RugbyRebels

Raggs wrote:Since the conversation is on poaching, the last name in the Scotland squad image is rather out of place alphabetically. Suspicions that it was Vellacott and only replaced last minute.

Excellent catch!



Makes sense, given that Fowles is a 9. Hopefully this will see Vellacott in our squad, rather than just on a promise.

Puja

Puja wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:

Puja wrote:
But why? Who would we ever get who's been schooled and in academies and age grade in Wales or Scotland? We never pick up anyone who's lived in Llanelli all their life, but who has an English grandparent; it just doesn't happen.

Puja

Why wouldn’t we pick them up - Brian Redpath is open about the fact he’s more than happy for his son to play for England because that’s where the age group infrastructure and pro money is.
George North is half English and was born in Kings Lynn. My brother-in-law is English but grew up in Wales - people do move in that direction. Granted there’s not many but it’s little money and hassle for the RFU to have scouts nipping over the borders, north and west, to watch school boy players. Top public schools do it why would the cash rich RFU not?

Because the cash rich RFU has more than enough people to look through in England and it would be spending money for very little return? As you said, schools go poaching anyway, so anyone who fancies playing in England can - why bother going hunting when our schools will bring in players anyway?

As for older players, we can't pick anyone playing outside of England anyway, so there's no point in looking for Chris Harrises and Tomas Francises even if we wanted them.

I get your point to Which of not trusting schools and clubs to be 100%, but even with them being rich, they've got a limit. Why spend money on placing someone in another country where there's not many EQP and those that are aren't likely to want to come, when you could use that money to place an extra person in Manchester and stand 10x more chance of finding someone than by stranding them in Scotland. Hell, we don't have a development officer in NZ, which I'd've thought would be a much more prolific hunting ground, so why would we have one in Wales?

Puja

Fair enough. We’re going round in circles and clearly aren’t going to persuade each other.

Edit: I wasn’t citing North as a senior player but as an EQP who went through the Welsh system.

England U20s have called up 26 players ahead of their Six Nations opener against Italy on Friday (2 February).

The squad, who will be led by head coach Steve Bates, assembled at Bisham Abbey National Sports Centre on Sunday ahead of Friday’s match at Stadio Enzo Bearzot, Gorizia, kick off 7pm (6pm GMT).

England include 12 players capped at this level, with nine also part of the squad that reached the final of the World Rugby U20 Championship in Georgia last year.

Bates will be assisted by Anthony Allen, Richard Blaze and James Ponton as part of the coach development programme agreement signed between the RFU and Premiership Rugby.

England U20s:

Backs

Rory Brand (London Irish), Will Butler (Worcester Warriors), Fraser Dingwall (Northampton Saints)*, James Grayson (Northampton Saints), Tom Hardwick (Leicester Tigers)*, Gabriel Ibitoye (Harlequins), Ben Loader (London Irish)*, Jordan Olowofela (Leicester Tigers)*, Tom Parton (London Irish), Ben White (Leicester Tigers)*.

Forwards

Beck Cutting (Worcester Warriors)*, Josh Basham (London Irish)*, Ben Earl (Saracens), Joe Heyes (Leicester Tigers)*, Ted Hill (Worcester Warriors), Dino Lamb (Harlequins) , Sam Lewis (Leicester Tigers)*, Sam Moore (Sale Sharks)*, Joe Morris (Worcester Warriors), Gabriel Oghre (Wasps)*, James Scott (Worcester Warriors)*, Alex Seville (Gloucester), Marcus Street (Exeter Chiefs), Toby Trinder (Northampton Saints)*, Henry Walker (Gloucester), Tom Willis (Wasps)*.

*no previous England U20s appearances

No BCurry, I see. Surely Sale aren't that interested in the AWC?

Puja

England U20 side to face Italy, Six Nations:

*denotes uncapped player

15. Tom Parton (London Irish), 14. Gabriel Ibitoye (Harlequins), 13. Fraser Dingwall (Northampton Saints)*, 12. Will Butler (Worcester Warriors), 11. Ben Loader (London Irish)*, 10. James Grayson (Northampton Saints), 9. Ben White (Leicester Tigers)*, 8. Tom Willis (Wasps)*, 7. Ben Earl (Saracens), 6. Sam Moore (Sale Sharks)*, 5. James Scott (Worcester Warriors)*, 4. Dino Lamb (Harlequins), 3. Marcus Street (Exeter Chiefs), 2. Henry Walker (Gloucester), 1.Toby Trinder (Northampton Saints)*

Replacements

16. Gabriel Oghre (Wasps)*, 17. Alex Seville (Gloucester), 18. Joe Morris (Worcester Warriors), 19. Sam Lewis (Leicester Tigers)*, 20. Josh Basham (London Irish)*, 21. Rory Brand (London Irish), 22. Tom Hardwick (Leicester Tigers)*, 23. Jordan Olowofela (Leicester Tigers)*.

Will these games be streamed/televised some where?

Normally available through world rugby's facebook page and sometimes youtube I believe. May be geo-restrictions in some cases, in which case VPNs obviously help.

An update on Friday night's #ITAvENG U20 match in Gorizia. This will now be streamed live on the Italy Rugby Facebook page - we will of course share this for you on the England Rugby Facebook page. K.O 18:00 GMT. Thanks for your support.

