RugbyRebels

New season, new thread. The squad are back in training today and it’s just been announced that Chris Dean has left the club by “mutual agreement”. He’s 30 but always looks like he’s a fresh-faced 19 year old and you can forget he played his first game in 2015. A solid club player but never likely to play for Scotland, he might be a victim of austerity from on-high, combined with the arrival of Mosese Tuipolotu. Presumably the first choice centres will be Tuipolotu and Currie, backed up by Lang, Bennett and Scott. TBH, I’d rather they released Bennet who is 31 and really hasn’t played very well recently. Unless they can get Healy (or Thompson) to make more of the attacking threat outside 10 though, it probably won’t make much difference.

Sad to see Dean go as I liked him but if he's not in the coaches plans, and last season suggested that he definitely wasn't, then he is the sort of player that we should be looking to move on from and create opportunities in the squad. Hope he picks up a contract elsewhere though, based on the season before last he still has a lot to offer.

Interesting season ahead. We've gone very quickly from exciting but flaky and soft centred to dull as dishwasher and still mostly losing games. We have to show some development in the attacking game or surely changes are coming (again).

I think that this is most of the squad. First thought is that it looks quite old: not a lot of scope in there for drastic development as we mostly know who and what these players are. Feels like a lot of budget invested in a back three that don't really get a chance to do their thing. I also suspect that we're paying quite a lot for a below average front row and that there's a market inefficiency to be realized there.

LHP: Pierre Schoeman (30), Boan Venter (27), Robin hislop (32), Mikey Jones (22)

H: Dave Cherry (33), Patrick Harrison (21), Euan Ashman (24)

THP: Paul Hill (29), Angus Williams (30), javan Sebastian (29), Darcy Rae (29)

Lock: Sam Skinner (29), Grant Gilchrist (33), Jamie Hodgson (26), Glen Young (29), Marshall Sykes (24), Rob Carmichael (20)

Flankers: Hamish Watson (32), Jamie Ritchie (27), Luke Crosbie (27), Connor Boyle (24), Tom Dodd (26)

8: Ben Muncaster (22), Magnus Bradbury (28)

SH: Charlie Shiel (26), Ben Vellacott (29), Ali Price (31)

FH: Ben Healy (24), cammy scott (22), Ross Thomson (25)

C: James Lang (29), Mark Bennett (31), Matt Currie (23), Mosese Tuipolotu (23)

Back 3: Duhan VDW (29), Darcy Graham (26), Emiliano Boffelli (29), Wes Goosen (28), Harry Patterson (22), Nathan Sweeney (23), Jacob Henry (23) - loan to Coventry 25/26, Ross McCann (26)

I’m not sure it’s a good thing that Edinburgh are back in pre-season training (don’t know about Glasgow) before the previous season has ended. When the Scotland summer tour was being organised I suspect Scotland management didn’t expect Glasgow to do so well in the URC. I’m guessing that the Edinburgh players picked here will not be available for the early games of the URC (which is brutal for Edinburgh). Leinster at the Hive, away in South Africa to the Bulls and Lions then the Stormers back in Edinburgh.

switchskier wrote: ↑Wed Jul 24, 2024 11:48 pm I think that this is most of the squad. First thought is that it looks quite old: not a lot of scope in there for drastic development as we mostly know who and what these players are. Feels like a lot of budget invested in a back three that don't really get a chance to do their thing. I also suspect that we're paying quite a lot for a below average front row and that there's a market inefficiency to be realized there.

