The Haka

[UKHamlet]

AC Milan show how it should be done...

[rowan]

The evolution of the haka in the pro era has been somewhat bewildering. It was never intended to be intimidating in the amateur era, and if you look back at the old black and white reels it bears more resemblance to an aerobics warm-up routine than the current made-for-TV variety of haka. Of course, it was the professional age which brought this all about. Gotta sell the game and everyone loves the haka. I think Buck Shelford can be credited with instigating the metamorphosis. His hakas used to send a chill down my spine. Incidentally, the traditional 'Ka Mate' haka was a celebration dance, composed by the legendary Toa chief Te Rauparaha after he had escaped his enemies. It certainly wasn't designed to intimidate anyone. Now the All Blacks have their own stylized haka, of course, just like they have their own stylized fern.

[morepork]

This threads about as interesting as a Welsh backline.

[rowan]

Doesn't stop you watching Welsh rugby though, does it

[Len]

This threads about as interesting as a Welsh backline.

But somehow less creative?

How many times have we done this?

[Len]

Doesn't stop you watching Welsh rugby though, does it

Nothing better than watching a train wreck.

[Mikey Brown]

I thought from the still on the video it was a football team doing a Haka, in place of a wall, as a defence to a free kick. That, I'd be curious to see.

[UGagain]

All folk dancing should be banned from rugby matches.

[J Dory]

Hammy you've gone and shot your haka load prematurely. June, the tests are in June.

[J Dory]

All folk dancing should be banned from rugby matches.

You just worry about not getting whitewashed by the poms.

[Digby]

I don't got a bundle on any haka at the rugby other than ka mate, but I've no problem with it staying in the game. What I do find absurd is the ruling of a few years now that everyone has to line up and watch, and be stood a certain distance back and not advance, it just feels like protectionist nonsense (which I'm always disposed to mock) for something which didn't need any protecting.

I think it'd be better of people stood to watch the haka, but if they want to go off and do something else as did Campo then that's their call for me.

[J Dory]

I don't got a bundle on any haka at the rugby other than ka mate, but I've no problem with it staying in the game. What I do find absurd is the ruling of a few years now that everyone has to line up and watch, and be stood a certain distance back and not advance, it just feels like protectionist nonsense (which I'm always disposed to mock) for something which didn't need any protecting.

I think it'd be better of people stood to watch the haka, but if they want to go off and do something else as did Campo then that's their call for me.

Pretty disrespectful, racist even.

[rowan]

Pretty disrespectful, racist even.

Disagree. Already pointed out this is not an authentic haka. The authentic haka was not designed to intimidate, and nobody was ever forced to stand and watch authentic hakas in Maori culture anyway.

[Spy]

Fortunately we've moved on from such unenlightened times. Failure to properly respect the haka is a blight on the game, and must be stamped out. In fact, I'd like to see a series of graded bans introduced for improper haka observation. It's something World Rugby should be looking hard at.

[cashead]

Pretty disrespectful, racist even.

Disagree. Already pointed out this is not an authentic haka. The authentic haka was not designed to intimidate, and nobody was ever forced to stand and watch authentic hakas in Maori culture anyway.

There are, and were, various haka designed for a variety of occasions, including those designed to intimidate, and there are and were occasions where it was basically good manners to stand and watch an authentic haka, like at a powhiri for some big cheese from another iwi, or a tangi to celebrate the life of, and provide a proper sending off to the dearly departed.

Besides, the Ka Mate haka is about as OG as it gets in regards to hakas.

[rowan]

Of course there are many types of haka for an extensive variety of occasions. Just like Europeans have many types of dances. But do Europeans expect others to stand to attention while they perform the Waltz or the Polka? What if they decided to transform those dances into fearsome, elbow-slapping, foot-stomping peformances, all the while pulling faces at the opposition and poking their tongues out at them? How would that go down, I wonder?

