RugbyRebels

Interesting weekend in the rankings already. Ireland are up to 3rd, Scotland to 5th and if France beat SA, then they'll go 6th. After the weeping and gnashing of teeth about the demise of NH rugby after the 2015 RWC, it's entirely possible that the weekend could finish with the 5N being 2nd, 3rd, 5th, 6th and 7th.

Puja

Puja wrote:Interesting weekend in the rankings already. Ireland are up to 3rd, Scotland to 5th and if France beat SA, then they'll go 6th. After the weeping and gnashing of teeth about the demise of NH rugby after the 2015 RWC, it's entirely possible that the weekend could finish with the 5N being 2nd, 3rd, 5th, 6th and 7th.

Puja

While it would be good NH teams to move further up the rankings. Wouldn't a more accurate way of looking at the rankings be:
1 NZ


2. Every other team desperately trying to break away from the pack and join them.

bitts wrote:

Puja wrote:Interesting weekend in the rankings already. Ireland are up to 3rd, Scotland to 5th and if France beat SA, then they'll go 6th. After the weeping and gnashing of teeth about the demise of NH rugby after the 2015 RWC, it's entirely possible that the weekend could finish with the 5N being 2nd, 3rd, 5th, 6th and 7th.

Puja

While it would be good NH teams to move further up the rankings. Wouldn't a more accurate way of looking at the rankings be:
1 NZ


2. Every other team desperately trying to break away from the pack and join them.

True. My point was more that SA and Australia are now well and truly in the middle of the pack, rather than being apart or even just being at the head of it, which is quite satisfying given the supercilious airs that they've put on in the past.

I'd say the rankings are broadly accurate at the moment - NZ so far ahead that they'd need to lose several in a row to be in danger of losing top spot, England and Ireland heading the chasing pack, with Australia, Scotland, Wales, and South Africa jostling in the middle, and France and Argentina clinging on at the rear.

Puja

So, can anybody tell me the logic of continuing Lions tours to SA and Australia? I have made no secret of my loathing for the concept in the professional era but some sort of case can be made for visiting NZ.

Oakboy wrote:So, can anybody tell me the logic of continuing Lions tours to SA and Australia? I have made no secret of my loathing for the concept in the professional era but some sort of case can be made for visiting NZ.

Gods, not another "What is the point of the Lions?" conversation. The point is for a unique international experience where players from 4 teams join together and go on an old-fashioned tour. The home nations supporters get the fun of cheering for players that they would normally be against, the receiving country get a boost from the support it brings in and rugby all around is richer for the experience.

I won't deny that it'll be anti-climatic if South Africa are still in the doldrums in 4 years' time and get destroyed, but it won't destroy the whole premise. It's like the Barbarians - lots of talent, but the trick is in getting them to blend and watching players play together who normally wouldn't.

You don't like it and that's absolutely fair, but a lot of people do and, apart from anything else, it makes everybody wealthy, so it's not going anywhere from the calendar.

Puja

Maybe Dors had been looking at this - https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2017/ ... -breakdown

fivepointer wrote:Maybe Dors had been looking at this - https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2017/ ... -breakdown

Thanks, 5p, I had not seen that - I download the DT and rarely see other papers.

As Puja says, the Lions debate is well-aired but my point and the gist of the Guardian article highlight a new issue. I never imagined the day when SA rugby would be so poor though they may be recovering a bit. Also, when looking at the finance, it was a bit of a concern that there were empty seats in Durban on Saturday for the France test. I didn't see the game the previous week.

fivepointer wrote:Maybe Dors had been looking at this - https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2017/ ... -breakdown

Not sure how seriously I can take someone who can't be arsed to look at the Rankings before referencing them and thus claims Scotland are 4th.

Puja

I can't be bothered to read it but I'm guessing the argument is that SA and Aus are now too weak to host the Lions. If so, two points. Firstly, those tours are four and eight years away in which time a lot can change. Secondly, one of the oft repeated arguments against the Lions is that they very, very rarely win a series - you can't have it both ways. If not, do what you usually do and ignore me.

The Lions could be refreshed by doing a full tour of Argentina/Uruguay.

Mellsblue wrote:I can't be bothered to read it but I'm guessing the argument is that SA and Aus are now too weak to host the Lions. If so, two points. Firstly, those tours are four and eight years away in which time a lot can change. Secondly, one of the oft repeated arguments against the Lions is that they very, very rarely win a series - you can't have it both ways. If not, do what you usually do and ignore me.

I'd never ignore you, mate. Disagree with you, debate with you, learn from you, get pissed of with you . . . .

Lizard wrote:The Lions could be refreshed by doing a full tour of Argentina/Uruguay.

Or add in Japan & the SS Islands when in NZ & Aus

belgarion wrote:

Lizard wrote:The Lions could be refreshed by doing a full tour of Argentina/Uruguay.

Or add in Japan & the SS Islands when in NZ & Aus

Agree with the Islands, but Japan could at best be a stopover en route.