Given a free hand although I'm not a fan of the Cockerill school of management but there are a number, especially forwards, who either need to be moved on PDQ or have a rocket fired up their proverbial. A
Schoeman and Skinner are in the latter category - neither performing anywhere close to their ability. Ashman close behind, ditto Sykes. Cherry needs to go. Not been the same since sent home in apparent disgrace and will be 34 this season. Harrison is and has been ready to step up. At tight head, yes not inspiring. Sebastian is ok, Rae can scrummage if not a lot else. Hill -we'll see, not at all convinced he is good enough, Williams simply isn't.
At lock, besides the underperforming Skinner we have the very average Hodgson and the worse Young, plus the aging Gilchrist although I'd keep him another year Back row is so odd. Bar Watson (another coat sadly on a shoogly nail for me) none are as you say that old, and only Muncaster could be nearly classed as youngish. If Boyle and Dodd aren't breaking in then they need to move on, and I don't understand bringing Bradbury back from either an Edinburgh or Scotland pov

And how to replace these guys and push the rest? Edinburgh have a raft of excellent U20s coming through. The Blythe-Lafferty bros, McVie, McConnell, Douglas all look top drawer and ready for at least some pro rugby, maybe a lot. Maybe a couple of others as well If Edinburgh don't bring them in they may lose them elsewhere - these guys are that good

Time to have a clear out was now, and cut costs as well (which is going to have to happen)

I pretty much agree with all of that. Watson has been a great servant of Edinburgh and Scotland but his time is up and I’m afraid he’s now blocking the position for younger players. Glasgow have been excellent at bringing on young players but the Edinburgh coaching and management staff just don’t seem that interested in developing new talent. There’s a decent load of U20s coming through, let’s give some of them a go.

WTF - Edinburgh have signed Matt Scott for a 3rd time. This is why they released Chris Dean, to free up budget to sign Scott. He was a good player in his time (about 10 years ago) but why are they signing a 33 year old who is undoubtedly past his best?

BaldiePete wrote: ↑Fri Aug 02, 2024 9:43 am WTF - Edinburgh have signed Matt Scott for a 3rd time. This is why they released Chris Dean, to free up budget to sign Scott. He was a good player in his time (about 10 years ago) but why are they signing a 33 year old who is undoubtedly past his best?

He is still better than Dean. As always it depends on the Ts + Cs. From all the press around it, it seems to be a mentor/coaching role which does make some sense if he is behind Tuipulotu and Currie in the pecking order and the value is low enough. There are two young and inexperienced centres and three in the expanded academy.

If he can spend a year as a back up and help bring on the five younger centres it will add long term value to Edinburgh if the salary is right.

If he starts blocking game time for Tuipulotu and Currie then it is an issue. Not fussed if Lang gets blocked. Giving him two more years was very questionable.

Anyone got a feeling of how Edinburgh will go this year?

You would think that having Graham back will add some more spark and hopefully there will be fewer back three injuries all round. Otherwise, I'd be keem to see Thompson usurp Healy but not because I think he is the answer to their problems really. Other than that, the hope is that the coaching team has had more time to settle in a get some better attacking plans.

Edinburgh should be so much better than their results. Last season Edinburgh got 11 wins but only 3 try bonus points which complete screwed them for getting into the playoffs. That’s only 2 less wins than the top 4 teams got but a dreadful attack left them in 10th place in the league. They scored 47 tries, 12th out of 16 and conceded 52, 7th out of 16. It’s plain to me that it’s attack that’s the problem. There were a lot of problems with injuries in the backs so there was a lot of chopping and changing which never helps continuity. I’d hope having Darcy back would help but they have to have a system which can get the ball to him. Same problem with DVDM, last year they were unable to get the ball to him in any sort of space.

Different teams for each half in Edinburgh’s only warm up match, against Gloucester on Friday night. The first half team looks strongest but I really worry about tighthead. I know nothing at all about Paul Hill except that he got a handful of England caps a few years ago.

BaldiePete wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2024 9:12 pm Different teams for each half in Edinburgh’s only warm up match, against Gloucester on Friday night. The first half team looks strongest but I really worry about tighthead. I know nothing at all about Paul Hill except that he got a handful of England caps a few years ago.

