England vs Wales match thread - RWC warmup, Raeburn Shield challenge, and chance to take down the #1 ranked team

[Stom]

How grown up. I apologise for criticising some of them, though I have said Mako, George, Sinckler, Kruis, Lawes, Itoje, Launchbury, Wilson, Curry, Billy, Underhill, Ford, May, JJ, Daly, and Watson are all excellent, and I like Manu and Slade, as well as Genge, Moon and Williams. So really I only have issues with 9 and some midfield options, and the over rated Farrell.

Oh and Marler and LCD are very good, bar arrows in the latter case.

This is the only sensible way to see it, imo. Our inside backs are just shunt, Ford aside.

But the talent coming through is very good, we just need to give them a chance

Will the next head coach drop Farrell?

There's a lot of talent knocking about across the board, and I'm more optimistic it will swim to the top than previously. Also, me and some others on this board are out of kilter with the rest of the (UK) rugby public with respect to Faz; Faz has improved a lot of his game at 10, but I still think we have better 10's....that is not the commonly held view outside this board.

It's frankly incredible. He's just so far below the standard I don't get it...

[Puja]

There's a lot of talent knocking about across the board, and I'm more optimistic it will swim to the top than previously. Also, me and some others on this board are out of kilter with the rest of the (UK) rugby public with respect to Faz; Faz has improved a lot of his game at 10, but I still think we have better 10's....that is not the commonly held view outside this board.

I think the entire board is out of kilter with the UK rugby public on Fazlet as I don't think there's a single person here who'd start him at 10 for England. Saw a Rugby World thing of the 100 best rugby players in the world and Farrell was number 6! Out of all the players in the world, not just fly-halves! Utterly ridiculous.

While it might seem a bit odd considering I've been defending him, I think our best chance of world cup victory would be if he got injured. I see no other way that he won't be picked at 10 and, with him there, we're toothless.

Puja

[Banquo]

There's a lot of talent knocking about across the board, and I'm more optimistic it will swim to the top than previously. Also, me and some others on this board are out of kilter with the rest of the (UK) rugby public with respect to Faz; Faz has improved a lot of his game at 10, but I still think we have better 10's....that is not the commonly held view outside this board.

I think the entire board is out of kilter with the UK rugby public on Fazlet as I don't think there's a single person here who'd start him at 10 for England. Saw a Rugby World thing of the 100 best rugby players in the world and Farrell was number 6! Out of all the players in the world, not just fly-halves! Utterly ridiculous.

While it might seem a bit odd considering I've been defending him, I think our best chance of world cup victory would be if he got injured. I see no other way that he won't be picked at 10 and, with him there, we're toothless.

Puja

Given I think he's a better intl 10 than 12, doubly strange.

[Puja]

There's a lot of talent knocking about across the board, and I'm more optimistic it will swim to the top than previously. Also, me and some others on this board are out of kilter with the rest of the (UK) rugby public with respect to Faz; Faz has improved a lot of his game at 10, but I still think we have better 10's....that is not the commonly held view outside this board.

I think the entire board is out of kilter with the UK rugby public on Fazlet as I don't think there's a single person here who'd start him at 10 for England. Saw a Rugby World thing of the 100 best rugby players in the world and Farrell was number 6! Out of all the players in the world, not just fly-halves! Utterly ridiculous.

While it might seem a bit odd considering I've been defending him, I think our best chance of world cup victory would be if he got injured. I see no other way that he won't be picked at 10 and, with him there, we're toothless.

Puja

Given I think he's a better intl 10 than 12, doubly strange.

The logic goes that at 10 we have Ford and Cipriani who are both better. At 12, we have [howling void]

Puja

[Banquo]

I think the entire board is out of kilter with the UK rugby public on Fazlet as I don't think there's a single person here who'd start him at 10 for England. Saw a Rugby World thing of the 100 best rugby players in the world and Farrell was number 6! Out of all the players in the world, not just fly-halves! Utterly ridiculous.

While it might seem a bit odd considering I've been defending him, I think our best chance of world cup victory would be if he got injured. I see no other way that he won't be picked at 10 and, with him there, we're toothless.

Puja

Given I think he's a better intl 10 than 12, doubly strange.

The logic goes that at 10 we have Ford and Cipriani who are both better. At 12, we have [howling void]

Puja

Yep I get it.

