Are Saracens about to get automatically relegated?

[fivepointer]

Er....blimey.

Not unexpected but it would be nice to have a full statement from PRL outlining all the salient facts.

Saracens have acted badly and deserve punishment but this is going to have significant reverberations for the club itself, the league and the national side.

It's grim.

[Tigersman]

Honestly I don't know if it will have that bad an affect on the national side.
Very interested to see how it plays out from that POV.

Will players move, will England players who do move from Saracens add more to their game or will they suffer?
Will England game plan evole.
etc etc.

Eddie for all his traits is smart.

[Mikey Brown]

I’m all for this. How much of their reputation has been built by the Wray era?

[Stom]

I’m all for this. How much of their reputation has been built by the Wray era?

Well indeed. While I wouldn’t say they were likable, they weren’t disliked before. But since Saffacens, they’ve become eminently disliksble.

I’m happy. Good riddance. And hopefully we don’t select players in the championship for England, so Ford gets an uninterrupted run at 10 with an actual 12 outside him.

[hugh_woatmeigh]

Can anyone give me cliff notes? As a Scot I'm not across every little detail but I have to admit I'm struggling to follow this.

If Sarries know they were in breach of the salary cap and that the authorities had found this and given them a chance to get their order then why did they not do so? To consciously ignore that advice is commercial suicide. Why did they re-sign players? Why did they not offload players on big wages that would have had lots of suitors (Skelton, Williams, etc)?

If the initial penalty was a 35 point deduction and demand to comply or face relegation, why did they not comply?

I'm very confused by the whole thing. I know Saracens are guilty but I cannot believe the people that delivered this level of success on and off the pitch can also be this stupid and inept.

[Mellsblue]

I hope this is all within the rules/regs/bylaws of PRL. They need punishing but this is starting to sound like a lot of freelancing

[fivepointer]

This is a really good piece outlining what options Saracens had. http://rugbyandthelaw.com/2020/01/13/sa ... gulations/

None of them were remotely easy, particularly given when the disciplinary panel reported and the extent of the clubs over indulgence (they had to shave off £2M by the end of this month)

They were in a very deep hole.

The writer concluded - "In light of the above analysis, Saracens remain in a difficult position. To become compliant with the Regulation this season, the club will need to release players, reduce salaries or make use of the injury exemption. It may even need to use a combination of the three, depending on the amount by which the salary cap would otherwise be exceeded.
Saracens’ CEO, Griffiths, must now carefully balance the need for compliance with the Regulations against the need to abide by the law, to restore the club’s reputation, and to maintain squad morale. It makes for a fascinating case study – and an unenviable task"

[fivepointer]

I hope this is all within the rules/regs/bylaws of PRL. They need punishing but this is starting to sound like a lot of freelancing

Quite. As put out by Rugby and the Law twitter - "This is utterly extraordinary. Premiership Rugby confirm that Saracens will be relegated at the end of this season.

No mention of the process by, or power under, which this decision has been reached. Not a good look at all"

[Adam_P]

Could be down for 2 seasons based on this

[jimKRFC]

A poster on the Bristol unofficial site has said that Sarries were given the option of a full, forensic, audit or relegation and they took the drop.

The insinuation being an audit would reveal exactly who knew what was going on and raise more issues. As players knew the club were cheating and there are no guidelines around penalties for players being complicit.

Andy Goode also treating that the new CEO is in trouble as he has been acting as an agent for players, but is not qualified/registered, so acting unlawfully.

[jimKRFC]

Could be down for 2 seasons based on this

Its also why you can't front load contracts as people said Bristol may have been doing.

[jimKRFC]

Andy Good has just tweeted:

"Hearing that Ed Griffiths the Saracens CEO has been acting as an agent without an RFU license and also is representing some of the current Saracens players! Pretty sure this is against the @premrugby regulations and will be investigated as it means he shouldn’t be a club CEO...."

[zer0]

I do wish good old Convex Hull was still gracing us with his presence.

[Stom]

I do wish good old Convex Hull was still gracing us with his presence.

lol

[Oakboy]

If Liam Williams is buggering off back to Wales anyway, I'm tempted to think that if we can fix up Itoje with an alternative club, the rest can just disappear and not be missed. On reflection, maybe, George is worth a bit of effort too.