He was the bright young thing at tighthead back in 2016 - wore the 18 shirt for 5 tests in a row, and was seen as being groomed to be Dan Cole's successor. He was named as the number 3 when people were naming who would be in the England team for RWC 2019. And then he... just stagnated. Kyle Sinckler overtook him for the 18 shirt at England and he just never kicked on from there.

He's a solid player - mobile around the pitch and decent enough at the scrum - but he's not seriously threatened an England comeback since 2016 and hasn't always been Northampton's first choice tighthead over the last few years. There's potential there, but at 29, you have to question if it's going to come out.

Puja

Edinburgh have a potentially very good 18 year old tighthead (Ollie Blyth-Lafferty) in their academy. I suspect a 29 year old like Hill isn’t there for his potential but instead he’s there to hold the fort till Blyth-Lafferty comes through.

BaldiePete wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2024 9:12 pm Different teams for each half in Edinburgh’s only warm up match, against Gloucester on Friday night. The first half team looks strongest but I really worry about tighthead. I know nothing at all about Paul Hill except that he got a handful of England caps a few years ago.

Interesting to see Thompson running with the 1's over Healy. Hope it means we have even a tiny bit of attacking threat. Also Goosen is good but he's no Boffelli.

First game of the URC on Friday, against Leinster. First game is probably the best time to play them, they’ve not selected a load of their internationals but I still can’t see an Edinburgh win. Ashman and Bradbury on the bench with Cherry and Muncaster starting is a surprise. I really want to see how Muncaster does against quality opposition. Hopefully with Thomson at 10 and a new pairing at centre they can get the backs moving but I’d expect Leinster to be typically relentless and win.

Of course I reserve the right to be overjoyed if I’m wrong.

Edinburgh Rugby (versus Leinster Rugby at Hive Stadium on Friday @ 7.35pm): W Goosen; D Graham, M Tuipulotu, M Currie, D van der Merwe; R Thompson, A Price; P Schoeman, D Cherry, P Hill, M Sykes, G Gilchrist, J Ritchie, H Watson, B Muncaster. Subs: E Ashman, B Venter, D Rae, J Hodgson, M Bradbury, B Vellacott, B Healy, E Boffelli.

Leinster: J Osborne; T O’Brien, G Ringrose, C Tector, J Larmour; S Prendergast, J Gibson-Park; M Milne, G McCarthy, T Clarkson, C O’Tighearnaigh, J Ryan, M Deegan, S Penny, J Conan ©. Subs: J McKee, C Healy, R Slimani, B Deeny, J Culhane, L McGrath, R Byrne, R Russell.

Yeah, interesting to see Thompson start. On paper it's a good team, but Leinster are Leinster

Cameo wrote: ↑Thu Sep 19, 2024 7:52 pm Yeah, interesting to see Thompson start. On paper it's a good team, but Leinster are Leinster

Unfortunately the game is played on (artificial) grass not paper.

Puja wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2024 11:29 pm

BaldiePete wrote: ↑Thu Sep 12, 2024 9:12 pm Different teams for each half in Edinburgh’s only warm up match, against Gloucester on Friday night. The first half team looks strongest but I really worry about tighthead. I know nothing at all about Paul Hill except that he got a handful of England caps a few years ago.

He was the bright young thing at tighthead back in 2016 - wore the 18 shirt for 5 tests in a row, and was seen as being groomed to be Dan Cole's successor. He was named as the number 3 when people were naming who would be in the England team for RWC 2019. And then he... just stagnated. Kyle Sinckler overtook him for the 18 shirt at England and he just never kicked on from there.

He's a solid player - mobile around the pitch and decent enough at the scrum - but he's not seriously threatened an England comeback since 2016 and hasn't always been Northampton's first choice tighthead over the last few years. There's potential there, but at 29, you have to question if it's going to come out.

