RugbyRebels

Lawes is out of the 6N with a calf injury so a forced change for the match in London in 2 weeks.
Surely a chance for EJ to give a few established squad players some much needed game time, without disrespecting Italy too much.
The title is still up for grabs and BP's may decide it.
If Faz gets a rest, i'd like to see Curry as captain.
He appears to have the attributes.

I'll be very annoyed if Genge doesn't start the remaining games. I've been longing for a Genge and Sinckler pairing for ages

I’d like to see the following lineup:

1. Genge
2. George
3. Sinckler
4. Itoje
5. Kruis
6. Wilson
7. Curry
8. Vunipola
9. Robson
10. Ford
11. Cokanasiga
12. Tuilagi
13. Slade
14. Nowell
15. Daly

16. Cowan-Dickie 17. Moon 18. Williams 19. Launchbury 20. Clifford 21. Youngs 22. Farrell 23. Ashton

IMO, that’s a good balance of giving the less experienced guys a shot without a crazy amount of rotation. No chance of Farrell being rested though.

Scrumhead wrote:I’d like to see the following lineup:

1. Genge
2. George
3. Sinckler
4. Itoje
5. Kruis
6. Wilson
7. Curry
8. Vunipola
9. Robson
10. Ford
11. Cokanasiga
12. Tuilagi
13. Slade
14. Nowell
15. Daly

16. Cowan-Dickie 17. Moon 18. Williams 19. Launchbury 20. Clifford 21. Youngs 22. Farrell 23. Ashton

IMO, that’s a good balance of giving the less experienced guys a shot without a crazy amount of rotation. No chance of Farrell being rested though.

I’d be happy with that, although I would potentially give one of the backrowers the week off, as they’ve each got through a mountain of work.

I think this game is a chance to do two things:

1) Give the players who have not played much a chance to stake their claim.
2) Try combinations that have not had a run out.

So I would keep disruption to a minimum with:

Genge
George
Sinckler
Launch
Kruis
Wilson
Curry
Billy
Robson
Farrell
Cokanasiga
Tuilagi
Slade
Nowell
Daly

LCD, Moon, Williams, Itoje, Clifford, Youngs, Ford, Thorley

I'd be tempted to give Nowell a go at fullback for Italy. He looked good there for Exeter shortly before the tournament, and I think may do a better job there than Daly.

Definitely start Genge, Robson and Cokanasiga. Launch will come into the 2nd row. I'd like Clifford on the bench.
I'd leave everything else alone, accepting that Farrell wont be dropped so Ford starting isnt going to happen.

Genge and Robson are obviously the priorities to get some game time. I’d reintroduce Maro from the bench if fit, Launch hasn’t massively impressed but I’d like to take a closer look and to see him paired with Kruis.

Cokanisiga in. I wouldn’t mind be bench spot personally.

Obviously I think Ford should play, but the consensus seems to be it wouldn’t even matter how well he played, he can no longer challenge for the starting spot.

I was hopeful of Clifford getting a shot but I don’t think he will, poor Brad didn’t get many minutes and he’s come all the way over from New Zealand to play for us. The least we can do is give him some time against Italy.

What is the point of continuing with Tuilagi and Slade unless we change our tactics? I think they make our best centre pairing but I want them to get the fricking ball occasionally. IMO, that means starting Robson and Ford and letting the four of them just play.

Mikey Brown wrote:Genge and Robson are obviously the priorities to get some game time. I’d reintroduce Maro from the bench if fit, Launch hasn’t massively impressed but I’d like to take a closer look and to see him paired with Kruis.

Cokanisiga in. I wouldn’t mind be bench spot personally.

Obviously I think Ford should play, but the consensus seems to be it wouldn’t even matter how well he played, he can no longer challenge for the starting spot.

I was hopeful of Clifford getting a shot but I don’t think he will, poor Brad didn’t get many minutes and he’s come all the way over from New Zealand to play for us. The least we can do is give him some time against Italy.

