Lions team after week 1
Moderator: OptimisticJock
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Re: Lions team after week 1
The MISH will go, he just won player of the 6N
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Re: Lions team after week 1
It is a popularity contest to be fair. Would be interested to see voting county by country.whatisthejava wrote:The MISH will go, he just won player of the 6N
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Re: Lions team after week 1
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It was so much easier to blame Them. It was bleakly depressing to think They were Us. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.
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Re: Lions team after week 1
Townsend and Tandy due to be named Lions coaches this week. Quite the rise for Tandy.
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Re: Lions team after week 1
Reckon this nails Chris Harris on the plane, so important to Tandys defence
I think with two coaches 7-10 lions must be the target
I think with two coaches 7-10 lions must be the target
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Re: Lions team after week 1
Whilst the gambler in me hopes Harris goes as i will win a tidy bet I am not convinced Harris will go.whatisthejava wrote:Reckon this nails Chris Harris on the plane, so important to Tandys defence
I think with two coaches 7-10 lions must be the target
I would fall off my chair in shock if we make up almost a quarter of the touring party. Regardless of who the coaches are the players still need to get in on merit otherwise our two would be just as bad as how some fans view Gatland.
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Re: Lions team after week 1
FWIW, if anyone is a gabling type Harris was still at 8's or 6s to make the squad.
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Re: Lions team after week 1
how can you have target for this? You can't. And if its an aspiration, good luck and I don't need to know your lottery numberswhatisthejava wrote:Reckon this nails Chris Harris on the plane, so important to Tandys defence
I think with two coaches 7-10 lions must be the target
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Re: Lions team after week 1
septic 9 wrote:how can you have target for this? You can't. And if its an aspiration, good luck and I don't need to know your lottery numberswhatisthejava wrote:Reckon this nails Chris Harris on the plane, so important to Tandys defence
I think with two coaches 7-10 lions must be the target
Eddie Jones set a target of 20 english players on tour pre 6N.
I think expecting the scottish denfence and attack coach not to want their players is mental.
This is exactly what happened the last 4 tours so expecting lions coaches not to pick players they know and trust to gel in a short period is not exactly unexpected.
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Re: Lions team after week 1
whatisthejava wrote:septic 9 wrote:how can you have target for this? You can't. And if its an aspiration, good luck and I don't need to know your lottery numberswhatisthejava wrote:Reckon this nails Chris Harris on the plane, so important to Tandys defence
I think with two coaches 7-10 lions must be the target
Eddie Jones set a target of 20 english players on tour pre 6N.
I think expecting the scottish denfence and attack coach not to want their players is mental.
This is exactly what happened the last 4 tours so expecting lions coaches not to pick players they know and trust to gel in a short period is not exactly unexpected.
so Eddie Jones set a target (did he, or say that he expected 20?) to massage his ever expanding ego. How is that going? He has as much chance of 20 English players as we have of 9. Setting target for this is ludicrous, pointless and laughable, sets yourself up to fail
Every coach given a choice of two equal players will always opt for the one he knows and better still has worked with. So yes, Toonie and Tandy if picked will get a voice; a voice inside Gatland's plan for the Lions team, how he wants them to play. And being professional coaches, they will act within that remit
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Re: Lions team after week 1
Coaches as reported
Toony
McBryde
Tandy
Gatland
No english contigent
Toony
McBryde
Tandy
Gatland
No english contigent
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Re: Lions team after week 1
Neil Jenkins is in there as wellwhatisthejava wrote:Coaches as reported
Toony
McBryde
Tandy
Gatland
No english contigent
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Re: Lions team after week 1
OK, this is just slowly filling me with dread, maybe I have too much free time...
I am/was/have been of the opinion that this Lions tour is doomed from the start, SAF at home, fresh and with national rugby momentum (w/c), Corna, disruptions etc. Call me cynical I fully expect the Lions to go out and get horsed regardless of coach selection.
Now all I can see the Scotland coaching set up being the scape goats when it happens....
Edit: I thought this last time too (losing, not coaching) so am probably wrong.
I am/was/have been of the opinion that this Lions tour is doomed from the start, SAF at home, fresh and with national rugby momentum (w/c), Corna, disruptions etc. Call me cynical I fully expect the Lions to go out and get horsed regardless of coach selection.
Now all I can see the Scotland coaching set up being the scape goats when it happens....
Edit: I thought this last time too (losing, not coaching) so am probably wrong.
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Re: Lions team after week 1
No I feel pretty similar. I'd accepted long ago there would be little Scottish involvement and I wouldn't be overly interested, but I can definitely see that scenario.AL. wrote:OK, this is just slowly filling me with dread, maybe I have too much free time...
I am/was/have been of the opinion that this Lions tour is doomed from the start, SAF at home, fresh and with national rugby momentum (w/c), Corna, disruptions etc. Call me cynical I fully expect the Lions to go out and get horsed regardless of coach selection.
