Team for Japan

[Scrumhead]

After yesterday’s performance, I’m hoping we can find the right balance to retain some of the intensity we showed while giving some of our fringe players the chance to impress.

I’d go with:

1. Moon
2. Hartley
3. Sinckler
4. Lawes
5. Ewels
6. Wilson
7. Underhill
8. Mercer
9. Youngs
10. Ford
11. Cokanasiga
12. Lozowski
13. Tuilagi
14. Ashton
15. Daly

16. George 17. Hepburn 18. Williams 19. Stooke 20. Itoje 21. Care 22. Slade 23. Nowell

I think there’s sense in keeping the same front row. Moon has done well and it’s worth continuing to build his experience. I like Hepburn, but I think he offers some similar qualities to Mako and Genge without being quite as good. As a hard working, set-piece prop, he’s more of a direct replacement for Marler. Sinckler has probably had his best two performances for England, so I’d like to see if he can sustain that form.

Lawes and Ewels have had good cameos off the bench so I’d start both and have Itoje covering lock/blindside from the bench ahead of Shields.

Wilson definitely deserves to be retained and I’d switch him to 6 to bring Mercer in at 8. This is an ideal opportunity to see what he can do as a starter. If he can build upon the performance he put in from the bench against SA, I’d like to hope he has a fighting chance of usurping Hughes.

In the backs, I’d go for wholesale change. I’d like to see Ford back and I’d pair Lozowski (who should be back from suspension) with Tuilagi. I think two playmakers could really put Tuilagi and Cokanasiga through some holes and I’d keep Ashton in the side to track their runs with Daly also given license to roam.

[Mikey Brown]

I feel like starting George would be a good ide. His fault or not I imagine his confidence will have taken a hit. It would be good to see him alongside the best scrummagers, see how he gets on in the lineout and how Hartley available to shore things up.

[Oakboy]

That all looks pretty sensible so Jones will do something else. I'd expect to see Rhodes in the 23. Is Morgan out for the AIs?

[fivepointer]

This is always quite a tricky selection. On the one hand you want to maintain some continuity and invest in partnerships coming good, while on the other, you need to bring new players in to provide rest and to test for depth.
7/8 changes sounds about right to me.
I would start those guys who've been on the bench like George, Williams, Lawes, Ewels and Mercer. I like the idea of having a look at Cokanasiga and bringing in Lozowski, though that may be from the bench.
If fit, Tuilagi surely has to get some action you would imagine.

[Stom]

I was thinking about this earlier. I'd go with...

Moon
Hartley
Sinckler
Lawes
Kruis
Wilson
Underhill
Mercer
Youngs
Ford
Cokanasiga
Te'o
Slade
May
Daly

George, Hepburn, Williams, Itoje, Shields, Care, Farrell, Tuilagi

[Shiny]

I feel like starting George would be a good ide. His fault or not I imagine his confidence will have taken a hit. It would be good to see him alongside the best scrummagers, see how he gets on in the lineout and how Hartley available to shore things up.

I also like the idea of Hartley coming on for the last 30 minutes to provide his leadership to reduce panicky brainfarts in the last 15 minutes. Also if we chasing a game I would prefer his line out throwing 5 meters from the line with 5 minutes to go.

[Mellsblue]

Wholesale changes for me:
Moon
George
Williams
Lawes
Ewels
Wilson
Underhill
Mercer

Care
Ford
Cockanasiga
Lozowski
Tuilagi
Earle
Daly

LCD
Hepburn
Sinckler (can I bring Thomas in)
Kruis
Hill
Youngs
Slade
Nowell

[Digby]

Moon
George
Williams
Lawes
Ewels
Wilson
Kvesic
Mercer
Youngs
Ford
Nowell
Lozowski
Tuilagi
Cockanasiga
Daly

LCD
Hepburn
Sinckler
Itoje
Curry
Care
Te'o
May

[Mikey Brown]

Anyone else surprised how Moon appears to have just waltzed in out of nowhere and looked completely at home for England? Have I not been paying attention and he's been on the fringes for quite a while? I was under the impression he was consistently second choice to Hepburn.

[Mikey Brown]

Just pondering further on George/Hartley- given that everyone on here (bar probably Oakboy) accept that a good George performance is about 5x more effective than a good Hartley performance it makes a whole lot more sense to start him and have the solid, 5.5/10 guy available if anything goes wrong. I'd probably say the same for LCD/Taylor to be honest if George were to get injured.

