RugbyRebels

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/57075751

Not because it was a stupid bit of branding that nobody asked for or wanted, nor falling to my personal stubborn refusal to refer to them as anything but "England A", but because it's not inclusive. Which I believe the denizens of this board pointed out back in 2006, albeit in a sarcastic fashion about whether people would have to prove their Saxon heritage like the NZ Maori do.

To be honest, I'd say the name of the England A side is quite a long way down the list of "things that the RFU could do to help diversity", but I suppose we should give them some credit for at least trying, and their flailing attempts to placate Ugo Monye have at least returned a little bit of dignity by accident.

Puja

Changing from 'A' to Saxons was a gimmick. Changing back really matters very little.

Reinstating the 'shadow' 6N might be more worthwhile whatever the label.

Oakboy wrote:Changing from 'A' to Saxons was a gimmick. Changing back really matters very little.

Reinstating the 'shadow' 6N might be more worthwhile whatever the label.

Premiership would never sign up to that.

Raggs wrote:

Oakboy wrote:Changing from 'A' to Saxons was a gimmick. Changing back really matters very little.

Reinstating the 'shadow' 6N might be more worthwhile whatever the label.

Premiership would never sign up to that.

True, more's the pity! I used to enjoy the Friday night games. How long ago was it?

"A" is better than "Saxons", but its still a silly name for what is obviously the B team or 2nd XV. It's certainly better than "Junior" as adopted by the NZRU for its 2nd XV but at least they have the good grace to never actually select a squad or arrange any matches, preferring to use the Maori team instead.

This all part of the same silly marketing brandwank that thinks by calling a league the "Championship" we won't notice that in fact its the 2nd division.

EDIT: In fact. I've just seen that, alone amongst the 25 "High Performance Unions", NZ has not nominated a Next Senior National team for 2021 to World Rugby for eligibility capturing purposes.

Lizard wrote:"A" is better than "Saxons", but its still a silly name for what is obviously the B team or 2nd XV. It's certainly better than "Junior" as adopted by the NZRU for its 2nd XV but at least they have the good grace to never actually select a squad or arrange any matches, preferring to use the Maori team instead.

This all part of the same silly marketing brandwank that thinks by calling a league the "Championship" we won't notice that in fact its the 2nd division.

EDIT: In fact. I've just seen that, alone amongst the 25 "High Performance Unions", NZ has not nominated a Next Senior National team for 2021 to World Rugby for eligibility capturing purposes.

Even sticking ‘The Rugby’ in front of it hasn’t stopped people noticing.

Mellsblue wrote:

Lizard wrote:"A" is better than "Saxons", but its still a silly name for what is obviously the B team or 2nd XV. It's certainly better than "Junior" as adopted by the NZRU for its 2nd XV but at least they have the good grace to never actually select a squad or arrange any matches, preferring to use the Maori team instead.

This all part of the same silly marketing brandwank that thinks by calling a league the "Championship" we won't notice that in fact its the 2nd division.

EDIT: In fact. I've just seen that, alone amongst the 25 "High Performance Unions", NZ has not nominated a Next Senior National team for 2021 to World Rugby for eligibility capturing purposes.

Even sticking ‘The Rugby’ in front of it hasn’t stopped people noticing.

I see what you did there.

But yeah, that’s a stupid name, too. No argument from me.

Puja wrote:https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/57075751

Not because it was a stupid bit of branding that nobody asked for or wanted, nor falling to my personal stubborn refusal to refer to them as anything but "England A", but because it's not inclusive. Which I believe the denizens of this board pointed out back in 2006, albeit in a sarcastic fashion about whether people would have to prove their Saxon heritage like the NZ Maori do.

To be honest, I'd say the name of the England A side is quite a long way down the list of "things that the RFU could do to help diversity", but I suppose we should give them some credit for at least trying, and their flailing attempts to placate Ugo Monye have at least returned a little bit of dignity by accident.

Puja

Wonderful post. Agree with all points.

Calling a side England isn't inclusive, it's rather in the nature of competing sports between nations that we exclude. I did think the rebranding as the Saxons not useful and indeed a waste of time and money to begin with, so I could be grateful on that front, but this perhaps only sets them up to be known as the Dyson England A side or something similarly stupid in future

Lizard wrote:"A" is better than "Saxons", but its still a silly name for what is obviously the B team or 2nd XV. It's certainly better than "Junior" as adopted by the NZRU for its 2nd XV but at least they have the good grace to never actually select a squad or arrange any matches, preferring to use the Maori team instead.

Arguably the current leading example of exclusionary selection principles

Oakboy wrote:

Raggs wrote:

Oakboy wrote:Changing from 'A' to Saxons was a gimmick. Changing back really matters very little.

Reinstating the 'shadow' 6N might be more worthwhile whatever the label.

Premiership would never sign up to that.

True, more's the pity! I used to enjoy the Friday night games. How long ago was it?

Must be over 10 years or so. If memory serves, it wasn't the Prem that killed it but the Welsh, Scots, and French withdrawing on money grounds. Can't see it returning now - the Prem has expanded to fill the available space and the Celts would be down about 10 international players if England had run a regular A side over the last decade.

Lizard wrote:This all part of the same silly marketing brandwank that thinks by calling a league the "Championship" we won't notice that in fact its the 2nd division.

In fairness, it was blatantly piggybacking off the English football structure, where the top two divisions are the Premiership and Championship.

Puja

Digby wrote:Calling a side England isn't inclusive, it's rather in the nature of competing sports between nations that we exclude. I did think the rebranding as the Saxons not useful and indeed a waste of time and money to begin with, so I could be grateful on that front, but this perhaps only sets them up to be known as the Dyson England A side or something similarly stupid in future

Worryingly you're probably right. Doesn't BMW sponsor the youth team jerseys? Will we be left in the ridiculous position of replacing the Saxons with a non-British multinational taking up the naming rights?

BMW was a while back, I think it's Mitsubishi now. Though that doesn't concern me, it's in the nature of multinationals to have a presence in a number of countries

Puja wrote:

Lizard wrote:This all part of the same silly marketing brandwank that thinks by calling a league the "Championship" we won't notice that in fact its the 2nd division.

In fairness, it was blatantly piggybacking off the English football structure, where the top two divisions are the Premiership and Championship.

Puja

Prexactly. It wasn’t clever and it wasn’t even new. NZRU ha done the same stupid thing with the Mitre 10 Cup (which at least has the decency to be sponsored by a hardware store chain).

Well you learn something new every day, I'd simply been assuming it was linked to