes are the only decisions that're questionable, but that's because they're not brilliant choices, rather than because there's too much Englishness.

Puja

No, they are questionable because there are other options that are arguably superior. Daly offers more in kicking and attack than Harris, but I hope to hell he can defend and would rather he were starting on the bench. I'd take Beirne over Lawes any day of the week at blindside.

Sandydragon wrote:

Puja wrote:

Banquo wrote: Why?

Indeed. Don't think anyone can complain about LCD, Itoje, or Watson, and even if you prefer HWatson there's no doubt that Curry's a world class player and they're neck and neck. Daly and Lawes are the only decisions that're questionable, but that's because they're not brilliant choices, rather than because there's too much Englishness.

Puja

No, they are questionable because there are other options that are arguably superior. Daly offers more in kicking and attack than Harris, but I hope to hell he can defend and would rather he were starting on the bench. I'd take Beirne over Lawes any day of the week at blindside.

Me too, if we are trying to keep the ball away from contact then Beirne has the footwork and offloading skills that Lawes lacks, the only edge he has is on physicality so I suppose that must be the reason for his selection.

Mikey Brown wrote:I really didn’t think that one needed the (slight) tongue in cheek disclaimer. We were shit in the 6 nations though and as you say 2 of those 6 haven’t looked great.

I’ve read that Adams is carrying a knock too.

I also share this feeling Gatland may have loosened up quite a bit and we’ll likely see a lot of different names across the test series, assuming this side doesn’t completely blow SA out of the water.

I don’t think a teams performance in the 6N is at all relevant once the players are in the squad and in a Lions shirt. Quibble over their ability to do the job, not the nationality tbh.

Okay. Won’t do it again.

Seriously, though, is that the best the B&I can do?

Lawes at blindside? A one-armed pensioner at lock? Treacle-feet at 9? What's a pass? at 11? What's defence? at 13?

Jeez.

And that's before we get to Mr. Impact in the 22 shirt.

Sandydragon wrote:

Puja wrote:

Banquo wrote: Why?

Indeed. Don't think anyone can complain about LCD, Itoje, or Watson, and even if you prefer HWatson there's no doubt that Curry's a world class player and they're neck and neck. Daly and Lawes are the only decisions that're questionable, but that's because they're not brilliant choices, rather than because there's too much Englishness.

Puja

No, they are questionable because there are other options that are arguably superior. Daly offers more in kicking and attack than Harris, but I hope to hell he can defend and would rather he were starting on the bench. I'd take Beirne over Lawes any day of the week at blindside.

I thought that was covered under picking Daly and Lawes not being brilliant choices. Either way, I'm on your side in terms of it should have been Harris and Beirne.

Puja

Numbers wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:

Puja wrote:
Indeed. Don't think anyone can complain about LCD, Itoje, or Watson, and even if you prefer HWatson there's no doubt that Curry's a world class player and they're neck and neck. Daly and Lawes are the only decisions that're questionable, but that's because they're not brilliant choices, rather than because there's too much Englishness.

Puja

No, they are questionable because there are other options that are arguably superior. Daly offers more in kicking and attack than Harris, but I hope to hell he can defend and would rather he were starting on the bench. I'd take Beirne over Lawes any day of the week at blindside.

Me too, if we are trying to keep the ball away from contact then Beirne has the footwork and offloading skills that Lawes lacks, the only edge he has is on physicality so I suppose that must be the reason for his selection.

I think that’s exactly why Lawes is starting and Beirne is on the bench. I’m curious whether it will be a swap at 6 and 7 or if Beirne is destined for the second row for later in the game.

Mikey Brown wrote:Okay. Won’t do it again.

I like that you are maturing and taking advice

Sandydragon wrote:

Numbers wrote:

Sandydragon wrote: No, they are questionable because there are other options that are arguably superior. Daly offers more in kicking and attack than Harris, but I hope to hell he can defend and would rather he were starting on the bench. I'd take Beirne over Lawes any day of the week at blindside.

Me too, if we are trying to keep the ball away from contact then Beirne has the footwork and offloading skills that Lawes lacks, the only edge he has is on physicality so I suppose that must be the reason for his selection.

I think that’s exactly why Lawes is starting and Beirne is on the bench. I’m curious whether it will be a swap at 6 and 7 or if Beirne is destined for the second row for later in the game.

My assumption is it comes down to AWJ's fitness. Unless Itoje is having a penalty nightmare I just can't see him being a player that Gatland wants to bring off, ditto Jones if he's truly back to full fitness and intensity. I'd think Lawes is the one moving forward in the scrum if they both end up on the pitch.

Sandydragon wrote:

Numbers wrote:

Sandydragon wrote: No, they are questionable because there are other options that are arguably superior. Daly offers more in kicking and attack than Harris, but I hope to hell he can defend and would rather he were starting on the bench. I'd take Beirne over Lawes any day of the week at blindside.

Me too, if we are trying to keep the ball away from contact then Beirne has the footwork and offloading skills that Lawes lacks, the only edge he has is on physicality so I suppose that must be the reason for his selection.

I think that’s exactly why Lawes is starting and Beirne is on the bench. I’m curious whether it will be a swap at 6 and 7 or if Beirne is destined for the second row for later in the game.

Lawes is there to make sure the lineout doesn't malfunction and to get to the half backs with big hits- I'd note his carrying is much improved though not to an excellent level.. Unfortunately it could leave rucks a bit under-resourced.

Mikey Brown wrote:

Sandydragon wrote:

Numbers wrote:
Me too, if we are trying to keep the ball away from contact then Beirne has the footwork and offloading skills that Lawes lacks, the only edge he has is on physicality so I suppose that must be the reason for his selection.

I think that’s exactly why Lawes is starting and Beirne is on the bench. I’m curious whether it will be a swap at 6 and 7 or if Beirne is destined for the second row for later in the game.

My assumption is it comes down to AWJ's fitness. Unless Itoje is having a penalty nightmare I just can't see him being a player that Gatland wants to bring off, ditto Jones if he's truly back to full fitness and intensity. I'd think Lawes is the one moving forward in the scrum if they both end up on the pitch.

Yep, both Itoje and even an ancient AW J have great engines which gives the coach options- Lawes may be emptying the tank I'd think, he will be wanted to be hitting hard for an hour.

Banquo wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:Okay. Won’t do it again.

I like that you are maturing.

Please just block me. It will be so much simpler than doing this again. I'm not even trying to be a dick.