A view from the dark side

[Digby]

Refs that is, not league




I not a big fan of the RugbyPass series but this interview with JP Doyle I quite liked. Though I did watch the whole slightly shocked some of the refs are getting their broncos done under four thirty, that takes some doing. And perhaps the most interesting takeaway was whilst the coaches have designed systems which limit the off the ball work for players the systems in place now stress the refs much more, refs having moved from an avg. distance of 4.5km in a game to sometimes even now breaching 10km in a game

[Banquo]

That's bucking mad

[Digby]

I was trying to estimate how long it'd take me to run a bronco (JP being only a few years younger) and I'm wondering if I could be charitable enough to claim I could go sub 5 minutes, and even that only gets me to around 1k when they'd have finished.

(If anyone hasn't experienced the joy of bronco running it's a series of shuttles, 20m up and back, 40m up and back, 60m up and back, all repeated 5 times)

[Digby]

Although I do (as an armchair pundit) disagree with him about the behaviour of the players towards the ref, I feel that part of game isn't a good look for the sport and the refs should push back more. Though I'd perhaps share their concern the game would not support them.

The petulant behaviour does feed into lower levels of the game and I'm astonished many refs are now willing to give up their time at amateur levels, I'd call off plenty of just u14s and u15s games I've seen

[Banquo]

I was trying to estimate how long it'd take me to run a bronco (JP being only a few years younger) and I'm wondering if I could be charitable enough to claim I could go sub 5 minutes, and even that only gets me to around 1k when they'd have finished.

(If anyone hasn't experienced the joy of bronco running it's a series of shuttles, 20m up and back, 40m up and back, 60m up and back, all repeated 5 times)

we were doing similar in my later coaching days. Hideous.

[Oakboy]

There has been talk from time to time about having two refs. Has it ever been tried?

[Mellsblue]

There has been talk from time to time about having two refs. Has it ever been tried?

McCaw, Dallaglio, Warburton and Johnson were all pretty successful.

[Numbers]

I was trying to estimate how long it'd take me to run a bronco (JP being only a few years younger) and I'm wondering if I could be charitable enough to claim I could go sub 5 minutes, and even that only gets me to around 1k when they'd have finished.

(If anyone hasn't experienced the joy of bronco running it's a series of shuttles, 20m up and back, 40m up and back, 60m up and back, all repeated 5 times)

I believe the Americans call these suicides, brutal training.

Regarding J P Doyle I would have thought it would have been better to interview a good ref, Doyle is much more susceptible to player abuse with the decisions he makes, tho I don't condone those actions.

[fivepointer]

JP's a good guy and a good ref.

The modern elite game is fiendishly hard to ref, not least due to the exacting fitness requirements.

As far as a bronco is concerned, i think i could manage one in under 5 minutes....

[Digby]

JP's a good guy and a good ref.

The modern elite game is fiendishly hard to ref, not least due to the exacting fitness requirements.

As far as a bronco is concerned, i think i could manage one in under 5 minutes....

Good for you. I was out for a run on Monday and came back limping with a tight thigh muscle, something always seems to twang if I try to run at a sensible pace these days, that allied to bad knees, bad ankles and bad levels of fitness has me thinking maybe I'd get close but I'd have little confidence I could do it, a sad indictment on the passing of time from those days when one might merely have asked no problem, how many do you want me to do?

But I do know I'll be giving it a whirl, worst case some muscles and ligaments snap or I drop from a heart attack, it does just feel like a challenge now though so some minor risks seem acceptable.

[fivepointer]

When i say one in under 5 minutes i mean one circuit of 20, 40 and 60M shuttles. And even that might be a stretch.

[Doorzetbornandbred]

There has been talk from time to time about having two refs. Has it ever been tried?

McCaw, Dallaglio, Warburton and Johnson were all pretty successful.

Now Mells I cant believe you missed out Fitzy who could referee a game lying under a pile of flailing boots on the wrong side of a ruck. He took it to levels not seen before or since!

[Puja]

Regarding J P Doyle I would have thought it would have been better to interview a good ref, Doyle is much more susceptible to player abuse with the decisions he makes, tho I don't condone those actions.

I actually quite like JP Doyle as a ref. I wouldn't say he was up in the Wayne Barnes sort of level, but he's a perfectly good ref in my mind.