I've come to accept Hartley is a good voice to have on the pitch and a good man to have in the squad, his tackling/carrying certainly provides some much needed comic relief too, but I'd think his best use is adding a calm head where it's needed late in the game or shoring up a dodgy set-piece.

I know this is just as pointless as debating a side without Farrell starting, but there you go. Who would be captain? Itoje? He's surely the next biggest twat in the side?

[fivepointer]

Leave Hartley out altogether. Bring in LCD to the bench. Faz can have a rest too. Ford to start with Lozowski covering.
Captain? Easy, Mark Wilson would be a very popular choice.

[Oakboy]

Just pondering further on George/Hartley- given that everyone on here (bar probably Oakboy) accept that a good George performance is about 5x more effective than a good Hartley performance it makes a whole lot more sense to start him and have the solid, 5.5/10 guy available if anything goes wrong. I'd probably say the same for LCD/Taylor to be honest if George were to get injured.

I've come to accept Hartley is a good voice to have on the pitch and a good man to have in the squad, his tackling/carrying certainly provides some much needed comic relief too, but I'd think his best use is adding a calm head where it's needed late in the game or shoring up a dodgy set-piece.

I know this is just as pointless as debating a side without Farrell starting, but there you go. Who would be captain? Itoje? He's surely the next biggest twat in the side?

Ouch, my ears are burning! I've never rated George as highly as everyone else and I've always maintained that the pack as a unit performs better with Hartley there. It may be that George is better around the park but I'm not convinced that is enough to compensate for the reduction in leadership presence and lineout accuracy. I think they are about equal at scrummaging though Hartley is more influential, especually if there has been a set-back or two. Also, there is a double whammy if Farrell is allowed to take over the full decision-making captaincy presence.

[Stom]

Anyone else surprised how Moon appears to have just waltzed in out of nowhere and looked completely at home for England? Have I not been paying attention and he's been on the fringes for quite a while? I was under the impression he was consistently second choice to Hepburn.

I don't think he's been all that. Sure, he's been solid and he'd waltz into the Aussie side, but he has hands of concrete... A good old fashioned prop.

Mako is just better and Genge is a long way ahead outside the set piece.

I'd love to see our props be Mako, Genge, Sinckler and Williams.

[Mellsblue]

Anyone else surprised how Moon appears to have just waltzed in out of nowhere and looked completely at home for England? Have I not been paying attention and he's been on the fringes for quite a while? I was under the impression he was consistently second choice to Hepburn.

he has hands of concrete... A good old fashioned prop.

Ha. His passing is comically bad.

[Puja]

Anyone else surprised how Moon appears to have just waltzed in out of nowhere and looked completely at home for England? Have I not been paying attention and he's been on the fringes for quite a while? I was under the impression he was consistently second choice to Hepburn.

I don't think he's been all that. Sure, he's been solid and he'd waltz into the Aussie side, but he has hands of concrete... A good old fashioned prop.

Mako is just better and Genge is a long way ahead outside the set piece.

I'd love to see our props be Mako, Genge, Sinckler and Williams.

Given that we're missing Mako, Marler, Genge, Mullan, and Obano, he's been pleasantly solid. Not up with the top level, but he's not been a liability and has looked instantly an international, which is nice.

Puja

[Mikey Brown]

I'm not suggesting he displace Vunipola or even Genge, but I was expecting another Tim Payne. Old fashioned yes, but throws himself into contact too.

[padprop]

I always think England have looked better with a traditional, better scrummaging loosehead than looseheads who are dynamite around the park. Just props that tackle, hit alot of rocks and can dominate a tighthead. Our winning streak came with the majority of them starting Marler, and alot of Lancaster's successes came with Corbs starting (Where at that point Marler was a flairy prop that couldn't really scrum!)

I see the appeal of people like Genge and Vunipola, but it never seems that the pack functions as well as with a purist loosehead. The last test against south africa on tour being a prime example.

Of course with Marler gone though, Vunipola has almost definitely got the shirt, but I'd keep Moon in the squad from here on out and have words with Marler around world cup time.

[Digby]

I always think England have looked better with a traditional, better scrummaging loosehead than looseheads who are dynamite around the park. Just props that tackle, hit alot of rocks and can dominate a tighthead. Our winning streak came with the majority of them starting Marler, and alot of Lancaster's successes came with Corbs starting (Where at that point Marler was a flairy prop that couldn't really scrum!)

