RugbyRebels

Big Kev was a deserved All Black, who acquitted himself well against Matfield in his solitary test. The selectors were keen on him, but he was more a victim of the depth in the second-row.

David Hill was a provincial stalwart for the Chiefs and Waikato, and probably would have featured more if he'd been born just 5 years earlier, rather than having a career overlapping one of the all-time greats in DC.

Tom Willis was a deserved All Black in 2002, and his career ended up being derailed by a back injury that saw him lose his place to Keven Mealamu. Middling? Perhaps. One of the worst? Pretty fucking far from it.

Also, Xavier Rush was a fine player, but saw the writing on the wall when Rodney So'oialo secured the 8 jersey in a trio with Collins and McCaw and took the Welsh dollars.

Taumoepeau was an absolutely deserved selection in 2004, and Kevin Senio never really got a chance.

Nate Mauger never played test rugby, BTW.



And Paul Tito throttled Dylan Hartley, which should make him HoF worthy.

cashead wrote:

rowan wrote:

cashead wrote:Kupu Vanisi never played a test, he only played that game against "New Zealand A."

It received test status.

Nope.

http://stats.allblacks.com/asp/profile.asp?ABID=914


The only non-national side that gets test status against the ABs are the Lions.

Not quite.

The All Blacks awarded test caps in the three tests in 1992 against a World XV.

Also, from the end of WWI to 1928, Australian rugby was an even bigger shambles than it is now. Union basically closed down in Queensland leaving NSW, by default, the best team possible from Australia. The All Blacks played 24 uncapped tour matches against NSW in this time. In 1986, the ARU (which didn't even exist until 1949) decided to retrospectively recognise the NSW teams as Australian national sides and award test caps. The NZRU has never bought into this bollocks.

Forgot about those. I can't think of any other occasions where the ABs awarded test caps, but the opposition didn't.

I'm pretty sure that's it. There are plenty of examples of other countries awarding test caps against a non-capped All Blacks touring side or other non-test NZ sides, but that's not a habit we have formed.

I'll do a quick "Stat of the day" on it rather than clog up this thread with my autism.

And I forgot the Pacific Islanders. We capped in that test in 2004.

There are plenty of examples of other countries awarding test caps against a non-capped All Blacks touring side or other non-test NZ sides, but that's not a habit we have formed.

I'll do a quick "Stat of the day" on it rather than clog up this thread with my autism.

Here you go http://rugbyrebels.co/board/viewtopic.p ... 797#p71797

Lizard wrote:And I forgot the Pacific Islanders. We capped in that test in 2004.

Yeah, but they awarded their own test caps too. Sivivatu and Lauaki played their first tests for them, IIRC.

cashead wrote:

Lizard wrote:And I forgot the Pacific Islanders. We capped in that test in 2004.

Yeah, but they awarded their own test caps too. Sivivatu and Lauaki played their first tests for them, IIRC.

So do the Lions, who you mentioned. The original category was "non-national sides" given test status by the All Blacks, then you mentioned "occasions where the ABs awarded test caps, but the opposition didn't." The PIs and Lions are the former (with no others) but not the latter.

I am certain that the only team against whom the All Blacks awarded caps but the oppo did not cap was the 1992 World XV

Lee Stensness gets a tough rap IMO. He added huge creativity in the deciding test against the Lions in 1993, after they shut us down totally (IIRC) in the second test. Not one of the greats, sure, but he had his moments.

Mark Mayerhofler was in my class at Bruce McLaren Intermediate for 2 years. He was a good dude. Even at intermediate age he wasn't the most the most startling player at the school, but he was a smart player and had good commitment. Probably wouldn't have picked him to be an All Black at age 13, but it's a testimony to his ability and work ethic that he got there.

I dunno about these threads. I'd wager any of these maligned players had more rugby talent than all of us keyboard warriors combined. It's no disgrace to be a mediocre All Black. Caleb Ralph always f*cked me off, I suppose.

But Stenseness was the worst tackler since Hewson. I distinctly recall him jumping out of Tana Umaga's way on one occasion - literally. Of course, that was in Super Rugby, not while playing for the ABs. He probably got a tough rap because Harty was doing TV commentaries at the time and kept praising the guy, even lambasted Mains for not picking him one time. Same thing as Mark Carter. Harty's arrogant defense of the player just added fuel to the fire . . .

IMO he made the difference in winning a Lions series. I'd take that as a pretty reasonable achievement.

A lot of players looked entirely different in the national colors. Some exceeded expectations, others flopped, and I guess many an attacking player, such as Stensness, enjoyed the comfortable ride he got behind the All Blacks pack, where as some of the other guys thrown into the engine room weren't quite up to the task of providing that comfortable ride for backs who couldn't tackle. & then you need to look at the guys who played around Stensness - Bunce, Umaga and Wilson, for example. My grandma would've looked good in the middle of that backline!

From the not the next Jonah Lomu after all files:

Remember him .... ?




Me neither

Master Bates . . .

If I remember rightly, Glenn Taylor was a bit of a legend at provincial level but only got selected for the All Blacks initially when Laurie Mains was quite literally running out of back row forwards on the 92 tour of Australia & SA due to a rash of injuries. Practically every first division back row player in the country came into the reckoning at that point, including lightweight 7s specialists Eric Rush & Dallas Seymour. Anyway, that's pre-95, but 'Towers' Taylor did return to the All Blacks in 96, however briefly.

rowan wrote:Just missed the cut. . . mercifully

I think Tito might have been the first player to actually miss selection for the All Blacks on account of downright weirdo looks. But he could always go into an acting career if they decide to make another Batman movie and require a Joker . . .

New nomination for 15:

Nope. McKenzie's fine.

Possibly being developed as a utility back to cover various positions. It wouldn't be the first time the All Blacks have done this with a seemingly mediocre player in that department. That's the only reason for him being there that I can think of. Let's see how long he holds down a place in the starting XV...

Guest wrote:I'm pretty sure that's it. There are plenty of examples of other countries awarding test caps against a non-capped All Blacks touring side or other non-test NZ sides, but that's not a habit we have formed.

I'll do a quick "Stat of the day" on it rather than clog up this thread with my autism.

Zimbabwe, for example, now recognizes Rhodesia's matches as tests, including that famous win over the All Blacks in 49.

NB: I know it's been discussed elsewhere, but I only just stumbled across this post now

rowan wrote:Possibly being developed as a utility back to cover various positions. It wouldn't be the first time the All Blacks have done this with a seemingly mediocre player in that department. That's the only reason for him being there that I can think of. Let's see how long he holds down a place in the starting XV...

McKenzie is only a kid, still on the base of the learing curve and will only get better. He has done well to get capped already. He is brimming with natural talent and gas, and he's a good place kicker too. The only thing that may stand in his way is his small size. I like his attacking instincts - great to see a kid enjoying rugby like that without inhibitions - and hope he has a long AB career. Cullen was not that big either.

Sure, I met Cullen a few times, and he seemed tiny, but actually a very wiry, senewy sort of fellow with amazing upper body strength. & his defensive positioning was much more instinctive than McKenzie's and if Harty had played him in position, 99 might well have been a very different story. McKenzie may improve in this department, but I don't think he's a permanent solution at 15, and he'll never be the player Cullen was.

Hell, did anybody mention this guy? What a shocker!



Oh, that's right. This is supposed to be post 95.