Now all I can see the Scotland coaching set up being the scape goats when it happens....
Edit: I thought this last time too (losing, not coaching) so am probably wrong.
Who knows though, do SA remember how to play rugby at this point?
I feel like SA is another team where have a bit of a mental block, whether they're world champions or not, knowing they can pretty much trample over us if they're even remotely motivated. GT/Tandy, and whichever players are involved, getting a taste of how to set up a different side (with some very experienced coaches around them) to beat them has to be of some value.
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Re: Lions team after week 1
Do they still have momentum? They haven't played an international since the WC final IIRC. The Lions players have had a lot of international rugby in them this season.AL. wrote:I am/was/have been of the opinion that this Lions tour is doomed from the start, SAF at home, fresh and with national rugby momentum (w/c), Corna, disruptions etc. Call me cynical I fully expect the Lions to go out and get horsed regardless of coach selection.
They might still get horsed right enough.
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Re: Lions team after week 1
Some England players may miss out on the British and Irish Lions tour because of their poor Six Nations form while there will be more Scots picked, says head coach Warren Gatland
According to the beeb
Suggests some sarries guys have credit in the bank but for me that would be Farrell and Itoje, doubt Daly or BV has enough credit in the bank
According to the beeb
Suggests some sarries guys have credit in the bank but for me that would be Farrell and Itoje, doubt Daly or BV has enough credit in the bank
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Re: Lions team after week 1
To be honest, I think there would be 4; George (due to lack of 3 clear alternatives), Itoje, Farrell and Maitland who is as dependable as they come.whatisthejava wrote:Some England players may miss out on the British and Irish Lions tour because of their poor Six Nations form while there will be more Scots picked, says head coach Warren Gatland
According to the beeb
Suggests some sarries guys have credit in the bank but for me that would be Farrell and Itoje, doubt Daly or BV has enough credit in the bank
The Vunipola's while often good at what they do have serious questions around them. Billy, is clearly fitter than I, but I don't think he is cut out for the highveldt and teams have worked him out a bit. Mako is good, very good at times in the loose but his scrummaging just isn't up to it and I doubt he will get any better scrummaging against the championship teams he will be facing.
I do wonder whether we will see 4 of each front row position and 9 taken. With Covid about and the need for bubbles these are probably the hardest positions to mitigate losing someone and I can't see them wanting the test 1/2/3/16/17/18 backing up the game before the test match and the test match.
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Re: Lions team after week 1
Forget how to multi quote, I just lurk normally....
Mikey, Big D - Momentum. Not sure they have momentum per se but the teams I have seen in the last year all seem to have this intangible something about them as though they have learned more and not physically practised rugby during the lockdown (except maybe England who seem to have gone backwards as though they were "there" in the first place), not sure I can explain what I mean, will think on it and get back....
I picture SAF being physically obscene (prepared) and tactically astute (prepared) due to all the time they have had, I think (not sure) SAF have had a hard time with Corona and they are the sort of team to rise when the country needs a boost, their world cup wins had a whiff of unifying the country about them and I see giving the Lions a hammering as a tonic for them. Might they want it more?
Mikey, Big D - Momentum. Not sure they have momentum per se but the teams I have seen in the last year all seem to have this intangible something about them as though they have learned more and not physically practised rugby during the lockdown (except maybe England who seem to have gone backwards as though they were "there" in the first place), not sure I can explain what I mean, will think on it and get back....
I picture SAF being physically obscene (prepared) and tactically astute (prepared) due to all the time they have had, I think (not sure) SAF have had a hard time with Corona and they are the sort of team to rise when the country needs a boost, their world cup wins had a whiff of unifying the country about them and I see giving the Lions a hammering as a tonic for them. Might they want it more?