Er, bollocks to 'poor Brad'.

I'd want to reinstate Ford/Farrell myself. We looked really dangerous when we had it and have been toothless ever since it's been dissassembled. Plus we should be using Manu in his correct position of 13 to get the best out of him.

Also, Daly needs to be dropped. He isn't a full-back, at all, and some nice attacking moments against Ireland and France can't disguise that he's an utter liability in the backfield. I don't even know if we should shove Nowell in there and hope that he can cope or revert to Brown.

Puja

Moon (would be Genge but LCD needs a start and he need familiarity)
LCD
Williams
Itoje
Kruis
Wilson
Curry
Clifford
Robson
Ford
Cokanasiga
Farrell
Tuilagi
May
Daly

George
Genge
Sinckler
Williams
Launch
Care
Slade
Nowell

Same team to start as against Wales, except for Courtney. Giving the boys a chance to make amends...

Genge and Robson to get a combined 6 minutes, when we've got a 20 point lead (it was 30 at the 50 minute mark).

Oakboy wrote:

Mikey Brown wrote:Genge and Robson are obviously the priorities to get some game time. I’d reintroduce Maro from the bench if fit, Launch hasn’t massively impressed but I’d like to take a closer look and to see him paired with Kruis.

Cokanisiga in. I wouldn’t mind be bench spot personally.

Obviously I think Ford should play, but the consensus seems to be it wouldn’t even matter how well he played, he can no longer challenge for the starting spot.

I was hopeful of Clifford getting a shot but I don’t think he will, poor Brad didn’t get many minutes and he’s come all the way over from New Zealand to play for us. The least we can do is give him some time against Italy.

Er, bollocks to 'poor Brad'.

I think he had his tongue so far in cheek it was poking out of another orifice

Agree that Wilson and/or Curry deserve a rest. What's the latest on Underhill?

I’d say Wilson and Curry need as many caps as possible.

Why are we so snowflakey. Any other country would simply drop Youngs and Farrell for playing so badly that it cost us the match. It's hard professional sport. They need to be on the bench or preferably out of the 23.

Why the hell would we want Farrell at 12? Neither Tuilagi nor Slade have had a fair chance to play rugby. At least give them one game outside a new halfback pairing that won't just kick the damned ball away.

Mellsblue wrote:I’d say Wilson and Curry need as many caps as possible.

I'd agree. Leave them to play.

Look, rugby is about combinations, about how you work with your teammates. Curry and Wilson are developing a real understanding of each other, so leave them to do it further. Ditto pretty much the rest of the pack, so don't change it up.

But something needs to give in the backs. Robson needs games, so give him one. May looked out of it, and he's a potent weapon, so give him a rest. If we're wedded to Daly at 15, he needs more time there.

Oakboy wrote:Why are we so snowflakey. Any other country would simply drop Youngs and Farrell for playing so badly that it cost us the match. It's hard professional sport. They need to be on the bench or preferably out of the 23.

Why the hell would we want Farrell at 12? Neither Tuilagi nor Slade have had a fair chance to play rugby. At least give them one game outside a new halfback pairing that won't just kick the damned ball away.

I think part of it is that you know Farrell won’t be dropped. For me, Slade, though ridiculously talented, has not really shown that he demands selection on a permanent basis. I also want Tuilagi at 13, it’s his preferred position and where I think he’s most effective in attack and least headless chicken on defence.

Ford/Farrell poses as many questions as it answers. It’s an option, but not one I think we need to go back to at the moment.

The Farrell-Manu-Slade midfield has shown more than enough in the first 2 games imo to keep them together. We have to build some cohesion, can’t keep blowing the thing up after a bad result. And unlike the solution of moving Tuilagi to 13 to make Ford/Faz viable, with the current midfield we do have decent like-for-like alternatives in Ford, Te’o and Joseph. If we move Manu to 13 and he goes down injured again our midfield goes back to being way too passive and lateral, because Te’o cannot play 13 at international level.

