RugbyRebels

Puja wrote:

Adam_P wrote:Hutch has said he definitely wants to represent Scotland rather than England internationally

And you can't blame him - he is Scottish and he should walk into the next Scotland squad, whereas he'd be on little more than a promise from England.

Puja

He has a Scottish grandmother. He was born and raised in England, has played all his rugby here and owes his advancement in the sport to the English club game.
The grandparent ruling should be binned and some account should be made where a player has played and developed their game.
That said, he is showing loyalty as Scotland did play him at U18 and U20.

fivepointer wrote:

Puja wrote:

Adam_P wrote:Hutch has said he definitely wants to represent Scotland rather than England internationally

And you can't blame him - he is Scottish and he should walk into the next Scotland squad, whereas he'd be on little more than a promise from England.

Puja

He has a Scottish grandmother. He was born and raised in England, has played all his rugby here and owes his advancement in the sport to the English club game.
The grandparent ruling should be binned and some account should be made where a player has played and developed their game.
That said, he is showing loyalty as Scotland did play him at U18 and U20.

Huh. I had thought he was of Scottish parentage, but a quick google tells me you're right. In which case, I would be a little irked if Scotland poach him, although he is still a distance away from breaking the EPS.

Puja

Timbo wrote:

Puja wrote:

Adam_P wrote:Hutch has said he definitely wants to represent Scotland rather than England internationally

And you can't blame him - he is Scottish and he should walk into the next Scotland squad, whereas he'd be on little more than a promise from England.

Puja

Yeah, when you consider the season Marchant has had and he is still a fair way off being capped. Of the two I would say Hutchinson is behind Marchant.

Yep. OC is a position of strength. Slade, Tuilagi, Joseph, Marchant and Daly would all be ahead of him, and, beyond the RWC, that’s a youngish group.

The Challenge Cup May not have the glamour of the Champ Cup but that’s a great weekend away for either sets of supporters. If the matches are played on different days then it’s a great long weekend for any rugby fan.

Mellsblue wrote:

Timbo wrote:

Puja wrote:
And you can't blame him - he is Scottish and he should walk into the next Scotland squad, whereas he'd be on little more than a promise from England.

Puja

Yeah, when you consider the season Marchant has had and he is still a fair way off being capped. Of the two I would say Hutchinson is behind Marchant.

Yep. OC is a position of strength. Slade, Tuilagi, Joseph, Marchant and Daly would all be ahead of him, and, beyond the RWC, that’s a youngish group.

Lozowski too, he’s still young enough to come again. Nick Tompkins is a good player and only a little bit older than Hutchinson.

Timbo wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:

Timbo wrote:
Yeah, when you consider the season Marchant has had and he is still a fair way off being capped. Of the two I would say Hutchinson is behind Marchant.

Yep. OC is a position of strength. Slade, Tuilagi, Joseph, Marchant and Daly would all be ahead of him, and, beyond the RWC, that’s a youngish group.

Lozowski too, he’s still young enough to come again. Nick Tompkins is a good player and only a little bit older than Hutchinson.

All true. If only one of them could play IC......I’d still like to see Lozowski get a run there but I think Barritt will play until he’s 50ish and 75% titanium.

fivepointer wrote:

Puja wrote:

Adam_P wrote:Hutch has said he definitely wants to represent Scotland rather than England internationally

And you can't blame him - he is Scottish and he should walk into the next Scotland squad, whereas he'd be on little more than a promise from England.

Puja

He has a Scottish grandmother. He was born and raised in England, has played all his rugby here and owes his advancement in the sport to the English club game.
The grandparent ruling should be binned and some account should be made where a player has played and developed their game.
That said, he is showing loyalty as Scotland did play him at U18 and U20.

Maybe you know better, but he has stated almost the opposite of this, that he wouldn't be anywhere at all without his involvement with the Scotland juniors.

Timbo wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:

Timbo wrote:
Yeah, when you consider the season Marchant has had and he is still a fair way off being capped. Of the two I would say Hutchinson is behind Marchant.

Yep. OC is a position of strength. Slade, Tuilagi, Joseph, Marchant and Daly would all be ahead of him, and, beyond the RWC, that’s a youngish group.

Lozowski too, he’s still young enough to come again. Nick Tompkins is a good player and only a little bit older than Hutchinson.

I think Ollie Lawrence also has the potential to leapfrog most of those not currently in the squad too. Looks like a proper talent.

Mikey Brown wrote:

fivepointer wrote:

Puja wrote:
And you can't blame him - he is Scottish and he should walk into the next Scotland squad, whereas he'd be on little more than a promise from England.

Puja

He has a Scottish grandmother. He was born and raised in England, has played all his rugby here and owes his advancement in the sport to the English club game.
The grandparent ruling should be binned and some account should be made where a player has played and developed their game.
That said, he is showing loyalty as Scotland did play him at U18 and U20.

Maybe you know better, but he has stated almost the opposite of this, that he wouldn't be anywhere at all without his involvement with the Scotland juniors.

Yep, from a recent interview in the Northampton Chronicle:

'Born in Cambridge, he has represented Scotland at youth level, and he knows who he wants to represent in the international arena if given the chance.

"I've come up through the age groups of Scotland and I don't know where I'd be without Scottish Exiles, Scotland Under-18s and Under-20s," he said.

"I played a lot of my rugby for them when I wasn't getting much game time here in my younger days so I'd like to play for Scotland."'

https://www.northamptonchron.co.uk/spor ... -1-8868703

Scrumhead wrote:

Timbo wrote:

Mellsblue wrote: Yep. OC is a position of strength. Slade, Tuilagi, Joseph, Marchant and Daly would all be ahead of him, and, beyond the RWC, that’s a youngish group.