I see the appeal of people like Genge and Vunipola, but it never seems that the pack functions as well as with a purist loosehead. The last test against south africa on tour being a prime example.

Of course with Marler gone though, Vunipola has almost definitely got the shirt, but I'd keep Moon in the squad from here on out and have words with Marler around world cup time.

This would suggest England looked worse with Trevor Woodman

[padprop]

I always think England have looked better with a traditional, better scrummaging loosehead than looseheads who are dynamite around the park. Just props that tackle, hit alot of rocks and can dominate a tighthead. Our winning streak came with the majority of them starting Marler, and alot of Lancaster's successes came with Corbs starting (Where at that point Marler was a flairy prop that couldn't really scrum!)

I see the appeal of people like Genge and Vunipola, but it never seems that the pack functions as well as with a purist loosehead. The last test against south africa on tour being a prime example.

Of course with Marler gone though, Vunipola has almost definitely got the shirt, but I'd keep Moon in the squad from here on out and have words with Marler around world cup time.

This would suggest England looked worse with Trevor Woodman

Maybe I should have been more specific with my wording, but I think the dynamics of that team were a little bit different from 2012-2018 England.

A bit before my time but I can only assume that Woodman could also dominate a scrum, but could also be effective around the field aswell.

[Scrumhead]

Prior to his injury, Genge’s scrummaging was definitely improving. He’d be my preferred choice for the 17 shirt when he’s fit, but Moon has proved to be a decent addition.

As much as we’ve talked-up Obano, he hasn’t actually played any test rugby and really only had one good season for Bath so far.

[Rich]

Moon
Hartley
Williams
Ewels
Kruis
Wilson
Underhill
Shields

Youngs
Farrell

Cockanasiga
Te'o
Tuilagi
Ashton

Daly

LCD
Hepburn
Sinckler
Itoje
Mercer
Care
Lozowski
May

[Lizard]

Any little niggly worries about this one? After all Japan scored 5 tries against a (weakened) All Blacks team just a couple of weeks ago. They’ve had a week off to travel and refresh, and could be keen to show ex-Boss Jones a thing or two. There seems a risk that after a narrow win v SA, and a near-run thing v NZ that your lads will already be looking ahead to an Aussie team that was pretty dire in Cardiff and not focussing on the task at hand.

I’m not necessarily backing Japan to win in their first test at Twickenham since 1986 (and first against a full England test side*) but they need to be taken seriously.

*Japan awarded caps at Twickenham v England U23s in 1973 and 1976, and v an uncapped England XV in 1986. They lost all three.

[Puja]

Any little niggly worries about this one? After all Japan scored 5 tries against a (weakened) All Blacks team just a couple of weeks ago. They’ve had a week off to travel and refresh, and could be keen to show ex-Boss Jones a thing or two. There seems a risk that after a narrow win v SA, and a near-run thing v NZ that your lads will already be looking ahead to an Aussie team that was pretty dire in Cardiff and not focussing on the task at hand.

I’m not necessarily backing Japan to win in their first test at Twickenham since 1986 (and first against a full England test side*) but they need to be taken seriously.

*Japan awarded caps at Twickenham v England U23s in 1973 and 1976, and v an uncapped England XV in 1986. They lost all three.

Not really. The Celts like to whine about our overall playing numbers, ignoring the fact that we can still only put 15 on the pitch at any given time, but in situations like this it does make a difference - our A sides are closer to our 1st XV than any other nation besides New Zealand. We'll have enough in the tank to see them off even with a rotated team, not even taking into account that bringing in Mercer for Shields and Ford for Farrell actually make us a stronger team.

Puja

[WaspInWales]

Would a stellar performance from the backs, or anyone against Japan be likely to result in a change for the Australia test?

What if Loz and Slade/Tuilagi start and have absolute stormers? Every pass, and offload sticks and they have the same psychic link that we were told Ford and Farrell had. I'm sure we'd still see Farrell start at 10 and end at 12 against the Aussies...and if Ford starts, Farrell will start 12 and finish at 10.

I'm expecting Eddie to start Wigglesworth again Japan anyway so expectation is already fairly low.

[Bloggs]

Interestingly (to me at least) the spare, 24th man on Saturday was Joe Marchant. Not sure if that gives him a head start for playing against japan at all