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Re: Lions team after week 1
Supposedly the 4 coaches came up with their own 36 and when combined 20-22 names were the same accross the board
This would suggest me that there is still alot of disagreement
as i reckon the 20 prob looked like this
Sutherland, Wyn
Owens
Furlong
Itoje, AWJ, Ryan
Watson, Faletua, Beine
Russel, Bigger Zammit, Hogg, Adams, Farrell, Price , Henshaw
(Thats actually really hard to try and pick guys so clearly above everyone else they made all 5 coaches lists)
Its not neccessary the best players but guys who are in the top 2 of their position
Guys that miss out for me on that
All scottish hookers
Gray
Richie, Curry, all 8s bar Faletua
Z Fagerson , Francis, Sinkler
Henderson
Both vinipolos
All irish wings, english and scottish wings
All centres bar Henshaw
Sexton I think wont make Townsend list
This would suggest me that there is still alot of disagreement
as i reckon the 20 prob looked like this
Sutherland, Wyn
Owens
Furlong
Itoje, AWJ, Ryan
Watson, Faletua, Beine
Russel, Bigger Zammit, Hogg, Adams, Farrell, Price , Henshaw
(Thats actually really hard to try and pick guys so clearly above everyone else they made all 5 coaches lists)
Its not neccessary the best players but guys who are in the top 2 of their position
Guys that miss out for me on that
All scottish hookers
Gray
Richie, Curry, all 8s bar Faletua
Z Fagerson , Francis, Sinkler
Henderson
Both vinipolos
All irish wings, english and scottish wings
All centres bar Henshaw
Sexton I think wont make Townsend list
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Re: Lions team after week 1
I think Tipuric might well be on that list of 20whatisthejava wrote:Supposedly the 4 coaches came up with their own 36 and when combined 20-22 names were the same accross the board
This would suggest me that there is still alot of disagreement
as i reckon the 20 prob looked like this
Sutherland, Wyn
Owens
Furlong
Itoje, AWJ, Ryan
Watson, Faletua, Beine
Russel, Bigger Zammit, Hogg, Adams, Farrell, Price , Henshaw
(Thats actually really hard to try and pick guys so clearly above everyone else they made all 5 coaches lists)
Its not neccessary the best players but guys who are in the top 2 of their position
Guys that miss out for me on that
All scottish hookers
Gray
Richie, Curry, all 8s bar Faletua
Z Fagerson , Francis, Sinkler
Henderson
Both vinipolos
All irish wings, english and scottish wings
All centres bar Henshaw
Sexton I think wont make Townsend list
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Re: Lions team after week 1
I am not so sure Sutherland would be on everyones list. There is 0.001% chance that Price is on all 5 coaches list ahead of Murray. It is a pretty fruitless task but this teleconference I am in is dull as dishwater.whatisthejava wrote:Supposedly the 4 coaches came up with their own 36 and when combined 20-22 names were the same accross the board
This would suggest me that there is still alot of disagreement
as i reckon the 20 prob looked like this
Sutherland, Wyn
Owens
Furlong
Itoje, AWJ, Ryan
Watson, Faletua, Beine
Russel, Bigger Zammit, Hogg, Adams, Farrell, Price , Henshaw
(Thats actually really hard to try and pick guys so clearly above everyone else they made all 5 coaches lists)
Its not neccessary the best players but guys who are in the top 2 of their position
Guys that miss out for me on that
All scottish hookers
Gray
Richie, Curry, all 8s bar Faletua
Z Fagerson , Francis, Sinkler
Henderson
Both vinipolos
All irish wings, english and scottish wings
All centres bar Henshaw
Sexton I think wont make Townsend list
Wyn
Owens
Furlong, Sinckler (coaches seem to really like him)
Itoje, AWJ,
Bierne
Watson, Curry
Faletau
Murray
Sexton, Bigger
Farrell
Henshaw, Harris obviously , North
Hogg, Watson, Williams, Zammit
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Re: Lions team after week 1
I would agree, I think that Mako / Sutherland will have a split vote.Big D wrote:
I am not so sure Sutherland would be on everyones list. There is 0.001% chance that Price is on all 5 coaches list ahead of Murray. It is a pretty fruitless task but this teleconference I am in is dull as dishwater.
Wyn
Owens
Furlong, Sinckler (coaches seem to really like him)
Itoje, AWJ,
Bierne
Watson, Curry
Faletau
Murray
Sexton, Bigger
Farrell
Henshaw, Harris obviously , North
Hogg, Watson, Williams, Zammit
Wouldn't be surprised to see Owens joined by Jamie George at hooker
Wyn
Owens, George
Furlong
Itoje, AWJ, Ryan
Bierne, Curry
Watson, Tipuric (or I can see 1 of either of them only on the list)
Faletau
Murray
Biggar, Russell
Henshaw, North
Hogg, Watson, Williams, Zammit
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Re: Lions team after week 1
Good shout for Murray but still think Price made all lists after a relative ok 6N bar one box kickBig D wrote:There is 0.001% chance that Price is on all 5 coaches list
Not convinced he is on most lists as he really didnt do anything in the 6Nstevedog1980 wrote:Mako
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Re: Lions team after week 1
Jenkins and MacBride will almost certainly have had Irish and Welsh 9s in there.whatisthejava wrote:Good shout for Murray but still think Price made all lists after a relative ok 6N bar one box kick.Big D wrote:There is 0.001% chance that Price is on all 5 coaches list
Also keep in mind Gatland has been on Lions tours partially decided by solid game management and not doing anything daft (ROG* v SA, SBW for NZ). The 2 box kicks, one which was only partially his fault will stand out to coaches rightly or wrongly as they happened at the end of close games so they stand out.
Not saying he won't or doesn't deserve to tour but I'd be shocked if he was one of the 20-22 players they all agreed on.
*Although I do think SA would have won game 3 if need be.
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Re: Lions team after week 1
I would be stunned if all of them were opting for Price. Not that he shouldn’t necessarily go, but there were definitely more than a couple of daft moments from him. I think his general reputation may make those seem a bit more of a concern, but generally he was very good.