Lozowski too, he’s still young enough to come again. Nick Tompkins is a good player and only a little bit older than Hutchinson.

I think Ollie Lawrence also has the potential to leapfrog most of those not currently in the squad too. Looks like a proper talent.

I think any grievance about Scotland taking him would be of the Tomas Francis kind, where it's mostly based on not wanting him to play against us, rather than actually thinking he'd be a vital part of our future plans.

Puja

Whilst talking about the Hutch.....I was only half watching the match, mostly when the name Penaud was mentioned, but why was he taking kicks? Did he take over at 10 or was Biggar unable to take kicks?

Mellsblue wrote:Whilst talking about the Hutch.....I was only half watching the match, mostly when the name Penaud was mentioned, but why was he taking kicks? Did he take over at 10 or was Biggar unable to take kicks?

Biggar went off injured, and Francis was taken off at the same time. Presume they would have been 1st and 2nd choice kickers. I *think* Furbank went to 10 and Tuala at 15- things went a bit crazy around this point in the game so not entirely sure.

Puja wrote:

Scrumhead wrote:

Timbo wrote:
Lozowski too, he’s still young enough to come again. Nick Tompkins is a good player and only a little bit older than Hutchinson.

I think Ollie Lawrence also has the potential to leapfrog most of those not currently in the squad too. Looks like a proper talent.

I think any grievance about Scotland taking him would be of the Tomas Francis kind, where it's mostly based on not wanting him to play against us, rather than actually thinking he'd be a vital part of our future plans.

Puja

We'll quite happily take Dingwall too thanks, but if it's a choice which would you rather?

Timbo wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:Whilst talking about the Hutch.....I was only half watching the match, mostly when the name Penaud was mentioned, but why was he taking kicks? Did he take over at 10 or was Biggar unable to take kicks?

Biggar went off injured, and Francis was taken off at the same time. Presume they would have been 1st and 2nd choice kickers. I *think* Furbank went to 10 and Tuala at 15- things went a bit crazy around this point in the game so not entirely sure.

Cheers. I heard the commentators say Biggar was injured. I just wasn't sure whether it was game ending or just inhibited his place kicking.

switchskier wrote:

Puja wrote:

Scrumhead wrote:
I think Ollie Lawrence also has the potential to leapfrog most of those not currently in the squad too. Looks like a proper talent.

I think any grievance about Scotland taking him would be of the Tomas Francis kind, where it's mostly based on not wanting him to play against us, rather than actually thinking he'd be a vital part of our future plans.

Puja

We'll quite happily take Dingwall too thanks, but if it's a choice which would you rather?

I think Dingwall's better and I'd prefer Scotland not have him, but I agree with s/h that Lawrence is the man to watch.

Puja

I'd say Hutchinson is better at the moment, but he is a little further along in his development than Dingwall.

Yeah. I agree with that.

To be honest, I wouldn’t be overly surprised if both end up playing for Scotland.

Even if Dingwall decides to stick with England there’s a fair list of players he’d be competing with. Slade and JJ are far from old and most of the rest of the competing are not much older than he is (Marchant, Tompkins, Lozowski etc.) and some are younger (Lawrence).

I think he has the makings of a very good player, but I’d understand if he grew impatient waiting for a chance with England.

As a side note, Boyd deserves a lot of credit for putting his faith in the academy boys. Regardless of long term international considerations, it’s great to see a growing list of young players flourishing at Saints. In particular, I’m really encouraged by what I’ve seen from Mitchell this season and if Boyd can re-ignite Hill’s career as he’s done with Ludlam’s, we could be very grateful indeed.

Adam_P wrote:I'd say Hutchinson is better at the moment, but he is a little further along in his development than Dingwall.

Agreed with that - I meant more in terms of future career rather than for a game tomorrow.

Puja

Adam_P wrote:I'd say Hutchinson is better at the moment, but he is a little further along in his development than Dingwall.

Given he is 3 years older, hardly surprising.

Scrumhead wrote:Yeah. I agree with that.

To be honest, I wouldn’t be overly surprised if both end up playing for Scotland.

Even if Dingwall decides to stick with England there’s a fair list of players he’d be competing with. Slade and JJ are far from old and most of the rest of the competing are not much older than he is (Marchant, Tompkins, Lozowski etc.) and some are younger (Lawrence).

I think he has the makings of a very good player, but I’d understand if he grew impatient waiting for a chance with England.

As a side note, Boyd deserves a lot of credit for putting his faith in the academy boys. Regardless of long term international considerations, it’s great to see a growing list of young players flourishing at Saints. In particular, I’m really encouraged by what I’ve seen from Mitchell this season and if Boyd can re-ignite Hill’s career as he’s done with Ludlam’s, we could be very grateful indeed.

Fraser is only 20, and its kind of moot as he has a bad injury to get over. More likely to play for Scotland at senior level imo though.

Clermont vs. La Rochelle all fwench final it is after Quins & Sale edged out in the semis.
The match should be moved to Paris or Toulouse now shewerly, with some compo pushed Newcastle's way ?

Galfon wrote:Clermont vs. La Rochelle all fwench final it is after Quins & Sale edged out in the semis.
The match should be moved to Paris or Toulouse now shewerly, with some compo pushed Newcastle's way ?

Nah. It's part of the weekend. It will get plenty of fans (like me) who go for the occasion regardless of the teams and the French usually travel in decent numbers. Logistically it would be a right pain as well.

Credit to Quins and Sale for running Clermont and La Rochelle close. I think we were all expecting the French sides o dominate far more than they did.