I don’t see the logic in not picking a midfield just because you can’t replicate it if a player is injured. If you think it’s your best, or could be you’re best, then pick it.

Tuilagi has had three games at 12, and Farrell - Slade have had six games with a crash ball 12. Ford - Farrell - Tuilagi may be our best option and it needs a run out at some point.

Our best run of results came with Ford - Farrell - Joseph. Balance wise, Ford - Farrell - Tuilagi is an upgrade. Why wouldn’t you want to give it a go. The grand slam has gone and if we can’t field Ford - Farrell - Tuilagi and beat Italy and Scotland at home then, regards the RWC, it’s all a moot anyway.

Mellsblue wrote:I don’t see the logic in not picking a midfield just because you can’t replicate it if a player is injured. If you think it’s your best, or could be you’re best, then pick it.

Tuilagi has had three games at 12, and Farrell - Slade have had six games with a crash ball 12. Ford - Farrell - Tuilagi may be our best option and it needs a run out at some point.

Our best run of results came with Ford - Farrell - Joseph. Balance wise, Ford - Farrell - Tuilagi is an upgrade. Why wouldn’t you want to give it a go. The grand slam has gone and if we can’t field Ford - Farrell - Tuilagi and beat Italy and Scotland at home then, regards the RWC, it’s all a moot anyway.

I got the sense that (with Farrell at 12) Joseph/Slade at 13 was just a placeholder until Tuilagi or Teo could stay fit, but then as soon as they were available we switched the system. As that Telegraph article highlights quite well, we still seem to be pretty confused about what role we actually want the 12 or 13 doing, and don't seem to be getting the best out of either centre currently. I can't decide if switching it up again would help or not.

I'd love to see this pair given a chance alongside a fly-half with the skill/timing to release them a bit better, but it may be that the shape of our attack just isn't right, regardless of who is at 10.

Mellsblue wrote:I don’t see the logic in not picking a midfield just because you can’t replicate it if a player is injured. If you think it’s your best, or could be you’re best, then pick it.

Tuilagi has had three games at 12, and Farrell - Slade have had six games with a crash ball 12. Ford - Farrell - Tuilagi may be our best option and it needs a run out at some point.

Our best run of results came with Ford - Farrell - Joseph. Balance wise, Ford - Farrell - Tuilagi is an upgrade. Why wouldn’t you want to give it a go. The grand slam has gone and if we can’t field Ford - Farrell - Tuilagi and beat Italy and Scotland at home then, regards the RWC, it’s all a moot anyway.

We are more likely to see Farrell, T'eo and Tuilagi with Jones. As ever, the debate has to slant towards his whims. I think the rest of the squad will know full-well that defeat was down to poor management and execution. To not drop Youngs and Farrell sends out the wrong message. Either of them surviving into the next game with either of Slade or Tuilagi getting dropped is plain barmy, IMO.

Timbo wrote:Ford/Farrell poses as many questions as it answers. It’s an option, but not one I think we need to go back to at the moment.

The Farrell-Manu-Slade midfield has shown more than enough in the first 2 games imo to keep them together. We have to build some cohesion, can’t keep blowing the thing up after a bad result. And unlike the solution of moving Tuilagi to 13 to make Ford/Faz viable, with the current midfield we do have decent like-for-like alternatives in Ford, Te’o and Joseph. If we move Manu to 13 and he goes down injured again our midfield goes back to being way too passive and lateral, because Te’o cannot play 13 at international level.

This. Though I'd like to get to Ford, Manu, JJ.

Totally agree on Teo at 13.

Looks like me and Clifford aren't in the training squad so there goes that dream.



Out of interest what is it Te'o can do at 12 and not at 13? I thought he played most of his rugby there for Leinster.

Mikey Brown wrote:Looks like me and Clifford aren't in the training squad so there goes that dream.



Out of interest what is it Te'o can do at 12 and not at 13? I thought he played most of his rugby there for Leinster.

He's a rotten international defender at 13.