[Danno]

I think the entire board is out of kilter with the UK rugby public on Fazlet as I don't think there's a single person here who'd start him at 10 for England. Saw a Rugby World thing of the 100 best rugby players in the world and Farrell was number 6! Out of all the players in the world, not just fly-halves! Utterly ridiculous.

While it might seem a bit odd considering I've been defending him, I think our best chance of world cup victory would be if he got injured. I see no other way that he won't be picked at 10 and, with him there, we're toothless.

Puja

Given I think he's a better intl 10 than 12, doubly strange.

The logic goes that at 10 we have Ford and Cipriani who are both better. At 12, we have [howling void]

Puja

And it was ever thus.

[Oakboy]

Johnno often used to say 'we are where we are' or something similar. His regime and the Burt's that followed were on the poor side of useless.

Unless Jones wins the RWC, I will always see him as poor too.

We are where we are but that is way behind where we should be in terms of the standard of the team unit that he has prepared. Punditry's love of Farrell epitomises Jones's failings, IMO, simply because the best that the team can do is the best that Farrell can be at FH.

[Puja]

And look on the bright side, at least we're not dealing wih Shontayne Hape anymore.

Puja

[Stom]

And look on the bright side, at least we're not dealing wih Shontayne Hape anymore.

Puja

Hey, when we had Hapeless, at least we weren't dealing with Erinle...

[Digby]

Hape was a pretty decent defender, and it turns out when he wasn't he might well have been suffering from concussion and barely knew what he was doing

[morepork]

I hope none of you self-defenestrate under the crushing weight of despair.

[Oakboy]

I hope none of you self-defenestrate under the crushing weight of despair.

Just getting our excuses in early!

[Mellsblue]

And look on the bright side, at least we're not dealing wih Shontayne Hape anymore.

Puja

Hey, when we had Hapeless, at least we weren't dealing with Erinle...

Ha. That was my first thought, too.

[Raggs]

No Spencer, but we have Heinz...

[fivepointer]

With no new players added to the squad following England’s 12-day training camp in Treviso, Italy, Mike Brown (Harlequins), Alex Dombrandt (Harlequins), Ben Spencer (Saracens) and Ben Te’o (unattached) are not included in this week’s squad.

In addition, Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs) will continue his rehabilitation in camp.

Jones said: “We have worked hard and now move into a four-game preparation phase where the development of the team tactically is paramount. We are grateful for the strong opposition to test our game fitness.

“By the time we fly out on the 8th of September we will be ready to win the Rugby World Cup. We are not there yet but we have four games to get ready.

“Players excluded from being involved in this camp are naturally disappointed but may get another opportunity so they must be ready.“

"May" get another opportunity........

[Peej]

For God's sake! How can Heinz be better than Spencer? Spencer has played some international rugby, won multiple European and Premiership titles, and can actually run. Whereas Heinz is..... well, a bit shite.

[Raggs]

Look how well Glaws have gone though! Clearly it must be down to someone! Heinz it is!

[Beasties]

WTAF?!? I mean, as much as we like to debate the whole perplexing Faz is God situation, what the Hell is going on at SH? Eddie has made some odd decisions and selections (to say the least) but going into a WC with Youngs and Heinz?!?

[Puja]

WTAF

Seconded. While I'm not exactly a Ben Spencer fan, Heinz's selection is just utterly baffling. Perhaps he's just shown really well in camp and will be having a late-career blossom? More likely, Spencer has reverted back to being crap. Either way, I still see no value in having ditched Care.

Puja

[Raggs]

No idea why Care was ditched, nor why Robson isn't preferred over Heinz, nor why Heinz is preferred over all of them.

[Banquo]

Come come why do negative

[fivepointer]

I'm riled by Spencer's omission (and possible exclusion from the WC squad) but not that surprised.
Jones has had plenty of chances to play Spencer, as well as Robson, but chose to give them a few minutes at the end of games. If he really rated them, they would have played a lot more.
Thats just the way it is.
Seems we're stuck with Heinz, who will get a run out this weekend.
Dombrandt being omitted isnt great news either. Felt sure he would be involved with Shields not being fit but it looks like ludlam will play some part on Sunday, probably from the bench.

[Puja]

On the bright side, Te'o's been dropped. I don't think anyone saw that coming.

Puja

[Banquo]

On the bright side, Te'o's been dropped. I don't think anyone saw that coming.

Puja

How many are ‘in’ at the moment.

I took a bit of a hit for suggesting we might do better with a newish, though familiar midfield. Eddie has just lobbed in a totally new 9!

[Stom]

Ffs.