The 2 home games are being covered by Sky.

Good spot. 20 mins until ko.

I tuned in for the last 20 minutes and was bored to tears. No-one accomplished anything of any particular note, aside from one Italian kick to the corner where they both won the lineout and set up a successful drive (this was about their 4th attempt at this tactic and they'd cocked it up every single time) to get a penalty try. There was one brief moment where I thought Ibitoye was going to make a break, but he chucked the ball 20m forwards, presumably to avoid any risk of any kind of excitement.

Hopefully the first 60 minutes had some vague semblence of skill in it, or else I feel for the supporters in the crowd.

Puja

Tbf, I don’t think I’ve ever seen a decent rugby game take place in a swimming pool.

Parton looked very good.

England U20 team to face Wales (fri 7.45pm on Sky)

15. Tom Parton (London Irish), 14. Jordan Olowofela (Leicester Tigers), 13. Fraser Dingwall (Northampton Saints), 12. Cameron Redpath (Sale Sharks), 11. Ben Loader (London Irish), 10. James Grayson (Northampton Saints), 9. Ben White – capt (Leicester Tigers), 1. Toby Trinder (Northampton Saints), 2. Henry Walker (Gloucester), 3. Joe Heyes (Leicester Tigers), 4. Dino Lamb (Harlequins), 5. Sam Lewis (Leicester Tigers), 6. Josh Basham (London Irish), 7. Tom Willis (Wasps), 8. Sam Moore (Sale Sharks).

Replacements
16. Gabriel Oghre (Wasps), 17. Alex Seville (Gloucester), 18. Ehren Painter (Northampton Saints), 19. James Scott (Worcester Warriors), 20. Aaron Hinkley (Gloucester), 21. Rory Brand (London Irish), 22. Tom Hardwick (Leicester Tigers), 23. Matt Williams (London Irish).

A few missing due to club commitments.

Bit of a performance tonight!!!

When you imagine Isiekwe, Curry, Curry Earl etc are available/ missing!!

And boy Redpath is a talent!! Best youngster I’ve seen for a long long while!!!

Could they find any bigger shorts for our replacement 9!!!

Smith missing too.

Grayson, just like his old man, hot and cold

Agree about Redpath, looks top notch

Anyone know if Redpath feels English or if he's more of a Moriarty type?

Thought Ibitoye looked very good, although the try the commentators were enthusing about owed a lot to some very unenthusiastic tackling. He has put on a hell of a lot of bulk though - he was a lanky young thing last year with legs that might snap in a high breeze, but appears to have found the gym and hit it hard in the last 6 months. Hopefully that's not to his long-term detriment.

Puja

Puja wrote:Anyone know if Redpath feels English or if he's more of a Moriarty type?

Puja

His dad is quoted as saying that England are his first choice and was honest enough to say that money played a big part in that decision.

Mellsblue wrote:

Puja wrote:Anyone know if Redpath feels English or if he's more of a Moriarty type?

Puja

His dad is quoted as saying that England are his first choice and was honest enough to say that money played a big part in that decision.

Didn’t catch the game, how did Fraser Dingwall go? His dad might have a different view

Banquo wrote:

Mellsblue wrote:

Puja wrote:Anyone know if Redpath feels English or if he's more of a Moriarty type?

Puja

His dad is quoted as saying that England are his first choice and was honest enough to say that money played a big part in that decision.

Didn’t catch the game, how did Fraser Dingwall go? His dad might have a different view

I didn't watch it either. Fraser is incredibly well educated and he'll make the correct decision, ie keep his England options open until he knows whether he's good enough and if he's not he can play for Scotland! He must be highly thought of as I think he's in a year early.

Mellsblue wrote:

Banquo wrote:

Mellsblue wrote: His dad is quoted as saying that England are his first choice and was honest enough to say that money played a big part in that decision.

Didn’t catch the game, how did Fraser Dingwall go? His dad might have a different view

I didn't watch it either. Fraser is incredibly well educated and he'll make the correct decision, ie keep his England options open until he knows whether he's good enough and if he's not he can play for Scotland! He must be highly thought of as I think he's in a year early.

I will ask his dad next time I see him. He went into the English pathway because the coaching was so good.

Our lads ran a bit hot and cold but did look very good at times.

The centres were fine, but it was in the forwards we really dominated. Heyes is a big unit at THp and was replaced by Painter who looked even bigger! Sam Lewis caught my eye, doing plenty of useful things.

Puja wrote:Anyone know if Redpath feels English or if he's more of a Moriarty type?

Thought Ibitoye looked very good, although the try the commentators were enthusing about owed a lot to some very unenthusiastic tackling. He has put on a hell of a lot of bulk though - he was a lanky young thing last year with legs that might snap in a high breeze, but appears to have found the gym and hit it hard in the last 6 months. Hopefully that's not to his long-term detriment.

Puja

Ibitoye’s not tall enough to have ever been described as ‘lanky’, but you’re right, he’s definitely put on some bulk.

I’m expecting him to be increasingly involved with the first team at Quins. However, he’s only 5’10” on a good day so his height is likely to be a factor in pushing for senior England honours I think.

The defending for his try was poor, but he’s got loads of potential for sure.