Puja

I remember when he was the bright young thing. Watched hm a few times and just could not see what the fuss was about. Still can't. Wish him well at Edinburgh but he has been a bang average squad player, no more

Cameo wrote: ↑Thu Sep 19, 2024 7:52 pm Yeah, interesting to see Thompson start. On paper it's a good team, but Leinster are Leinster

just read an article where Everitt says Leinster have brought 85% of their first team, so its a good time to play them. There are only 2 or 3 who would definitely start for Leinster in a big game. Everitt is delusional

septic 9 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 10:06 am

Cameo wrote: ↑Thu Sep 19, 2024 7:52 pm Yeah, interesting to see Thompson start. On paper it's a good team, but Leinster are Leinster

just read an article where Everitt says Leinster have brought 85% of their first team, so its a good time to play them. There are only 2 or 3 who would definitely start for Leinster in a big game. Everitt is delusional

Are you sure he didn’t say it was 85% NOT their first team, which is about right.

BaldiePete wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 11:33 am

septic 9 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 10:06 am

Cameo wrote: ↑Thu Sep 19, 2024 7:52 pm Yeah, interesting to see Thompson start. On paper it's a good team, but Leinster are Leinster

just read an article where Everitt says Leinster have brought 85% of their first team, so its a good time to play them. There are only 2 or 3 who would definitely start for Leinster in a big game. Everitt is delusional

Are you sure he didn’t say it was 85% NOT their first team, which is about right.

its a rare thing but his statement was so outrageous I doubted myself so just went back and checked. He said he thought they would bring their strongest team. Now even if he meant strongest available, he clearly knows FA about Leinster and how they operate. Then he said

“I would see it as 85% of their strongest team to Edinburgh"

Its in Scottish Rugby News
https://www.scotlandrugbynews.com/news/ ... rgh-squad/

Everitt is delusional or ignorant or both

septic 9 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 12:32 pm

BaldiePete wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 11:33 am

septic 9 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 10:06 am

just read an article where Everitt says Leinster have brought 85% of their first team, so its a good time to play them. There are only 2 or 3 who would definitely start for Leinster in a big game. Everitt is delusional

Are you sure he didn’t say it was 85% NOT their first team, which is about right.

its a rare thing but his statement was so outrageous I doubted myself so just went back and checked. He said he thought they would bring their strongest team. Now even if he meant strongest available, he clearly knows FA about Leinster and how they operate. Then he said

“I would see it as 85% of their strongest team to Edinburgh"

Its in Scottish Rugby News
https://www.scotlandrugbynews.com/news/ ... rgh-squad/

Everitt is delusional or ignorant or both

The only possible excuse is that he said it before he saw the team that Leinster actually picked.

BaldiePete wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 2:03 pm

septic 9 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 12:32 pm

BaldiePete wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 11:33 am


Are you sure he didn’t say it was 85% NOT their first team, which is about right.

its a rare thing but his statement was so outrageous I doubted myself so just went back and checked. He said he thought they would bring their strongest team. Now even if he meant strongest available, he clearly knows FA about Leinster and how they operate. Then he said

“I would see it as 85% of their strongest team to Edinburgh"

Its in Scottish Rugby News
https://www.scotlandrugbynews.com/news/ ... rgh-squad/

Everitt is delusional or ignorant or both

The only possible excuse is that he said it before he saw the team that Leinster actually picked.

Worrying signs when the head coach is managing expectations before the season even starts

Ross Thomson currently having the debut that Ben Healy must have been hoping for. Price has been bad. Terrible decision making, appalling kicking and slow, slow, slow. However 12-12 at half-time so not all bad.

Looks like quite a game from that scoreline.

Good to hear in Thomson. Price just seems to have lost his way since the Lions?

Mikey Brown wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2024 9:47 pm Looks like quite a game from that scoreline.

Good to hear in Thomson. Price just seems to have lost his way since the Lions?

You’ve misunderstood, I was attempting a joke that Healy would have wanted Thomson to have a poor game and he did. Healy was no better though. It’s a real problem for Edinburgh that they can’t get a 10 who can control a match. Price is a shadow of his former self, Gibson-Park was at 9 for Leinster and he was deservedly man of the match.