Puja

[Digby]

When i say one in under 5 minutes i mean one circuit of 20, 40 and 60M shuttles. And even that might be a stretch.

Hah, I was actually quite impressed you'd kept in good nick.

On the interview I thought Doyle had some interesting takes on his role, different perhaps to how I'd think about the game but certainly interesting.

[Digby]

Not to say I was bullshitting myself in thinking I could get a test done in 5 minutes, but having just read this I'm less confident than I was:

"the legendary Kiwi Richie McCaw recently managed a personal best in the Bronco fitness test of four minutes, 56 seconds, so you’re going to have to push yourself right to the very limit to break the five-minute mark."

There was rather more of McCaw to drag around the test, but still

[p/d]

Doyle confirmed what I have long thought about Brad

[Digby]

Doyle confirmed what I have long thought about Brad

He's rated by people who don't know their rugby?

[Epaminondas Pules]

5 minutes 21.92 seconds. Bloody impressed with that considering how terribly unfit I am!

[Digby]

Fair play, Ive had 3 cracks at it, one a bad fail, one where I flat out cheated and had a couple of rests with the timer off (and still only just got under 5 minutes), and the last where I managed to go under 5 minutes but did that run as a series of 30m up and down which is much, much easier.

I cannot decide if I want to slow, dot a foot on the line, turn and accelerate or loop the turns more. Right now I'm like Vizzini with lots of clear reasons why I don't want to choose either option.

[Epaminondas Pules]

Fair play, Ive had 3 cracks at it, one a bad fail, one where I flat out cheated and had a couple of rests with the timer off (and still only just got under 5 minutes), and the last where I managed to go under 5 minutes but did that run as a series of 30m up and down which is much, much easier.

I cannot decide if I want to slow, dot a foot on the line, turn and accelerate or loop the turns more. Right now I'm like Vizzini with lots of clear reasons why I don't want to choose either option.

I'm trying to do the ice type slide into the marker and failing miserably, so end up turning like an oil tanker!

[Digby]

Fair play, Ive had 3 cracks at it, one a bad fail, one where I flat out cheated and had a couple of rests with the timer off (and still only just got under 5 minutes), and the last where I managed to go under 5 minutes but did that run as a series of 30m up and down which is much, much easier.

I cannot decide if I want to slow, dot a foot on the line, turn and accelerate or loop the turns more. Right now I'm like Vizzini with lots of clear reasons why I don't want to choose either option.

I'm trying to do the ice type slide into the marker and failing miserably, so end up turning like an oil tanker!

I've tried it on an actual athletics track, and I'm not sliding on that, and also on a golfing tee, and whilst I'm pretty confident they wouldn't be thrilled I'm running on it that's not doing much, whereas sliding on it might just be taking it too far. It is quite a long tee with he various tee off points for actual golfers and for people so short off the tee they shouldn't be playing, though the 60m shuttle does take one off the far end into the light scrub before the fairway, I could just run on the fairway but the tee is nicely watered and is an easier running surface for my knackered knees

If you are doing the slide you're surely adding a lot to your lactic acid build up and forcing your leg muscles to then use said lactic acid, which is probably adding to your time, though it's a better/harder cardio workout

[Gloskarlos]

Whole of the U13’s squad and all coaches did our baseline bronco this morning. Very happy with 5:06 at my ripe age . Much more impressive, one of our players got 4:42. Quite amazing.

[Epaminondas Pules]

Whole of the U13’s squad and all coaches did our baseline bronco this morning. Very happy with 5:06 at my ripe age . Much more impressive, one of our players got 4:42. Quite amazing.

That's cracking; on both counts.

[Gloskarlos]

Whole of the U13’s squad and all coaches did our baseline bronco this morning. Very happy with 5:06 at my ripe age . Much more impressive, one of our players got 4:42. Quite amazing.

That's cracking; on both counts.

Thanks! I was actually running with the kid who got 4:42, he’s a great cross country runner. I kept with him for the first 40% of said bronco, but then he showed me up for the old man I am. Nearly half the squad were under 6 mins which was quite pleasing, not as inactive over the last few months as I thought they might have been. Planning to run them every fortnight to monitor progress, can’t really find much on line about how regularly to do this sort of thing with this age group, I reckon fortnightly is about right, any other opinions or experiences?

[Puja]

I could do 5:06, no problem!

We're talking hours here, right?

Puja