[Peat]

A poster on the Bristol unofficial site has said that Sarries were given the option of a full, forensic, audit or relegation and they took the drop.

The insinuation being an audit would reveal exactly who knew what was going on and raise more issues. As players knew the club were cheating and there are no guidelines around penalties for players being complicit.

Andy Goode also treating that the new CEO is in trouble as he has been acting as an agent for players, but is not qualified/registered, so acting unlawfully.

On the BBC site too. My schadenfreudegasm is in full burst right now even if I know that down the line, there might be some problems resulting in it.

[Digby]

Outstanding work from one S. Jones in defence of Sarries, it's up there with GOP party leaders defending Trump for levels of delusion. I didn't think he'd ever be able to top the time he decided Hernandez was a better 10 than Carter, but he's gone even fuller in on denial this time, credit where credit's due

[Mellsblue]

Outstanding work from one S. Jones in defence of Sarries, it's up there with GOP party leaders defending Trump for levels of delusion. I didn't think he'd ever be able to top the time he decided Hernandez was a better 10 than Carter, but he's gone even fuller in on denial this time, credit where credit's due

Oooh. Can’t wait to read it for a laugh. The man’s an idiot. He had a bust up with Dallaglio over all of this on the times rugby podcast and they haven’t appeared together on it since.

[Digby]

Outstanding work from one S. Jones in defence of Sarries, it's up there with GOP party leaders defending Trump for levels of delusion. I didn't think he'd ever be able to top the time he decided Hernandez was a better 10 than Carter, but he's gone even fuller in on denial this time, credit where credit's due

Oooh. Can’t wait to read it for a laugh. The man’s an idiot. He had a bust up with Dallaglio over all of this on the times rugby podcast and they haven’t appeared together on it since.

I rarely read him, why bother, but this week it seemed likely to amuse and he doesn't disappoint

[Mellsblue]

Outstanding work from one S. Jones in defence of Sarries, it's up there with GOP party leaders defending Trump for levels of delusion. I didn't think he'd ever be able to top the time he decided Hernandez was a better 10 than Carter, but he's gone even fuller in on denial this time, credit where credit's due

Oooh. Can’t wait to read it for a laugh. The man’s an idiot. He had a bust up with Dallaglio over all of this on the times rugby podcast and they haven’t appeared together on it since.

I rarely read him, why bother, but this week it seemed likely to amuse and he doesn't disappoint

It used to annoy me but now I read it as satire. The man’s a comedy genius. Rugby’s Rod Liddle.

[Digby]

Oooh. Can’t wait to read it for a laugh. The man’s an idiot. He had a bust up with Dallaglio over all of this on the times rugby podcast and they haven’t appeared together on it since.

I rarely read him, why bother, but this week it seemed likely to amuse and he doesn't disappoint

It used to annoy me but now I read it as satire. The man’s a comedy genius. Rugby’s Rod Liddle.

I gave up on Jones and Barnes ages back, indeed I might as well read an old article from 2014. I was though tempted to quote today's article in places, but that seems harsh to take the fun away without a suitable spoiler alert

[Mellsblue]

I rarely read him, why bother, but this week it seemed likely to amuse and he doesn't disappoint

It used to annoy me but now I read it as satire. The man’s a comedy genius. Rugby’s Rod Liddle.

I gave up on Jones and Barnes ages back, indeed I might as well read an old article from 2014. I was though tempted to quote today's article in places, but that seems harsh to take the fun away without a suitable spoiler alert

Read it. Drivel. Doesn’t even deliver as a piece of satire.
My favourite bit was the conclusion.
‘....I will go to my grave believing that no payment to a single Saracens player made a blind bit of difference to any match at any time. And that frankly, Saracens have just been too good.’
They’re too good because they have so many good players on their books and they can only afford to do this because they broke the salary cap. It ain’t rocket science.

[Digby]

That was awesome, but I did like his think of the disabled people part too

[p/d]

He really is a nob

[p/d]

I just feel a bit sad for Barritt. Been there since, what, 2008 and comes over as just a descent bloke who loves the blood and thunder of rugby