[cashead]

Of course there are many types of haka for an extensive variety of occasions. Just like Europeans have many types of dances. But do Europeans expect others to stand to attention while they perform the Waltz or the Polka? What if they decided to transform those dances into fearsome, elbow-slapping, foot-stomping peformances, all the while pulling faces at the opposition and poking their tongues out at them? How would that go down, I wonder?

Welp, looks like we've just seen the most ignorant fucking post on the SH Board to date. "But what if this happens, and then this other thing happens and bwah bwah bwah." Fuck off. Stick your hypotheticals up your cock.

You want to cry about Maori privilege too, while you're at it?

[Lizard]

Of course there are many types of haka for an extensive variety of occasions. Just like Europeans have many types of dances. But do Europeans expect others to stand to attention while they perform the Waltz or the Polka? What if they decided to transform those dances into fearsome, elbow-slapping, foot-stomping peformances, all the while pulling faces at the opposition and poking their tongues out at them? How would that go down, I wonder?

Of course Europeans didn't expect other cultures to stand respectfully and observe European cultural traditions. They didn't even expect those darkies to be allowed into the ballroom or opera house. They were supposed to stand respectfully while being colonised, marginalised, enslaved or shot.

[cashead]

Of course there are many types of haka for an extensive variety of occasions. Just like Europeans have many types of dances. But do Europeans expect others to stand to attention while they perform the Waltz or the Polka? What if they decided to transform those dances into fearsome, elbow-slapping, foot-stomping peformances, all the while pulling faces at the opposition and poking their tongues out at them? How would that go down, I wonder?

Of course Europeans didn't expect other cultures to stand respectfully and observe European cultural traditions. They didn't even expect those darkies to be allowed into the ballroom or opera house. They were supposed to stand respectfully while being colonised, marginalised, enslaved or shot.

Either that or go out of their way to quash the native cultures of their colonies, and expect the colonial subjects to adopt their very European cultural traditions in their place.

[Digby]

I don't got a bundle on any haka at the rugby other than ka mate, but I've no problem with it staying in the game. What I do find absurd is the ruling of a few years now that everyone has to line up and watch, and be stood a certain distance back and not advance, it just feels like protectionist nonsense (which I'm always disposed to mock) for something which didn't need any protecting.

I think it'd be better of people stood to watch the haka, but if they want to go off and do something else as did Campo then that's their call for me.

Pretty disrespectful, racist even.

Perhaps it is disrespectful, but I'm often given to sarcasm and being disrespectful. I'm more than happy to stand respectfully whenever I've been before a Maori tribe and they've wanted to perform such a greeting, I'm just not sure it should be obligatory to stand mute but observant 15m back before a game of rugby, and what was poor form about teams advancing on the haka I don't know. I don't think of the NZ rugby team as a race so it's not racist for me, but people are free to take a different view.

I do think people should stand respectfully for a national anthem from each side, but if one or more of the sides wishes an additional piece of work then whether a dance or with the Irish an extra anthem then watch/listen if you want, but we should also be free to walk away and do whatever to get ready for the game.

[J Dory]

Fortunately we've moved on from such unenlightened times. Failure to properly respect the haka is a blight on the game, and must be stamped out. In fact, I'd like to see a series of graded bans introduced for improper haka observation. It's something World Rugby should be looking hard at.

I heard this will be trialled during the June tests. About time.

[zer0]

Sounds like JD will be feasting on freshly caught fish for dinner tonight.

[rowan]

I have a lot of respect for Maori culture. I have Maori whanau, in fact, and had a hard-backed version of Tangata Whenua shipped to me last year. My sister, whose daughters are part-Maori, has a degree in Maori studies. But the New Zealand rugby team's haka is not authentic Maori culture. It is All Blacks culture designed for marketing. The only reason they want to force people to stand and watch it is that it's good for the TV audiences, who love it. I can relate to that, but I don't agree anyone should be forced to watch it when the All Blacks have deliberately made it as intimidating as possible, and even included a throat-slitting gesture at one stage.

[J Dory]

Does anyone have a link to the ruling by the way? You know, the one that mandates teams have to stand and face the haka. I'm having trouble finding it.

[morepork]

what sort of sick bastard wums his own board?