RugbyRebels

British & Irish Lions: 15 Liam Williams, 14 Anthony Watson, 13 Jonathan Davies, 12 Owen Farrell, 11 Elliot Daly, 10 Johnny Sexton, 9 Conor Murray, 8 Taulupe Faletau, 7 Sean O’Brien, 6 Sam Warburton (c), 5 Alun Wyn Jones, 4 Maro Itoje, 3 Tadhg Furlong, 2 Jamie George, 1 Mako Vunipola

Replacements: 16 Ken Owens, 17 Jack McGrath, 18 Kyle Sinckler, 19 Courtney Lawes, 20 CJ Stander, 21 Rhys Webb, 22 Ben Te’o, 23 Jack Nowell

Has anyone ever been picked as captain and then dropped entirely for the next test before?

ah well

I don't know whether to laugh or cry. I know which SBW will be doing.

oh

Can't see how AWJ has earned a spot. I'd give webb a start if they do want to get a back line going far quicker than murray. the 10/12 has failed anytime the lions have tried it and pretty sure it wont work Saturday either. Owens could do with a start too. AB's will cross the gainline at their leisure and score 6 tries

I'm a huge fan of AWJ but I must say I'm mystified by his selection. He looked like there was something wrong with him on Saturday. Maybe there was, and maybe he's recovered? Dunno. Weird.

I'm up for a 2nd 5/8th instead of a crash ball 12, but I also suspect SBW will be licking his lips. Farrell just isn't a match physically for him.

Jesus. That selection just looks panic-stricken - "Let's chuck out everything we've worked up to so far and try new things, any new things, whether they go together or not. Except dropping AWJ. We won't try that."

Puja

Timmyspicyman wrote:I'm a huge fan of AWJ but I must say I'm mystified by his selection. He looked like there was something wrong with him on Saturday. Maybe there was, and maybe he's recovered? Dunno. Weird.

I'm up for a 2nd 5/8th instead of a crash ball 12, but I also suspect SBW will be licking his lips. Farrell just isn't a match physically for him.

I'm more worried about the dog legs they'll exploit than Faz getting trampled, plus suspect he will want to make a 'statement' early doors. I also think the kiwis will be delighted that have one less runner to bother about.

Banquo wrote:

Timmyspicyman wrote:I'm a huge fan of AWJ but I must say I'm mystified by his selection. He looked like there was something wrong with him on Saturday. Maybe there was, and maybe he's recovered? Dunno. Weird.

I'm up for a 2nd 5/8th instead of a crash ball 12, but I also suspect SBW will be licking his lips. Farrell just isn't a match physically for him.

I'm more worried about the dog legs they'll exploit than Faz getting trampled, plus suspect he will want to make a 'statement' early doors. I also think the kiwis will be delighted that have one less runner to bother about.

Yep ..but we will be OK the AB centres will be arguing whose turn it is to punch the line

Its as if the AB were not making ground after the collision impact last week..but what on earth makes the Lions defence team or any of the selectors think that this will stop or restrict that happening and give us more physicality at the breakdown ?. It will be a busy defensive shift for the Lions back row...again.

I will just sit down and shake my head violently for 5 minutes ..

There's always the chance Farrell will finally look a 12, which would be good news for England.

Also a genuine question here as I've seen very little of this tour, has Warburton actually done anything (to show he will offer what the pack/POM were missing) on this tour to earn the spot? Or his he just Gatlands guy? He was good in the Ireland game, but I can't really remember seeing him be truly effective for quite a while.

The team could certainly do with him at top form, but is that likely?

Another genuine question: Is this the same Owen Farrell that's played 12 in nearly every test England has played in the last two years, of which they have lost one?

Lizard wrote:Another genuine question: Is this the same Owen Farrell that's played 12 in nearly every test England has played in the last two years, of which they have lost one?

fair

Banquo wrote:

Lizard wrote:Another genuine question: Is this the same Owen Farrell that's played 12 in nearly every test England has played in the last two years, of which they have lost one?

fair

Might as well get Hartley flown in to replace George and Brown to replace Williams......plus Haskell to replace SOB. The Hask hasn't lost any matches under Jones.

Mellsblue wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Lizard wrote:Another genuine question: Is this the same Owen Farrell that's played 12 in nearly every test England has played in the last two years, of which they have lost one?

fair

Might as well get Hartley flown in to replace George and Brown to replace Williams......plus Haskell to replace SOB. The Hask hasn't lost any matches under Jones.

now you are talking....

I dont like him at 12 but it has worked at times at least. Against Scotland for example it helped shred our midfield defence. Against crusaders I thought him and Sexton looked okay too

Mellsblue wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Lizard wrote:Another genuine question: Is this the same Owen Farrell that's played 12 in nearly every test England has played in the last two years, of which they have lost one?

fair

Might as well get Hartley flown in to replace George and Brown to replace Williams......plus Haskell to replace SOB. The Hask hasn't lost any matches under Jones.

Haskell has started 11 times under Jones, Farrell 17 (behind only Hartley, Brown, Ford & Cole).

No centre has played in more test wins since RWC2015 than Owen Farrell.

Lizard wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:

Banquo wrote: fair

Might as well get Hartley flown in to replace George and Brown to replace Williams......plus Haskell to replace SOB. The Hask hasn't lost any matches under Jones.

Haskell has started 11 times under Jones, Farrell 17 (behind only Hartley, Brown, Ford & Cole).

You're right. It was a silly idea.

I'd be all for it!

Lizard wrote:Another genuine question: Is this the same Owen Farrell that's played 12 in nearly every test England has played in the last two years, of which they have lost one?

The same one yes. I don't think you would need more than one hand to count the good games he has personally had in that time. Most England fans that are not related to him believe for England to improve and catch the Kiwis an upgrade at 12 is very much needed.

Cameo wrote:I dont like him at 12 but it has worked at times at least. Against Scotland for example it helped shred our midfield defence. Against crusaders I thought him and Sexton looked okay too

They picked up on a technical weak point in how Scotland defend mind, and then the Scottish midfield all set about solving that problem with individual plays and ignored it was open to them to work as a team. Even if the Lions can find a technical weak point in NZ's midfield defence I don't imagine it'll rattle NZ to not use team systems.

skidger wrote:

Lizard wrote:Another genuine question: Is this the same Owen Farrell that's played 12 in nearly every test England has played in the last two years, of which they have lost one?

The same one yes. I don't think you would need more than one hand to count the good games he has personally had in that time. Most England fans that are not related to him believe for England to improve and catch the Kiwis an upgrade at 12 is very much needed.

I've got no argument with any of that but it's fair to say that he's now a test 12, not a makeshift converted 10.

Lizard wrote:

skidger wrote:

Lizard wrote:Another genuine question: Is this the same Owen Farrell that's played 12 in nearly every test England has played in the last two years, of which they have lost one?

The same one yes. I don't think you would need more than one hand to count the good games he has personally had in that time. Most England fans that are not related to him believe for England to improve and catch the Kiwis an upgrade at 12 is very much needed.

I've got no argument with any of that but it's fair to say that he's now a test 12, not a makeshift converted 10.

Agreed. But watching all his games there I also think it is fair to say he is a very so,so test 12.